giellaleafapmu
Well-known
Dear All,
I hope you won't be bothered about this seemingly strange question about evil DSLR from a friend.
Suppose you had a budged limited to about 2500$, want to buy new gear and are trying to do make the step from amateur cameras to pro cameras.
Would you buy an E-3 with their best lenses (I am not completely sure but I think for the price you can have both the 12-60 and a middle telephoto) or would you go for the FF D-700 with just a 50mm lens (or a 35mm depending on taste)?
In the old times I would have said that the second combination produces far better pictures (also I have the feeling that putting money in four third gear now is a bit of a waste but that is my own taste) and I would have told my friend to go for it but now I am no longer sure because Olympus glasses are among the finest available and having a 24-120 equivalent lens could open a lot of possibilities. Also, I have a E-330 but I never tried the E-3 and I have the D700 so I am a bit partial and clearly ignorant on all the details of the E-3.
I know there are other options like D-300 or Pentax but it seems they have been ruled out and the choice is between super lenses at a bargain price but on a small sensor vs FF sensor with the lens one can afford.
What would you RF guys suggest?
GLF
I hope you won't be bothered about this seemingly strange question about evil DSLR from a friend.
Suppose you had a budged limited to about 2500$, want to buy new gear and are trying to do make the step from amateur cameras to pro cameras.
Would you buy an E-3 with their best lenses (I am not completely sure but I think for the price you can have both the 12-60 and a middle telephoto) or would you go for the FF D-700 with just a 50mm lens (or a 35mm depending on taste)?
In the old times I would have said that the second combination produces far better pictures (also I have the feeling that putting money in four third gear now is a bit of a waste but that is my own taste) and I would have told my friend to go for it but now I am no longer sure because Olympus glasses are among the finest available and having a 24-120 equivalent lens could open a lot of possibilities. Also, I have a E-330 but I never tried the E-3 and I have the D700 so I am a bit partial and clearly ignorant on all the details of the E-3.
I know there are other options like D-300 or Pentax but it seems they have been ruled out and the choice is between super lenses at a bargain price but on a small sensor vs FF sensor with the lens one can afford.
What would you RF guys suggest?
GLF
user237428934
User deletion pending
What does your friend normally do with a camera?
Indoor / High Iso / Portrait / Commercial stuff ?
Wildflife / Nature / Macro ?
That are essential questions that can drive the decision in a certain direction.
Indoor / High Iso / Portrait / Commercial stuff ?
Wildflife / Nature / Macro ?
That are essential questions that can drive the decision in a certain direction.
mfunnell
Shaken, so blurred
Olympus makes good cameras and great lenses. But I can't help but feel that 4/3rds is more of more assistance for long lenses than wide ones. That may be a decision criterion.
For me, if I had no pre-existing committment to a camera/lens system, then the Nikon digital way of the world might be somewhat compelling (D700 for wide or D300s for long, or both).
But as a Canon guy (as far as DSLRs are concerned) I'll also note that an old 5D (the mkI version, not the mkII) plus an appropriate lens choice might give the best "bang for buck" if looking for full-frame. That's sure the way I went (but I have a bunch of Canon lenses.)
The weather sealing and other build-quality factors might favour the E-3 over other choices.
It really comes down to the things your friend values most, versus those they'll let slide (eg. new vs used, long vs wide, assessment of Zuiko vs Nikkor vs Canon glass etc..)
...Mike
For me, if I had no pre-existing committment to a camera/lens system, then the Nikon digital way of the world might be somewhat compelling (D700 for wide or D300s for long, or both).
But as a Canon guy (as far as DSLRs are concerned) I'll also note that an old 5D (the mkI version, not the mkII) plus an appropriate lens choice might give the best "bang for buck" if looking for full-frame. That's sure the way I went (but I have a bunch of Canon lenses.)
The weather sealing and other build-quality factors might favour the E-3 over other choices.
It really comes down to the things your friend values most, versus those they'll let slide (eg. new vs used, long vs wide, assessment of Zuiko vs Nikkor vs Canon glass etc..)
...Mike
giellaleafapmu
Well-known
Events (school graduations), weddings etc, but I think he would also like to start something with products. I am sure both cameras can be perfect for events and none is perfect for products (but perfect cameras for products are waaaaaay up in the price list).
GLF
elshaneo
Panographer
I would recommend instead the new Canon EOS 7D + the Canon EF-S 17-55mm f/2.8 IS USM lens + Canon 430EX Flash. I personally find that this setup is currently the best startup DSLR kit in terms of performance, value and output qualities 
But I'm sure the others will prefer a different setup
But I'm sure the others will prefer a different setup
dimitris
Established
D700 hands down. Then let him get some ultra cheap Ais glass and take glorious photos.
giellaleafapmu
Well-known
I would recommend instead the new Canon EOS 7D + the Canon EF-S 17-55mm f/2.8 IS USM lens + Canon 430EX Flash. I personally find that this setup is currently the best startup DSLR kit in terms of performance, value and output qualities
But I'm sure the others will prefer a different setup
Yep, I know, a lot of other outfits are out there and are great.
I think the attractive of the E-3 was the possibility of having a single lens of high quality covering all from wide to short telephoto and at a low price and for the D700 it was FF plus possibility of using old primes.
GLF
mfunnell
Shaken, so blurred
That is probably an excellent kit. Certainly I much appreciate that lens and the 430EX flash, both of which I use. While I'm quite committed to EOS APS-C DSLRs, I'm less sure about the 7D - but only because it's still a little too early to tell if it is good value or not. I'm currently using the 50D and found that it's 15MP resolution is somewhat problematic. 18MP won't help much, but other things such as advances in sensor technology and, especially in the 7D's case, any improvement (yet to be proved) in AF technology may more than compensate for that. We'll see.I would recommend instead the new Canon EOS 7D + the Canon EF-S 17-55mm f/2.8 IS USM lens + Canon 430EX Flash. I personally find that this setup is currently the best startup DSLR kit in terms of performance, value and output qualities
But I'm sure the others will prefer a different setup
...Mike
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giellaleafapmu
Well-known
That was my first answer (and he has a lot of Ais glasses already, even some exotic super fast lenses from the early 80's!). He was afraid that for events he would need a good zoom covering FF and that send all the budged thing to the sky and that's why the all E-3 story started...
GLF
mfunnell
Shaken, so blurred
Given that piece of info, I'd say he'd be mad to look beyond Nikon and would suggest that the D700 is the best place to look there, unless he does a lot of long telephoto work, in which case the D300
...Mike
IK13
Established
ditto
IMHO - size matters. And this alone, makes the 4/3 (for me), as good as some zuikos are, appropriate only as a second/backup camera system.
majid
Fazal Majid
The D700 is a no-brainer.
Merkin
For the Weekend
if he has around 2500 and needs a good zoom for events, suggest a nikon factory refurb d700 and a used 35-70 f2.8, which is a combination that could be had for about 2600 bucks.
FA Limited
missing in action
I would recommend instead the new Canon EOS 7D + the Canon EF-S 17-55mm f/2.8 IS USM lens + Canon 430EX Flash. I personally find that this setup is currently the best startup DSLR kit in terms of performance, value and output qualities
are the initial signs of the Canon 7D IQ good?
user237428934
User deletion pending
If he already has some lenses it would be nonsens to look for something else. But your friend is right. If you are doing photography on events you sometimes can't walk around as you like and then a zoom is helpful. So with the limited budget he should look for a used camera like suggested before.
samoksner
Who stole my light?
D700 over the E-3 anytime. However, if you have no existing investment in either manufacturer's gear, i would suggest a sony alpha a850. Full frame, 24.5mp, well built and under $2000, that will leave you with some money to get a couple simple primes or a nice third party zoom (tamron 28-75 f2.8 or sigma 24-70 f2.8)
dimitris
Established
For $2500 he can get a low millage D700 ($2000) and 50mm Ais f1.4 ($150), 55mm Ais f3.5 micro ($50), 28mm Ais f2.8 ($200) and 105mm Ais f2.5 ($150). Ok i went $50 over!
mfunnell
Shaken, so blurred
AFAIK, yes. But. The 50D's sensor, at 15MP, is already diffraction-limited in sharpness before f8. The 18MP of the 7D simply can't help there, even if there's an improvement in sensor technology. More precise autofocus, however, might make a real-world practical difference in achieved resolution - and the 7D's autofocus is new and supposedy improved. The camera has a number of other improvements over previous APS-C sensor Canons. I doubt I'll buy one, but I will look on with interest once some proper tests and user reports are out there.
...Mike
Merkin
For the Weekend
I have held one of those sonys, and I don't think they feel particularly good in the hand, and I also take issue with their non-standard flash mount.
dimitris
Established
Same here. I tested the A900 and it felt clunky to say the least. I thought the 5D was bad but the A900 was even worse. The D700 felt the best of it in my hands. Maybe I should sell all my Canon's and move back to the dark side.