Question Diafine: Single use or re-use ?

[raytoei@gmail.com]

Hi,

I bought a pack of Diafine to build 1 Gallon of A and B. I am about to embark on Diafine & Tri-x combination soon. Sorry if my question has been asked before, please point me to the right direction.

Question:

1. Gallon A and Gallon B solution. Do I reuse or use it as a Single use ?

2. Assuming a standard tank where roughly a roll needs about 300ml of solution. Does reuse mean, I pour back the 300ml of Solution A in the Gallon A container. And ditto for Solution B ?

3. Do I have to compensate for the time because of the reuse (like how I am reusing D-76 stock by pouring back after each usage but extending the development team)

4. How do I know when the reuse is overdone ? Do I keep track on the number of rolls ?

thanks

 

[Keith]

It lasts almost indefinitely, or so I've read ... I have a batch and have never mixed it as I gather it gives fairly flat negatives which didn't seem appealing to me.

Apparently the main thing is never let solution B get into solution A ... it kills it. 😀

 

[sahe69]

Yep. A gallon of Diafine will most likely outlast you, i.e. you'll get bored with the developer before it runs out. 🙂

Over some time the solution can develop some small flakes into it - if you observe this, run the liquid through a filter (e.g. coffee filter) and it's fine again.

 

[mfogiel]

You can use the solutions as long as they are viable - in theory indefinitely, in practice a year or so. What is going to happen first, is that you will see solution A depleted over time, because some of it soaks up the emulsion. Also, you should get some coffee filtering bags, and filter the solutions every other development, or so, in order to keep out the dirt.
My main problem with Diafine, has always been streaking, no matter what I tried. Also, the grain is mushy, and acutance not so good, therefore you have to use sharpening in PS, which is something I prefer to avoid if not absolutely necessary. On balance, Diafine is great for compressing extremely high contrast to a usable level, but for this you should rate Tri X at EI 400 or so. As Keith said, be careful never to let even a drop of solution A into solution B, as it would kill it.

 

[Mablo]

Yeah, the stock lasts forever if you can keep the liquids separate (I couldn't...). No need to compensate as far as I know. Expose Tri-X @ 1000 ISO or so to start with.

 

[raytoei@gmail.com]

hi. thanks for all the great comments.

 

[raytoei@gmail.com]

Hi, just an update, I have made the Solution A & B.

I will shoot a roll of tri-x in ei of 100/200/400/800/1600/3200. Split the roll and develop one part in using the box instructions and then half with the rule of thumb advice available on the net.

Box instructions
------------------
No Pre-soak
3 mins in A
3 Mins in B
Drain and stop bath in Water
Fix normally

Other methods
------------------
Pre-soak 4 mins
4 mins in 1+1 Diluted A
4 mins in 1+1 Diluted B
Drain and stop bath in Water
Fix normally

In both methods, I opt not to reuse but to drain it off.

will report back when the results are in...

🙂

raytoei

 

[tonal1]

Just make sure you DO NOT rinse between A and B. Also, do reuse, it's meant to be "seasoned," so it's meant to calm down a bit with use - this will benefit you. You should also start replenishing it at some point; maybe start at around the 20 roll mark. If you use it frequently, and replenish, that stuff really will last so long that you'll eventually toss it out of shear paranoia.

 

[tonal1]

Go with the box instructions with the addition of a one to two minute presoak in water, this to swell the emulsion and even out the processing.

Not to be argumentative, but I really have to disagree. Bath A doesn't really develop the film, there is little need to worry about A causing uneven development. Pre soaking is a problem though because it limits the amount of A that the film can soak up, esp if you follow the instructions of using minimum agitation. You want the film to be saturated with developer, not water, so that the B bath can "accelerate" the A bath that the emulsion has soaked up.

 

[mgd711]

I have to admit I quite like Diafine, its not the best but I find it gives good results.

Both Neopan 1600 at 1600.

 

[venchka]

If you dilute A & B 1+1, you MUST discard the diluted solutions after ONE use. That kinda defeats the purpose of Diafine. You can buy small, 1 quart size, cans of A & B to use to refill your containers as they are depleted.

 

[raytoei@gmail.com]

mgd711,

I like your photos in diafine! Do you have any in day light with/without slower speeds films ? I was expecting "flat" pictures as many users have alluded to. Your pics is consistent with NP1600 photos.

Regarding Diafine not being a favorite developer, I read that quite a lot. Is it because it develops what it wants to develop and the only mainstream variable is ISO ? Or because people are just bored with it.

raytoei

 

[tonal1]

I don't hear you as argumentative, and alternate experience is a welcome plus to any reasonable discussion. 🙂

I find that when I skip the presoak and use the minimum of three minutes I encounter uneven development somewhat similar to bromide drag. If the times, particularly for Dil. A are extended to at least 5 minutes, it is more consistent for me. Still, I prefer the presoak and generally use a standard of 4 minutes for each solution.

Fair enough 🙂

I develop for 5 minutes, in both baths. If you're going to develop to completion, you may as well, well, develop to completion...

I'm curious, esp since you presoak, how much do you personally agitate in the A bath?

Specifically when I use Diafine - though I hate plastic tanks and reels in general - I use one of those generic tanks (like this: http://www.amazon.com/Rokunar-Universal-Film-Developing-Reels/dp/B000NJEX7E ) because they have a little "bump" cam in the bottom that bounces the reel up and down slightly when you "twirl" the little agitation stick back and forth. I like it because it causes a more violent agitation with less actual fluid movement. Maybe I'm just superstitious, but I think it helps to avoid some of the ~bromide drag type problems with Diafine.

 

[mgd711]

Raytoei,

I have a few images online that with Eastman 5222 developed in Diafine...

Both EI400.

I generally rarely shot anything lower than ISO 400 film.

All the images online with Diafine are here... The Fiery Scotsman

At the end off that there is 5 or 6 images from Eastman 5222

 

[tonal1]

I have to admit I quite like Diafine, its not the best but I find it gives good results.

Both Neopan 1600 at 1600.

Yes, I like your results as too. I always wanted to try Neopan 1600 in Diafine, but I never did because I'm completely hooked on EI800 with XTOL 1:2 for 20min ag every 5 minutes. I wish I could show you a print! (I got that from DF Cardwell over on apug, btw) Grainy as hell, but it's one of my all time fav combos.

 

[Freakscene]

Bath A doesn't really develop the film

There is more than enough sulfite and bisulfite in the A bath to lower the ph enough for development to occur. Development is accelerated in the B bath and occurs to exhaustion of the developing agents. You can check by giving an exposed clip of film 3-5 minutes in the A bath and then fixing.

I agree about not pre-soaking. If you do pre-soak you need to extend the time in the A bath because you wash out the wetting agents that allow the emulsion to more easily become saturated.

Marty

 

[raytoei@gmail.com]

Okay... here are the results, first of all, this is the process which I developed the film:

here in the tropics, the air temperature is around 28-30C

a- presoak 4 mins
b- solution A 4mins in 1+1 dilution with 2-3 agitation initially and after every 1.5 mins
c- ditto for Solution B 4mins
d- water bath. fix and wash

Scanner is v600 at 2400 dpi. default settings.

Observations

The iso are 100, 200, 400, 800, 1600 and 3200.

The default scanner will adjust the brightness and contrast automatically, thus, the clip test above favors the 400 - 800 images.

However, when I scanned the images individually, what looked best was the 1600 iso (pictured here) followed by the 800 iso image.

Lastly the difference between the 3200 and 1600 was more dramatic than the 800 to 1600 image.

cheers!

raytoei
ps. I am using Diafine diluted and single use. I estimate around 25 rolls for this 1 gallon syrup.
pps. Lens used was the Planar shot at f2 on a G1.

 

[mgd711]

Why are you using it as single use, diluted 1+1?

I live in the Philippines and I don’t presoak the film nor do I do anything to cool the chemicals. My tap water is between 28 to 32 degree’s C and the Diafine will also be around that temperature.

After the first 4 reel tank off film the Diafine (A) came out like tea but by the next day most of that colouration had gone. I’ve now done 25 roll’s off film and there is a bit off crud in the bottom of a 2 litre Pepsi bottle but when I get home I’ll filter that out and top up the bottle from the rest off the stock (about 150ml)
Solution B also has a bit off crud in it and when I filter it I’ll dump some solution and top it up with the same quantity as in solution A.