Questions and Comments About a 1955 Kiev 2

[leighmarrin]

Even though I've got two Kiev 4am and one Contax IIa BD that all need minor to major work, yesterday I bought a very nice Kiev 2 and Jupiter-8 lens from a local store for $125. Also included was a usable leather case.

While I've not yet ran film through the Kiev 2 (hopefully no light leaks or frame spacing problems like one of my 4ams), I'm very impressed with the quality of the Kiev 2. The shutter speeds are much easier to set than the 4am; the brass-body J-8 lens seems much more solid than a '70s LTM J-8 I also own, and all shutter speeds look approximately accurate by eye.

Question 1: the rangefinder does not quite focus to infinity; when focused at 1 meter it is a measured 15mm off using the J-8. Mounting a 35mm Nikkor lens focused at 3 feet, it is about 1.25 inches off from the film plane. (No, I've not actually checked the focus through the lens...) Should I bother to attempt to fix the focus issues? (I'm not going to be doing much wide-open work with it; I'll use my Leica M2 instead.) If so, how difficult are the DIY instructions on the Kiev Survival Site for RF adjustment?

Question 2: the Kiev 2 is supposed to only have a Cyrillic logo, but mine has both Cyrllic and Latin logs like the Kiev 2a and later models. The serial number of both lens and camera begins with 55, so evidently mine was made in 1955, the last year of production of the Kiev 2. (Mine has no flash synch; the 1956-onward 2a does.) Is this common for the late-production Kiev 2, or could mine have a replaced front plate?

Question 3: the leather case has a pocket which contains a mottled-yellow plastic card that measures 1.7 x 3.4 inches (8.5 x 4.5 cm). The edges are rounded, and it is unmarked. I've seen a similar card included in the case of a bottom-loading Canon RF, evidently as a loading aid, but I can see no need for it in loading a Kiev/Contax. Wonder if this was a standard accessory, or after-market?

Thanks in advance from Leigh in Santa Barbara, Calif.

 

[zhang xk]

Even though I've got two Kiev 4am and one Contax IIa BD that all need minor to major work, yesterday I bought a very nice Kiev 2 and Jupiter-8 lens from a local store for $125. Also included was a usable leather case.

While I've not yet ran film through the Kiev 2 (hopefully no light leaks or frame spacing problems like one of my 4ams), I'm very impressed with the quality of the Kiev 2. The shutter speeds are much easier to set than the 4am; the brass-body J-8 lens seems much more solid than a '70s LTM J-8 I also own, and all shutter speeds look approximately accurate by eye.

Question 1: the rangefinder does not quite focus to infinity; when focused at 1 meter it is a measured 15mm off using the J-8. Mounting a 35mm Nikkor lens focused at 3 feet, it is about 1.25 inches off from the film plane. (No, I've not actually checked the focus through the lens...) Should I bother to attempt to fix the focus issues? (I'm not going to be doing much wide-open work with it; I'll use my Leica M2 instead.) If so, how difficult are the DIY instructions on the Kiev Survival Site for RF adjustment?

Question 2: the Kiev 2 is supposed to only have a Cyrillic logo, but mine has both Cyrllic and Latin logs like the Kiev 2a and later models. The serial number of both lens and camera begins with 55, so evidently mine was made in 1955, the last year of production of the Kiev 2. (Mine has no flash synch; the 1956-onward 2a does.) Is this common for the late-production Kiev 2, or could mine have a replaced front plate?

Question 3: the leather case has a pocket which contains a mottled-yellow plastic card that measures 1.7 x 3.4 inches (8.5 x 4.5 cm). The edges are rounded, and it is unmarked. I've seen a similar card included in the case of a bottom-loading Canon RF, evidently as a loading aid, but I can see no need for it in loading a Kiev/Contax. Wonder if this was a standard accessory, or after-market?

Thanks in advance from Leigh in Santa Barbara, Calif.

Hi,

I happen to have a dual logo 1955 Kiev 2. I think dual logo Kiev 2 was made since 1950 for export, and were made in smaller numbers than the block logo domestic version. The logo should be engraved not stamped as those made later than 1955. My earliest dual logo Kiev 2 was made in 1951.

I have seen someone wrote the sunny-16 rule on those plastic cards that came with the camera.

The rangefinder of your camera is mis-aligned that needs a "professional"s adjustment. It could be a difficult job if you do it yourself.

Many Kiev 2s are solid, reliable cameras. Some of my early 1950's Kiev 2s have never been serviced, and I think they could probably work for another 50 years.😀

Cheers,

Zhang

 

[TVphotog]

The plastic card was for taking notes. Both my Zorki 3 and 3M had this card in a pocket in the backside of the case. The Z3 even had notes from the last time it was used. Fortunately, for you, your Kiev 2 sounds much better than my 2A. Fortunately for me, my 4A is lightyears ahead of my 2A. The directions on the KSS are not hard, just time consuming. As long as you don't rush yourself, you should have no problem. I am sure that Ruben or Xmas will be along shortly to tell you the same. They are really the Kiev authorities here so far.
Ken

 

[manfromh]

http://www3.telus.net/public/rpnchbck/adjust rangefinder.html

Rangefinder adjustment. Scroll down a little to "the simple fix". Its not hard, it just takes time.

 

[zhang xk]

http://www3.telus.net/public/rpnchbck/adjust rangefinder.html

Rangefinder adjustment. Scroll down a little to "the simple fix". Its not hard, it just takes time.

It could be difficult if you have a distorted part. I just fixed a Kiev 4's shutter, and tried to replaced a distorted part of the rangefinder from another parts camera. But they are not interchangeable! A tiny screw hole was drilled at a different position. Well, maybe all these are not difficult for those who know well about this camera.😛

 

[leighmarrin]

Zhang, Ken and Manfrom, thanks for the quick replies and great info. I nevered would have guessed on the purpose of that mottled-yellow card in the case pocket, but evidently the red streaks on it are from old notes written in red grease pencil.

Interesting on the dual-logo Kiev 2 being for export; Zhang, I can't tell if the logo is stamped or engraved, but its lines are much thinner than the Kiev 4am logo. My Kiev 2 is also marked on the case and on the top body with MADE IN USSR in English. Does the "single logo" Kiev 2 also have English on it?

I'm going to put a roll of film through it to see what other problems it might have before deciding how to fix the rangefinder... I get a little nervous reading the online RF adjustment procedure, so I may have a RF specialist fix it. Of the three Kievs and one Contax I own, this '55 Kiev 2 is my favorite, and I'd like it to work well.

[A bit of bragging...] I've got a late W. German Carl Zeiss rigid 50mm/f3.5 Tessar which is a great little lens. In an informal tripod test on a Kiev 4am at f5.6, it produces much sharper negatives than a '82 Helios. (Although the latter may need shimming.) So this Tessar on my newly acquired Kiev 2 with its QUIET shutter should be a great street-shootin' camera.

Anyhow.. thanks again for the info, and I'll post how the first test roll works out.

--Leigh in Santa Barbara

 

[zhang xk]

Zhang, Ken and Manfrom, thanks for the quick replies and great info. I nevered would have guessed on the purpose of that mottled-yellow card in the case pocket, but evidently the red streaks on it are from old notes written in red grease pencil.

Interesting on the dual-logo Kiev 2 being for export; Zhang, I can't tell if the logo is stamped or engraved, but its lines are much thinner than the Kiev 4am logo. My Kiev 2 is also marked on the case and on the top body with MADE IN USSR in English. Does the "single logo" Kiev 2 also have English on it?

I'm going to put a roll of film through it to see what other problems it might have before deciding how to fix the rangefinder... I get a little nervous reading the online RF adjustment procedure, so I may have a RF specialist fix it. Of the three Kievs and one Contax I own, this '55 Kiev 2 is my favorite, and I'd like it to work well.

[A bit of bragging...] I've got a late W. German Carl Zeiss rigid 50mm/f3.5 Tessar which is a great little lens. In an informal tripod test on a Kiev 4am at f5.6, it produces much sharper negatives than a '82 Helios. (Although the latter may need shimming.) So this Tessar on my newly acquired Kiev 2 with its QUIET shutter should be a great street-shootin' camera.

Anyhow.. thanks again for the info, and I'll post how the first test roll works out.

--Leigh in Santa Barbara

Hi Leigh,

1955 was the year when Kiev began to use front plates with stamped logo, so your Kiev II might have a stamped logo. Yes the export Kiev II has a dual logo case, and dual languages "Made in USSR" on the shoe. The block logo Kiev II only has S/N on the shoe, and with a single logo leather case. Dual logo Kiev IIs made in 1950 and 1951 are less often seen than block logo Kiev 2s, but increased in the following years.
An interesting note: early exported Kiev II was sold for RMB 1,200+ or $1,200+ 1950's US dollars in early 1950's in China, and a Kiev 4 for RMB 1,200+ in the 1960-70's. This is an astronomical figure for ordinary Chinese then. An ounce of 24K gold was only about RMB 90 in late 1950's.😀
Good luck with your 1955 Kiev II.

Cheers,

Zhang

 

[outfitter]

Interesting on the dual-logo Kiev 2 being for export; Zhang, I can't tell if the logo is stamped or engraved, but its lines are much thinner than the Kiev 4am logo. My Kiev 2 is also marked on the case and on the top body with MADE IN USSR in English. Does the "single logo" Kiev 2 also have English on it?

My 1955 dual-logo Kiev 2 is engraved not stamped and yours sounds like it is also engraved. Mine doesn't have made in the USSR anywhere on it.

Michael

 

[zhang xk]

My 1955 dual-logo Kiev 2 is engraved not stamped and yours sounds like it is also engraved. Mine doesn't have made in the USSR anywhere on it.

Michael

Sounds like you have a single logo Kiev 2 with a dual logo front plate. My 1956 Kiev 2A still has "Made in USSR" on the shoe, but now it has a stamped dual logo on the front plate, and a 7 digit S/N that indicates production was incresed to more than 10 thousand units per year.

Zhang

 

[ruben]

......... I am sure that Ruben or Xmas will be along shortly to tell you the same. They are really the Kiev authorities here so far.
Ken

Hi Ken,

I have to friendly protest this statement. At the Kiev stuff, i am more in the Public Relations department than anything else. Xmass is quite at the center of the 'production stuff'. By far and large Russ Pinchbeck with his site has and continues to be my teacher. Rick Oleson and Greyhoundman have a wide knowledge on many many cameras, and I simply do not at all. Our comrade Zhang shows a masterfull knowledge of historicat issues, and perhaps I am doing him some unjustice. Then we have other members like Physiognomy who right know is very bussy with his studies and unable to actively participate, and a Zorkikat is intriguing me.

I am sure there are other folks that either I am forgetting here, or that prefer to keep quiet for some reason, that have much more technical knowledge than mine.

All these is important because at the very next phase, the technical side of the Kiev Project will start, and I will be showing my proceedings which may arise high controversies, hopefully. My proceedings are backed by what works for me but with a short time of experience.

In case controversies arise, that will be good. I wish to enrage as much brains around as possible, to learn myself and you should pay good attention to what others may be saying. Thus the brains of all of us will be working and this is the best way of learning.

Cheers,
Ruben

 

[Marc-A.]

Question 2: the Kiev 2 is supposed to only have a Cyrillic logo, but mine has both Cyrllic and Latin logs like the Kiev 2a and later models. The serial number of both lens and camera begins with 55, so evidently mine was made in 1955, the last year of production of the Kiev 2. (Mine has no flash synch; the 1956-onward 2a does.) Is this common for the late-production Kiev 2, or could mine have a replaced front plate?

First, you have acquired a very nice, robust and liable camera. (Maybe you could share a picture of your camera).
As for the logo, I've had a Kiev 2 with the same logo, from 1955, and it was actually a Kiev 2 (the 2a has the flash sync).Here it is:

Have fun with your new toy, and take good pictures!

Marc-A.

 

[outfitter]

Sounds like you have a single logo Kiev 2 with a dual logo front plate. My 1956 Kiev 2A still has "Made in USSR" on the shoe, but now it has a stamped dual logo on the front plate, and a 7 digit S/N that indicates production was incresed to more than 10 thousand units per year.

Zhang

Yes my camera is a 1955 dual logo Kiev 2; according to Princelle the accessory shoe engraving "Made in USSR" was introduced in the Kiev-2a.

Michael

 

[zhang xk]

Yes my camera is a 1955 dual logo Kiev 2; according to Princelle the accessory shoe engraving "Made in USSR" was introduced in the Kiev-2a.

Michael

It proves that the dual logo Kiev IIs are uncommon. I have 1951,1952,1954,and 1955 dual logo Kiev IIs with "Made In USSR" on the shoe. It seems to me that even Princelle doesn't have an early dual logo Kiev II.🙂

Zhang

 

[zhang xk]

It proves that the dual logo Kiev IIs are uncommon. I have 1951,1952,1954,and 1955 dual logo Kiev IIs with "Made In USSR" on the shoe. It seems to me that even Princelle doesn't have an early dual logo Kiev II.🙂

Zhang

Well, just checked the "bible", Princelle did say that dual logo Kiev II was made since 1950, but there is no image of such a camera on the book.

Zhang

 

[Xmas]

It is easy to remanufacture one if youe want one...

Noel

 

[zhang xk]

It is easy to remanufacture one if youe want one...

Noel

It will be a fake, ins't it?

 

[Xmas]

Yes if dual name Kiev from 50 are rare then all you need is a IIII and a II and you have a 'rariety'...

The FSU people can read English and will catch on quick...

Noel

 

[leighmarrin]

BAD NEWS! I started this thread a few days ago about a very clean Kiev 2 I just bought with a working shutter; well, after a few dozen shutter cycles, the shutter has gone bad... slow & sticky & does not always "self-cap"... Dang!

Since it needs RF adjustment anyway, I just talked to a well-regarded US repairman and am going to send it to him soon. This camera is worth fixing, and I want to use it. (Happily, it has no burred-up screw heads or other signs of half-arssed repairs.)

Sounds like there are a lot of variations on the Kiev 2! Thanks to everyone for sharing their info.

Zhang, I was astounded by the prices you gave for Kiev cameras in China in the 1950s. Were East German Zeiss lenses also sold there? They must have been expensive also. For what it's worth, around 1974 I bought a new Zorki 3 with J-8 and smelly leather case from a dealer in New York City for $35/US, which was cheap even then. (The Zorki's shutter went bad and I sold it, but kept the great little black J-8 lens, which I've used more than my DR Summicron, because the little J-8 is so much lighter and focuses so much faster, even if it's not quite as sharp.)

Will let you folks know when I get the repaired Kiev 2 back. Thanks for all the replies. --Leigh in Snta Barbara.

 

[outfitter]

BAD NEWS! I started this thread a few days ago about a very clean Kiev 2 I just bought with a working shutter; well, after a few dozen shutter cycles, the shutter has gone bad... slow & sticky & does not always "self-cap"... Dang!

Since it needs RF adjustment anyway, I just talked to a well-regarded US repairman and am going to send it to him soon. This camera is worth fixing, and I want to use it. (Happily, it has no burred-up screw heads or other signs of half-arssed repairs.)

Sounds like there are a lot of variations on the Kiev 2! Thanks to everyone for sharing their info.

Zhang, I was astounded by the prices you gave for Kiev cameras in China in the 1950s. Were East German Zeiss lenses also sold there? They must have been expensive also. For what it's worth, around 1974 I bought a new Zorki 3 with J-8 and smelly leather case from a dealer in New York City for $35/US, which was cheap even then. (The Zorki's shutter went bad and I sold it, but kept the great little black J-8 lens, which I've used more than my DR Summicron, because the little J-8 is so much lighter and focuses so much faster, even if it's not quite as sharp.)

Will let you folks know when I get the repaired Kiev 2 back. Thanks for all the replies. --Leigh in Snta Barbara.

There really aren't many variations after 1950 - just the logo basically.

In the late 1970s I paid something like $400 for a new Kiev 4a sealed in the box. Still have it, always felt like a pepper mill when winding on but works perfectly - its my beach camera.

Michael

Michael

 

[zhang xk]

BAD NEWS! I started this thread a few days ago about a very clean Kiev 2 I just bought with a working shutter; well, after a few dozen shutter cycles, the shutter has gone bad... slow & sticky & does not always "self-cap"... Dang!

Since it needs RF adjustment anyway, I just talked to a well-regarded US repairman and am going to send it to him soon. This camera is worth fixing, and I want to use it. (Happily, it has no burred-up screw heads or other signs of half-arssed repairs.)

Sounds like there are a lot of variations on the Kiev 2! Thanks to everyone for sharing their info.

Zhang, I was astounded by the prices you gave for Kiev cameras in China in the 1950s. Were East German Zeiss lenses also sold there? They must have been expensive also. For what it's worth, around 1974 I bought a new Zorki 3 with J-8 and smelly leather case from a dealer in New York City for $35/US, which was cheap even then. (The Zorki's shutter went bad and I sold it, but kept the great little black J-8 lens, which I've used more than my DR Summicron, because the little J-8 is so much lighter and focuses so much faster, even if it's not quite as sharp.)

Will let you folks know when I get the repaired Kiev 2 back. Thanks for all the replies. --Leigh in Snta Barbara.

Sorry to hear the bad news.:bang: It sounds like something wrong with those tiny coil springs, or maybe just the "locking key" is loose. If the coil spring is not broken in the middle, it can be easy to fix. An easier way is to find a cheap Kiev 4A, and swap the shutter mechanism.😛

Kiev 4 price was reduced to about RMB600 sometime in the 1970's which corresponds to outfitter's price of $400 at an exchange rate of 1:1.5 then. I don't know the price of Carl Zeiss Jena products. They must be very expensive.There is evidence that some CZJ products were CKD assembled in China.
Anyway, a 1950 Kiev II was much more expensive than a Swiss Rolex watch that cost about RMB 400+ then.

Zhang