DFigueira
Established
Hi guys,
I'm a guy who shoots a lot of 35mm and I'm thinking about getting a medium format camera. Either a TLR or a Rangefinder.
Why? Because shooting a roll of 36 is too long for me and for printing quality too.
Problem here choosing a rangefinder... the budget. Max budget will be 200€ buying online (because vintage in my country means doubling the price).
Is there a non folding RF under that price?
Or I should forget the idea and go straight to a TLR?
Oh, and the budget is already stretched to the limits.. :bang:
Thank you all
I'm a guy who shoots a lot of 35mm and I'm thinking about getting a medium format camera. Either a TLR or a Rangefinder.
Why? Because shooting a roll of 36 is too long for me and for printing quality too.
Problem here choosing a rangefinder... the budget. Max budget will be 200€ buying online (because vintage in my country means doubling the price).
Is there a non folding RF under that price?
Or I should forget the idea and go straight to a TLR?
Oh, and the budget is already stretched to the limits.. :bang:
Thank you all
Welcome to RFF. A location would help a bit. The sort of imaging you tend to do wouldn't hurt, either but not to worry. I think you'll struggle to find a really decent RF in that price range that may not need some remedial attention to be a reliable shooter. You can, admittedly, say the same thing about other types of medium format cameras as well including TLRs, but I suspect you may have better luck with a TLR. Everyone has their own preferences here. Personally I think a Rolleicord V is pretty hard to beat as an entry level MF camera. Great build; great lens; great durability and; from the greatest TLR manufacturer and the one that most others copied.
There are many, many, many, discussions about the point you've raised here at RFF let alone elsewhere on the web. Do not spare the search functionality--you will not wear it out. We can advise you, but you are ultimately in charge of your own investigations, and know best, what your own needs are.
Cheers
Brett
There are many, many, many, discussions about the point you've raised here at RFF let alone elsewhere on the web. Do not spare the search functionality--you will not wear it out. We can advise you, but you are ultimately in charge of your own investigations, and know best, what your own needs are.
Cheers
Brett
DFigueira
Established
Welcome to RFF. A location would help a bit. The sort of imaging you tend to do wouldn't hurt, either but not to worry. I think you'll struggle to find a really decent RF in that price range that may not need some remedial attention to be a reliable shooter. You can, admittedly, say the same thing about other types of medium format cameras as well including TLRs, but I suspect you may have better luck with a TLR. Everyone has their own preferences here. Personally I think a Rolleicord V is pretty hard to beat as an entry level MF camera. Great build; great lens; great durability and; from the greatest TLR manufacturer and the one that most others copied.
There are many, many, many, discussions about the point you've raised here at RFF let alone elsewhere on the web. Do not spare the search functionality--you will not wear it out. We can advise you, but you are ultimately in charge of your own investigations, and know best, what your own needs are.
Cheers
Brett
I'm sorry. I'm from Portugal.
I've used the search functionality for around 2 months now. To gather info on what I really wanted based on my likes and dislikes of 35mm. What type of cameras, etc.
My purpose with this post is to see if there is an underrated camera that I couldn't find and it's fine for this purpose or some other gem out in the wild.
It all came to these two options.
Jake Mongey
Well-known
My suggestion for a diamond in the rough TLR is the Minolta Autocord, Amazing lens, relatively small and great build quality and very cheap usually
For a Rangefinder you could find a mamiya press but they are very big and heavy.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Exc-Mamiy...142460?hash=item2ef75695fc:g:p7gAAOSw5cNYKYmw
joe bosak
Well-known
You might check out Ffordes.com, I've bought a few things from them and they have been exactly as described. At the moment they have a couple of Koni Omegas under Film Cameras -> Collectables/OtherBrands. Obviously they weigh a ton so shipping from the UK may be expensive.
pschauss
Well-known
If you are looking for an underrated TLR try a Flexaret. Cupog on ebay usually has a few which he has CLAed at prices which are well with in your budget.
Ko.Fe.
Lenses 35/21 Gears 46/20
Hi guys,
I'm a guy that shoots a lot of 35mm and I'm thinking about getting a medium format camera. Either a TLR or a Rangefinder.
Why? Because shooting a roll of 36 is too long for me and for printing quality too.
Problem here choosing a rangefinder... the budget. Max budget will be 200€ buying online (because vintage in my country means doubling the price).
Is there a non folding RF under that price?
Or I should forget the idea and go straight to a TLR?
Oh, and the budget is already stretched to the limits.. :bang:
Thank you all
The printing quality of MF is overblown by gearheads dominating photo forums, IMO. Jane Bown (photographer) switched from Rolleiflex to OM and "never looked back". I have book with her portraits. Zero difference between MF and 135.
And for 200 you not going to get camera with good quality MF lens and RF.
For 200, you could buy Delta 100 bulk (30.5) film, film loader and reusable cassettes to load 12 frames. Within same 200 you could get sexy, retro but working SLR with sharp lens on it.
On-line you could get Mamiya 645 series SLR with lens, all working, well under 200. It is relatively small 645 SLR.
I have one to try and didn't find it significantly over 35 film in good camera with good lens. I will put it for sale on-line
.RF MF if retro is going to be problematic and not worth of the 200 price, IMO.
Just get clean, simple, working retro MF folder and have fancy, retro looking external rangefinder. Like FSU Smena eRF.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/1950th-GOMZ...260869?hash=item2822aa0a05:g:F6oAAOSwNRdYB0iV
vagab0nd
Established
I went through a similar search earlier this year. I quickly ruled out MF RF's due to price and focused on TLR's. Since I had shot a few different TLR's already (Rolleiflex 2.8 & 3.5, Rolleicord V, Autocord, and Ikoflex), I had developed a fairly narrow set of requirements so it made my search easy: lightweight (under 900g), triplet lens, 1/500s top shutter, bayonet 1 filters (I already have a few), and preferably flash sync. The 'Flexes are too expensive, the Autocord and Ikoflex were both too heavy ,and the 'Cord V is a Xenar (tessar lens), so I hunted for a Rolleicord IId or IIe with the Triotar lens (see here for more info on Rolleicords) and I ended up with a IIe which I love. The auto frame counter on the later Rolleicords would be nice, but I can live without it.
If you don't want a triplet, any of the Rolleicords from the III through Va weigh less than 900g, have a top shutter speed of 1/500s, auto frame counter, and parallax correction (which, I believe, the only other TLRs that have parallax correction are the Rolleiflexes), and flash sync.
If you don't want a triplet, any of the Rolleicords from the III through Va weigh less than 900g, have a top shutter speed of 1/500s, auto frame counter, and parallax correction (which, I believe, the only other TLRs that have parallax correction are the Rolleiflexes), and flash sync.
B-9
Devin Bro
I can think of a few RF in your budget, but you haven't specified your preferred format? (Are you sticking yourself to 6x6?)
Koni-Omega, various models in chrome and black. A few good lenses to collect even! Cheap as it gets for a fully capable Rangefinder.
Fujica G690, for when you want BIG negatives, they do call these Texas Leicas, and there are also a handful of lenses you can hunt down.
Both or these cameras can easily be purchased for about 150$USD which leaves you room for film and processing.
Koni-Omega, various models in chrome and black. A few good lenses to collect even! Cheap as it gets for a fully capable Rangefinder.
Fujica G690, for when you want BIG negatives, they do call these Texas Leicas, and there are also a handful of lenses you can hunt down.
Both or these cameras can easily be purchased for about 150$USD which leaves you room for film and processing.
sevo
Fokutorendaburando
mpaniagua
Newby photographer
Mamiya c330 are pretty nice cameras. A quick look on ebay show some of them at $200-300. Glass quality is pretty nice and have interchangeble lens.
unixrevolution
Well-known
My pick for a budget medium format camera is the venerable Yashica TLR series. I have had a 635 (which I still own) and a 124G (Which I traded) and both are superb. Not super fast or sexy, but compact, they work, and if you make sure to get a Yashinon lens version like mine were, the results will be quite lovely. You'll get that medium format "Look" you're likely after, and 12 frames per roll of delicious square format.
I traded my 124G to someone else, because I do have a C330. If you can get a nice one in good shape in your budget, it's awesome. But I would still say the Yashica will likely be cheaper for similar condition, and the Mamiya is no lightweight compact, it's a beast!
The C330 is not unmanageably large, but you can see how big it is next to a more conventionally sized Rolleicord. I adore mine, and the interchangeable lenses are amazing, but the fixies win on size and weight.
I went to the renn faire recently with my M2 and a TLR. I wanted to bring my C330, but it wouldn't fit in my chosen bag. The Yashica slipped in like the bag was made for it
I traded my 124G to someone else, because I do have a C330. If you can get a nice one in good shape in your budget, it's awesome. But I would still say the Yashica will likely be cheaper for similar condition, and the Mamiya is no lightweight compact, it's a beast!
The C330 is not unmanageably large, but you can see how big it is next to a more conventionally sized Rolleicord. I adore mine, and the interchangeable lenses are amazing, but the fixies win on size and weight.
I went to the renn faire recently with my M2 and a TLR. I wanted to bring my C330, but it wouldn't fit in my chosen bag. The Yashica slipped in like the bag was made for it
JChrome
Street Worker
+1 for the Mamiya Universal or the Fuji GW699.
And you will find a difference in the printing and rendering of the images.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
And you will find a difference in the printing and rendering of the images.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Out to Lunch
Ventor
Budget and all....buying a Czech camera last made in 1970 will present issues... How expensive they'll be to fix in Portugal, I don't know.
DFigueira
Established
There's a lot to think here...
I've thinked about the Mamiya Universal, but carrying a beast like that - it's not the weight that troubles me, it's the size.
I didn't want folders because of one thing - bellows. I have a very bad luck with them. I always treated and cleaned my cameras but if there's one thing that gets trashed and I don't even know why, it's bellows. If the Mamiya C didn't had bellows, I would go for them.
Here we have a solution to repair cameras with a low budget. Either I repair myself or I buy a new camera. This whole "vintage" thing here is very troublesome.
Buying film is not a problem though... It's a lot cheaper than 35mm - and I will be developing it myself. Not right now, but In the future when I change to another house.
The negatives size. I'm used to the normal 35mm widish size. So any size up to 6x7 will do for me - including 6x6, which I like very much from the works I've saw till now.
As mentioned above, is the Mamiya 645 a good shot? Can it use a waist level finder (I'm used to them).
And thank you all for the suggestions. Keep 'em coming
I've thinked about the Mamiya Universal, but carrying a beast like that - it's not the weight that troubles me, it's the size.
I didn't want folders because of one thing - bellows. I have a very bad luck with them. I always treated and cleaned my cameras but if there's one thing that gets trashed and I don't even know why, it's bellows. If the Mamiya C didn't had bellows, I would go for them.
Here we have a solution to repair cameras with a low budget. Either I repair myself or I buy a new camera. This whole "vintage" thing here is very troublesome.
Buying film is not a problem though... It's a lot cheaper than 35mm - and I will be developing it myself. Not right now, but In the future when I change to another house.
The negatives size. I'm used to the normal 35mm widish size. So any size up to 6x7 will do for me - including 6x6, which I like very much from the works I've saw till now.
As mentioned above, is the Mamiya 645 a good shot? Can it use a waist level finder (I'm used to them).
And thank you all for the suggestions. Keep 'em coming
FujiLove
Well-known
I'd highly recommend a late model Rolleicord such as the Va or Vb. I picked up my Vb for around £150 and it's a superb camera.
1. They are built almost as well as the Rolleiflex (i.e. beautifully)
2. The lenses are outstanding (most people will struggle to see any difference between a photograph taken with a Rolleicord and a Rolleiflex 3.5F when viewing the final print)
3. They are lighter than most 'flex cameras (under 1kg) and easy to carry all day
4. Accessories are cheap and plentiful (don't over-look this as you could end up paying more for a couple of filters, hood etc than the camera itself)
5. They are relatively simple, with separate winding and shutter cocking actions which means they are reliable and easy + cheap to repair (and being a Rollei, there are people all over the world who can work on them)
6. They're lovely to handle, beautiful to look at, and simply a joy to use.
A few examples from the Rolleicord...
1. They are built almost as well as the Rolleiflex (i.e. beautifully)
2. The lenses are outstanding (most people will struggle to see any difference between a photograph taken with a Rolleicord and a Rolleiflex 3.5F when viewing the final print)
3. They are lighter than most 'flex cameras (under 1kg) and easy to carry all day
4. Accessories are cheap and plentiful (don't over-look this as you could end up paying more for a couple of filters, hood etc than the camera itself)
5. They are relatively simple, with separate winding and shutter cocking actions which means they are reliable and easy + cheap to repair (and being a Rollei, there are people all over the world who can work on them)
6. They're lovely to handle, beautiful to look at, and simply a joy to use.
A few examples from the Rolleicord...
DFigueira
Established
Seems nice and a great option. Are they well build - reallly easy to repair?
And from what I understood, both the cocking and firing is under the lens (the lever and the button). Is that it?
Is the viewfinder bright? That's one of the problems I have when using WLF. The camera I have, has a very small WLF, it's easy to focus with light, but if it's a little dark, I need to use the magnifier.
Joao
Negativistic forever
I own a Yashica D (40-50 euros in a street market) and a Flexaret IIa (offered); each one was repaired and CLA'd in Lisbon for around 50 euros. The problems with both cameras arise if they stand on the shelf for a long time (slow speeds malfunction).
Regards
Joao
BillBingham2
Registered User
I've been doing some digging around the same end. I want small like a folder to be my every day carry camera. I was MF as I can scan it on the multi-function printer I have.
For a older folder I've focused on is the Mamiya Six, not the Mamiya 6. The 6 is a fine camera but well out of my budget and will tempt me to get more glass (I'm on a less is more kick still). Over here on Evil-Bay there are many good examples from Japan that are priced reasonably.
While I love the way the Fujifilm GS645 closes and looks, the Retina IIIc I have take a second or two to open and I'd rather spend that time adjusting focus & exposure. BUT the GS645W is just a bit bigger and zone focuses like my all time favorite street lens (CV 25 Snap-Shot LTM).
There are TLRs that come up from time to time. I've used the "Fixies" from time to time as well as the Koni-Rapid, C330, Crown Graphic and others but they all feel to big to carry everywhere.
I've had a Mamiya 645 and while not a 4X5 negative, it feels like enough of a step up over 135 that makes it worth the cost.
Hope this helps.
B2 (;->
For a older folder I've focused on is the Mamiya Six, not the Mamiya 6. The 6 is a fine camera but well out of my budget and will tempt me to get more glass (I'm on a less is more kick still). Over here on Evil-Bay there are many good examples from Japan that are priced reasonably.
While I love the way the Fujifilm GS645 closes and looks, the Retina IIIc I have take a second or two to open and I'd rather spend that time adjusting focus & exposure. BUT the GS645W is just a bit bigger and zone focuses like my all time favorite street lens (CV 25 Snap-Shot LTM).
There are TLRs that come up from time to time. I've used the "Fixies" from time to time as well as the Koni-Rapid, C330, Crown Graphic and others but they all feel to big to carry everywhere.
I've had a Mamiya 645 and while not a 4X5 negative, it feels like enough of a step up over 135 that makes it worth the cost.
Hope this helps.
B2 (;->
oftheherd
Veteran
I had a Yashica MAT 124G some 40 years ago and loved it. I also owned a Rolleiflex but couldn't bond with it. Probably partly due to having a Mamiya Super Press 23 by then. The 6x7 negatives were more convenient to me than 6x6. At the time, the Press didn't seem so heavy. 40 years on, it seems a little more so, but not as bad as for 3 or 4 years ago when I had an unrelated back problem. You can also get 6x9 backs or sheet film holders. But beware, the Press 23 has a bellows back, but you need not use it except for perspective control or extreme closeups, so it shouldn't bother you.
What I rather prefer now is a wooden bodied 9x12 with RF. Less weight, can be used with roll film if you buy an appropriate adapter, or with sheet film if you have proper cut film holders (with sheaths). Again, they have bellows, but of some 10 9x12 cameras I have, not one of them has a bellows problem.
I know a lot of people swear by 645. I personally am not a fan. It just isn't big enough above 35mm in negative size to suit me. Maybe if I had one of those before I got 6x6 and 6x7, I would like them better. But 6x6 and above gives one a lot more negative to play with imho. Especially 9x12 as it is almost 4x5. 6x9 is a very interesting negative size as well.
Good luck in your search, and let us know how you make out or if you have further questions.
What I rather prefer now is a wooden bodied 9x12 with RF. Less weight, can be used with roll film if you buy an appropriate adapter, or with sheet film if you have proper cut film holders (with sheaths). Again, they have bellows, but of some 10 9x12 cameras I have, not one of them has a bellows problem.
I know a lot of people swear by 645. I personally am not a fan. It just isn't big enough above 35mm in negative size to suit me. Maybe if I had one of those before I got 6x6 and 6x7, I would like them better. But 6x6 and above gives one a lot more negative to play with imho. Especially 9x12 as it is almost 4x5. 6x9 is a very interesting negative size as well.
Good luck in your search, and let us know how you make out or if you have further questions.