Rob-F
Likes Leicas
Interesting, about boxing in the picture. I guess I could say my approach has been to "unbox" my subject by leaving some room--some environment--around it. That might be part of why I like wide angle lenses.
Oscuro
He's French, I'm Italian.
I use zoom combined with "move your a$$" so I can compress with long or separate the subject from field with wide.
That is what I use focal length for - flattening with long and pulling the subject out with wide.
Interesting - I read a lot of people talking about wides in the "lateral" sense. Never used them that way. I've mostly used them to push a background away.
I will admit to going long and cropping when I can't get close enough. (Cops, robbers, other people with guns, physical obstacles, etc..)
That is what I use focal length for - flattening with long and pulling the subject out with wide.
Interesting - I read a lot of people talking about wides in the "lateral" sense. Never used them that way. I've mostly used them to push a background away.
I will admit to going long and cropping when I can't get close enough. (Cops, robbers, other people with guns, physical obstacles, etc..)
hepcat
Former PH, USN
There are many reasons to engage in the practice of photography; fun, work, documentation, art, and self-expression. Self-expression may be the most important.
That's an interesting analysis... so you actually DO think about lenses... as I suspect all of us do; it's that you've pre-processed the subject and decided what fits how you see the world and use those most often.
raid
Dad Photographer
I had the same views on this issue Helen, and for many years. Then, I must have slipped into a new form of preferences so that now I "may be" favoring:
Mostly a 35 with a BIG "spot of 50",
and when I want to break out of the 'safety zone' a 21
raid
Dad Photographer
For over twenty years, my lens choice was very limited with SLR cameras and while traveling. I used a 28-50 zoom and a 80-200 zoom in 95% of my photography. In many cases, I chose the 28mm FL as my wide angle lens.
Hsg
who dares wins
Exactly. So, what focal length is good for expressing oneself through photography? As you can see its an absurd question. And the answer is not a zoom lens because a zoom lens is nothing but a real-time-cropping tool.
Another question that I'd like to ask, is it possible to have fun while expressing oneself? In my opinion not really, self expression is a painful and emotionally draining experience that is far from being fun. If you're having fun, that is entertainment, not creativity.
So, what lens to use as a serious photographer trying to express yourself through photography? No one can tell you, if they did, its their personal preference and not fit for you... You have to find the right tool by your own effort otherwise you're just another GAS addict chasing entertainment through gear acquisition.
Think of it this way, if you buy the cheapest guitar in a pawnshop and then give it to Mark Knopfler, his going to play beautifully... And I think that example should satisfy your quest for the ideal lens.
Mike Fish
Mike in Sacramento
Oscuro
He's French, I'm Italian.
Me too. The art-making process is more or less equal parts terror and glee. If there is some form of self-expression in there, well, purely coincidental. And how the h&ll would the viewer/observer know anyway? Art is made to the satisfaction of the artist. If you're doing it for someone else, well, it's something else. Maybe.That sounds awful, at least to me.But I don't do that "self-expression" thing, just make art.
These are all just ideas, projections, and fantasy. It's different for everybody.
Hsg
who dares wins
You're confusing creation and performance.
Creation is a painful process, and only good enough creators get to have the privilege to perform their creation no matter how small or large the stage might be.
Beethoven was deaf when he composed the 9th, that is the power of a creative force, it even overcomes physical limitations... And history tells us that Beethoven was not a very fun person to be around.
Hsg
who dares wins
That sounds awful, at least to me.
But I don't do that "self-expression" thing, just make art.
'Making art' is like baking donuts, following a recipe... Creativity is finding out for the first time how to plant and grow wheat in order to make the dough for donuts.
Art cannot be made with a template, that is coping.
Mike Fish
Mike in Sacramento
I'm really not. You might be confusing what you said with what you meant.
My response was to your statement that it wasn't possible to have fun while expressing oneself. Unless you meant to say "while expressing oneself while creating"
But still I'd disagree because I believe there can be joy and enjoyment in the creative process - in the presence of hard work and struggle. Creation is hard work. I agree with that.
Mike
marameo
Established
I know there must be lot of rangefinders here where lenses normally range from 21 to 50 yet I was wondering if any of you ever used longer focal lenght for portrait, something like 300mm (on a reflex system I would assume).
mdarnton
Well-known
I like wides, too, the wider the better, but I had an interesting period in my formative years when I was a news photographer. Back then photos were printed to fit the layout, so that the cameraman making the plates didn't have to waste time moving his setup back and forth. I quickly learned that if I gave my editor a four-column photo and he could make it into a tight three with scissors, he would, in a aesthetically-merciless way. In self defense, it got to be a very intentional game for me to get everything I needed into a box that couldn't be cut without ruining the shot, and it was great perceptual training. I might have given him a half-column of air, but never a full one, or the scissors came out.
I can still make a long shot, or an environmental photo if needed, but you still may not be able to chop a column off the edges. It's not evil to cut the subject, either. As I developed this, I started to enjoy Degas more--he did the same thing. This is the period where I started printing with black borders. Not as a conceit, but because I needed every fraction of a mm that the film would give, I was cropping so tightly in the camera. I'm not always as rabid about it as I used to be, now that the man with the scissors is gone, and often put more air in a photo, but never without being completely aware of what I'm doing.
This was probably a 21mm shot, with bare-bulb flash on a stand (folk dancers rehearsing before a TV show at the fire station next door--in a tiny town you can do that), shot in 1978. There's plenty of context here, just not way out past the central subjects:
Dancing at the Fire Station
by Michael Darnton, on Flickr
Something from a couple of months ago, 50mm. Choppy chop chop, but nothing essential cut off, and enough background to know what kind of place it is (collapsible Summicron, wide open; my favorite lens then, still my favorite lens):
Patrik with cello
by Michael Darnton, on Flickr
mdarnton
Well-known
I have always thought that art was something that artists made, whether they wanted to or not. Can artists even NOT make art? I don't know any who'd call the creative part of it "work", just the technical parts. In the workshop the rule is "if it hurts, you're doing it wrong."
Mcary
Well-known
I have a Voigtlander 75mm F 2.5 and a Nikkor 8.5 cm F2 that I use for portraits. Since the Voigtlander is some what smaller than the Nikkor its one I put in my bag if might be shooting some candid or street portraits. The Nikkor goes in my bag when working with a model or know that I'll be shooting portraits.
For most outing I've found that carrying two lens works for me
Street/abstract/architecture 21mm/35mm or 35/75
Landscape 21mm/35mm
For shooting/working with models: 35/85mm If shooting in small rooms or close quarter 50/85 if shooting in studio.
*Based simply off of what I've found works for me over the past few years.
* Switching from an M8 to an M9 so expect some adjustment may be in order.
Finally I don't really dwell on what lens I'm carrying as the way I see if the lens I have doesn't work for a shot than I'll just look for a shot that it does for
Mcary
Well-known
The way I see it whither I'm deciding to use a 21mm vs 28mm a 35mm vs 50mm 50mm vs 75mm I'm deciding how much of the environment that I want to include in the frame along with the subject.
No matter how big a box (wide a lens) one chooses to uses there will always be something that gets left out of the box (frame)
*OK I admit a 2mm lens on FF sensor would probable let you get everything with in visual range in the frame
35photo
Well-known
That sounds awful, at least to me.
But I don't do that "self-expression" thing, just make art.
Yeah, just be creative, make art, if you happen to express yourself then great but to me it should about having fun and exploring the medium which is photography in this case..
David Hughes
David Hughes
OK, so I might just be having fun whilst expressing myself, or it might be art, or street photography or even a comment on this thread.
What do the experts think?
Regards, David
What do the experts think?
Regards, David
mdarnton
Well-known
It seems to be some sort of color photograph to me. That's just my opinion, though, and I'm not an expert.
Hsg
who dares wins
Specially when it comes to photography because the photography subject is always out there in the world, which means photography is not only an intellectual and artistic pursuit but also a highly demanding physical activity.
There are photographers who have made a name for themselves by not leaving their studio or their room but then again those are rare exceptions.