Scammed??... well, almost.

[foto_fool]

To the posters who are giving trev heat for asking for some extra info after the auction - IMO that's being a bit naive. Good on you for being honest eBay sellers. And I can understand being annoyed with what you consider "difficult" buyers - been there myself as a seller.

But all trev wanted was some confirmation that his money was going to a legit seller - a landline number. When he did not get that, he absolutely did the right thing to ask for more. If it was me (and it has been, on several occasions) I would have asked for A LOT more.

SFAIK every one of us can and should do whatever we feel is necessary to back out of a deal that smells wrong after the auction closes (or our Best Offer is accepted). These "sellers" are criminals, period. Trev had reason to suspect this deal. Would those who are criticizing him (however mildly) have just handed over their own money under these circumstances?

- John

 

[colyn]

The questions you wanted answered should have been asked before buying the item..not after..

I expect bidders/buyers of my auctions to ask before bidding/buying because once they close the auction as high bidder or BIN they are expected to pay within a reasonable time frame.

As it stands now the seller can report you as a non-paying bidder if you haven't sent payment and he would be well within his rights to do so..

 

[trev2401]

The questions you wanted answered should have been asked before buying the item..not after..

I expect bidders/buyers of my auctions to ask before bidding/buying because once they close the auction as high bidder or BIN they are expected to pay within a reasonable time frame.

As it stands now the seller can report you as a non-paying bidder if you haven't sent payment and he would be well within his rights to do so..

once again, the questions were asked before the auction was closed, which the seller did not answer, asking me to send an offer first. I only asked for a phone call prior to sending payment. Only then did i poke further.

Just for the record, i took this up with eboy, and though the seller has the right to neg me as a non-paying bidder, the bidder also has the right to with-hold payment if the account is deemed 'suspicious'. (Not really sure how eboy determines that.) And yes, this is even after the auction has closed. In this case, yes, the account was suspicious with the paypal email not matching his account. (as confirmed by the authorities.) Together with a name change and subsequently, a similar item being offered under the new nick and a new location with a different paypal account email.

I appreciate everyone telling me about how difficult I am as a buyer, and i appreciate all your views on how things should be bid/done/sold/bought on eboy. Personally, hey... I guess I'm just trying to be careful. Have been this way for the past 3 years and with over 15k worth of stuff sold and bought.

Thanks 🙂

 

[M. Valdemar]

Everyone who wins an auction can get the seller's telephone number.

Advanced seach > Find contact information

The buyer and seller in a transaction can get each other's phone number from eBay via email immediately once an auction is won. IF the contact info is bogus, then that's legitimate grounds to dig deeper.

To the posters who are giving trev heat for asking for some extra info after the auction - IMO that's being a bit naive. Good on you for being honest eBay sellers. And I can understand being annoyed with what you consider "difficult" buyers - been there myself as a seller.

But all trev wanted was some confirmation that his money was going to a legit seller - a landline number. When he did not get that, he absolutely did the right thing to ask for more. If it was me (and it has been, on several occasions) I would have asked for A LOT more.

SFAIK every one of us can and should do whatever we feel is necessary to back out of a deal that smells wrong after the auction closes (or our Best Offer is accepted). These "sellers" are criminals, period. Trev had reason to suspect this deal. Would those who are criticizing him (however mildly) have just handed over their own money under these circumstances?

- John

 

[ferider]

I appreciate everyone telling me about how difficult I am as a buyer

I have sold to you before and you are not a difficult buyer - it was
a very pleasant experience.

1) I am with you - for a > US 1000 camera sale one could at least expect to
get a phone number from the seller.

Well, my bad... i did ask him for further information about the camera, make,age, ownership, etc etc before the auction. The only reply he gave me was to submit and offer, and we'll talk about it after as the camera was "with his mother." (i kid you not.)

2) If I understand right you requested additional info before making an offer.
I wonder what the legal implications are
when he accepts your offer after your request, since conditions can
not be put in an ebay offer. An oral/email agreement is a contract, even if
it cann't be handled via the ebay offering system. It depends on the exact
phrasing of his emails/words.

Roland.

 

[M. Valdemar]

PS: We're not berating you for being careful and doing due diligence.

The point is this should be done BEFORE bidding. As sellers, it is exasperating for someone to close an auction and THEN come up with doubts and conditions.

You admit you didn't get an answer but closed the auction anyway. Why? Fear someone might get the item first and you might lose out? There is absolutely NO reason to bid if you didn't get a satisfactory response from a seller. Why did you bid if you knew you had unanswered questions? Everyone is not totally innocent in any transaction gone bad.

 

[colyn]

once again, the questions were asked before the auction was closed, which the seller did not answer, asking me to send an offer first. I only asked for a phone call prior to sending payment. Only then did i poke further.

Since this is the case you should have seen the red flag and ran away...

 

[trev2401]

PS: We're not berating you for being careful and doing due diligence.

The point is this should be done BEFORE bidding. As sellers, it is exasperating for someone to close an auction and THEN come up with doubts and conditions.

You admit you didn't get an answer but closed the auction anyway. Why? Fear someone might get the item first and you might lose out? There is absolutely NO reason to bid if you didn't get a satisfactory response from a seller. Why did you bid if you knew you had unanswered questions? Everyone is not totally innocent in any transaction gone bad.

once more,

i closed the auction with full intent of buying the camera, regardless of whether my questions were answered. However, i merely asked for his phone number before payment.

I do not bid for "fear" that someone might beat me to the item. (please don't throw assumptions out like that. )

 

[rich815]

Are you that guy I saw there and spoke with about 2 years ago with a Contax N1 over your shoulder?

Go bears!

hahaha... tokyo's just toooo !"#!"# crowded... I get squeeeezed, molested, beaten and bruised at 630am on the way to work daily.

I miss UCB, i miss the asian ghetto, i miss albany bowl.... and most of all,

I miss Looking Glass Photo where i used to work and print on the weekends.

🙁

 

[M. Valdemar]

Yes, your intentions were good. But you're skirting the question.

I won't create an argument and keep repeating myself after this, but regardless of your excellent intentions, you had doubts about the seller. You didn't get a reply to your questions. But then you placed a bid for the item.

A bid is a contract to complete the auction.

So why, if you had ANY doubt whatsoever, would you close the auction before all your questions were answered and your doubts were unresolved?

You don't win an auction THEN say "I want you to verify certain things". Bidding implies you have ALREADY satisfied yourself that you have no further questions and that you are ready to immediately purchase the item.

That's my only point. I'm not arguing intent or whether you should have paid or not. I would not be happy if you lost your money.

BUT, you don't drive your car into an intersection without looking first to make sure the coast is clear.

If you don't look first, and get into an accident, your excuse can't be "I intended to look carefully but I already drove into the intersection"

 

[trev2401]

Valdemar,

refer to my last post.

thanks.


To all,

I started this thread to alert fellow M users of such a user and my of my recent experience on the bay.

If my bidding habbits are wrong, or perhaps not agreeable to those reading this thread. Well, ok... point taken.

All in all, i hope everyone's aware of the listing and the seller. If you are a seller on eboy, good luck on your sales. For potential buyers, do your ground work i guess.


Due to the increasing number of pointers and assumptions about how I have/should conduct my transactions on the bay (I'm even receiving PMs on this!!!) This thread is now closed.

Thanks all!!!

 

[Thardy]

The only thing you will lose is your 100% rating.

 

[foto_fool]

"A bid is a contract"? You're kidding, right? A contract is legally enforceable - something that nothing that happens on eBay is. And if you don't believe that, try to get eBay or PayPal to force a true deadbeat bidder to pay.

At best your bid is a conditional indication that you are willing to pay for goods that actually exist. eBay works on trust only, and the crooks scamming on eBay are taking advantage of it. Screwing over a crooked seller is not going to jeopardize your feedback score.

The facts presented are that the OP made an offer on an item which he had every intention of performing on, an offer which the seller agreed to. Apparently the seller had no goods to deliver. Which one of them committed fraud? Quit blaming the victim here.

And with that, like the OP I am done with this thread.

- John

 

[Paul T.]

I have never done what Trevor done and asked questions after an auction. But I haven't needed to. It's an open commercial market and that's his prerogative.

I always send my phone number and address when I send an invoice for an eBay purchase. If I received an invoice, or an email, I deemed suspicious after the sale, I would make more enquiries, too. If someone did that for me, I would be helpful up to the point where he turned obnoxious, and then I'd put a NPB strike on him to hurry him/her up, NOT ignore him.

Otherwise, do we have to abide by some notional, unstated eBay etiquette, even when we're damn sure we're going to get ripped off?

All that said, I wouldn't touch an auction with an unverified seller, and hence a low PayPal guarantee, unless I could collect the item in person.

 

[oscroft]

Ooh, scary - I saw an auction on eBay UK that to the best of my memory was identical to that one. I spotted that it's a Classic and contacted the seller, who thanked me for pointing out his error. I had no interest in the camera, but I didn't suspect it was fraudulent.

So, my thanks go to trev2401 for alerting us to this one.

 

[Spider67]

Thanks Trev!

To me it's clear
a) He asks about info before bidding
b) he is told that he will get the info when he makes a bid
c) He asks for that info

Trevs questions would have been obnoxious if the tem was a selction of coat hangers for 25 $
but as it was a 1000 $+ item he was right to do so.
Plus: He made sure that his assumptions were right instead of just backing out and let others be scammed.

 

[JNewell]

once again, the questions were asked before the auction was closed, which the seller did not answer, asking me to send an offer first. I only asked for a phone call prior to sending payment. Only then did i poke further.

Gently speaking, I think the lesson is that if you don't get answers before it closes, cancel your bid and don't offer any further bids. Invoke the golden rule of eBay: the person who has the gold, rules.

 

[trev2401]

thanks guys... i really appreciate your comments. 🙂