bence8810
Well-known
Hello,
I started analogue photography over Christmas so this would mean I am an absolute rookie at it.
I shoot mainly Black&White on 135 and 120 as well.
While metering light / using a manual camera / developing BnW film has been rather easey to learn (on a basic level), what troubles me is scanning.
What I find is that there's no "perfect" way of going about it, no one recipe etc and this makes it hard. I spend countless hours trying to do the right thing and I thought I might ask you guys to see if you could point me the right direction, if there is such a thing anyways.
This is what I have:
Konica IIIa rangefinder
Minoltacord TLR
Kodak TMAX100 and 400 films (home developed in TMAX)
Kodak Ektar100 (2rolls total - shop developed)
Fujicolor100 (2 rolls total - shop developed)
Epson V750 scanner used with Epson software
My process for BnW:
After developing the film, I put the film guide directly on the glass and scan the complete roll from the surface directly to create a contact sheet at 300dpi and then set curves in PS, see my contacts below:
http://www.celifornia.com/owncloud/public.php?service=gallery&t=c46e08af253224bea8fa3a8ded1ee271
From the color films, the first and last are the Fuji and the two in the middle are the Ektar.
For BnW, once the contact sheet is scanned, I pick the framesI want, scan them almost entirely flat (0-255 - gamma1) individually using the designated trays (Epson OEM). I pull the whites and blacks in as much as possible (push the markers to the edge of the histogram) and then make it flat (bright) by moving the middle marker towards the left. Once scanned, I use PS and add curves, sometimes to the whole image, sometimes to the subject only etc. this seems to work ok for BnW. I am doing this as a photographer friend showed me the technique. He says this way we can retain the most information in the image, even in the almost burned out parts or the blacks.
For color, I kind of gave up. I could not get one decent image out, I ended up over processing them in PS and losing the "quality" of the film.
I scanned them flat like I learnt I should with BnW.
My questions are the following.
Is what I do to get contact sheets fine? One tales about 5 minutes to do.
Is what I do with BnW scanning correct? Scanning flat and then PS...
What do I do to get better scanning results with Color?
And finally, I know this scanner isn't perfect, the tray isn't perfect, the way I dry my film isn't perfect (not flat) so I can't tell if an image is slightly out of focus on my monitor is really out of focus when captured or not. How to examine the film pre-scanning? I don't have any equipment, light or magnifying glass etc, but i am happy to buy if I know what I should.
Thanks so much for helping out! It has been a very rewarding journey thus fur! I am on my 27th roll since Dec16th, which marked my first roll ever.
Ben
Sent from my iPhone using Forum Runner
I started analogue photography over Christmas so this would mean I am an absolute rookie at it.
I shoot mainly Black&White on 135 and 120 as well.
While metering light / using a manual camera / developing BnW film has been rather easey to learn (on a basic level), what troubles me is scanning.
What I find is that there's no "perfect" way of going about it, no one recipe etc and this makes it hard. I spend countless hours trying to do the right thing and I thought I might ask you guys to see if you could point me the right direction, if there is such a thing anyways.
This is what I have:
Konica IIIa rangefinder
Minoltacord TLR
Kodak TMAX100 and 400 films (home developed in TMAX)
Kodak Ektar100 (2rolls total - shop developed)
Fujicolor100 (2 rolls total - shop developed)
Epson V750 scanner used with Epson software
My process for BnW:
After developing the film, I put the film guide directly on the glass and scan the complete roll from the surface directly to create a contact sheet at 300dpi and then set curves in PS, see my contacts below:
http://www.celifornia.com/owncloud/public.php?service=gallery&t=c46e08af253224bea8fa3a8ded1ee271
From the color films, the first and last are the Fuji and the two in the middle are the Ektar.
For BnW, once the contact sheet is scanned, I pick the framesI want, scan them almost entirely flat (0-255 - gamma1) individually using the designated trays (Epson OEM). I pull the whites and blacks in as much as possible (push the markers to the edge of the histogram) and then make it flat (bright) by moving the middle marker towards the left. Once scanned, I use PS and add curves, sometimes to the whole image, sometimes to the subject only etc. this seems to work ok for BnW. I am doing this as a photographer friend showed me the technique. He says this way we can retain the most information in the image, even in the almost burned out parts or the blacks.
For color, I kind of gave up. I could not get one decent image out, I ended up over processing them in PS and losing the "quality" of the film.
I scanned them flat like I learnt I should with BnW.
My questions are the following.
Is what I do to get contact sheets fine? One tales about 5 minutes to do.
Is what I do with BnW scanning correct? Scanning flat and then PS...
What do I do to get better scanning results with Color?
And finally, I know this scanner isn't perfect, the tray isn't perfect, the way I dry my film isn't perfect (not flat) so I can't tell if an image is slightly out of focus on my monitor is really out of focus when captured or not. How to examine the film pre-scanning? I don't have any equipment, light or magnifying glass etc, but i am happy to buy if I know what I should.
Thanks so much for helping out! It has been a very rewarding journey thus fur! I am on my 27th roll since Dec16th, which marked my first roll ever.
Ben
Sent from my iPhone using Forum Runner
thegman
Veteran
HI Ben,
I think first you have to decide what is 'better' for you. What are you not happy with, the colour?
I think contact sheets are fine for checking composition etc. but for adjustments, I'd be working on a frame by frame basic. Take a full-res scan (3200dpi or 6400dpi) of one frame, and think about what you want to change.
If it's colour, personally, I just use Paint.NET, and only ever change the curves and saturation.
If it's scanner noise in the shadows, I like Neat Image.
If you're concerned about film flatness, I'd get some anti-Newton ring glass from Better Scanning. I found their film holders and glass a massive improvement over the stock stuff, unless you can get your film to dry flat, then it does not make too much difference.
If you want to check focus just by looking at it, a light box and a loupe is the way to go, does not need to cost much, and you'll know for certain if the shot is in focus or if it's your scanning. Also, on one roll, stop down to f/8 or something, put the lens at infinity and take a shot of a distant object, you're pretty much guaranteed sharp focus of the object. So then you have a benchmark to check your scanner against.
I think first you have to decide what is 'better' for you. What are you not happy with, the colour?
I think contact sheets are fine for checking composition etc. but for adjustments, I'd be working on a frame by frame basic. Take a full-res scan (3200dpi or 6400dpi) of one frame, and think about what you want to change.
If it's colour, personally, I just use Paint.NET, and only ever change the curves and saturation.
If it's scanner noise in the shadows, I like Neat Image.
If you're concerned about film flatness, I'd get some anti-Newton ring glass from Better Scanning. I found their film holders and glass a massive improvement over the stock stuff, unless you can get your film to dry flat, then it does not make too much difference.
If you want to check focus just by looking at it, a light box and a loupe is the way to go, does not need to cost much, and you'll know for certain if the shot is in focus or if it's your scanning. Also, on one roll, stop down to f/8 or something, put the lens at infinity and take a shot of a distant object, you're pretty much guaranteed sharp focus of the object. So then you have a benchmark to check your scanner against.
Orbiter
Established
Hello Ben,
If you haven't seen it already, you might try spending some time on this website: http://www.kenleegallery.com/html/tech/index.php Great information about scanning, especially black and white. Also interesting ideas about image processing and printing.
If you haven't seen it already, you might try spending some time on this website: http://www.kenleegallery.com/html/tech/index.php Great information about scanning, especially black and white. Also interesting ideas about image processing and printing.
Ranchu
Veteran
frank-grumman
Well-known
B.J.Scharp
Still developing
Another great article on getting good colour out of a v700/v750 using Vuescan is this one:
http://benneh.net/tech****/better-colour-neg-scanning-with-vuescan/.
Helped me enormously.
http://benneh.net/tech****/better-colour-neg-scanning-with-vuescan/.
Helped me enormously.
bence8810
Well-known
Thank you for all the links. Ken Lee should be crowned! I thought I knew BnW scanning well enough but I ended up spending a good 2 hours on his site and my mind was blown away. I'll definitely start using his guidance on my next scanning session this weekend.
As for Color, I'll go with Ranchu's settings, although I believe mine are rather close to it and i have been unhappy mostly. I need to double check what I have! I don't do the ICE thingy and will not I believe, its too slow and my negatives are clean as I pay meticulous care to them.
Can't wait to post back with positive results! Meantime, I hope there are others who might share their 2 cents here...
Ben
As for Color, I'll go with Ranchu's settings, although I believe mine are rather close to it and i have been unhappy mostly. I need to double check what I have! I don't do the ICE thingy and will not I believe, its too slow and my negatives are clean as I pay meticulous care to them.
Can't wait to post back with positive results! Meantime, I hope there are others who might share their 2 cents here...
Ben