Scarcity of 7s and 7sz ????

[harry01562]

EBay has been a strange, sometimes wonderful thing for a long time, but the recent situation is really strange to me. There are currently 3 7sz and 1 7s offered, with an other 7sz recently closed at $738. One is a re-list, where the high bidder (kinche-l) didn't reach reserve.
I can't ever remember even a couple being offered, and now we have 4 in less than a week + a 7s, which is not chopped liver!!!
I've said before that I think the 7s/7sz is one of the nicest RF's to use as a shooter. The prices aren't cheap, especially as 2 are offered with the 0.95, but price a decent M-Leica with fast glass for a comparison.
I'm not in the running for anything, as I own too many now, but I wonder at the timing of the whole thing. At least 2, possibly 3 of the Z's are new to my SN list, so they are appearing for the first time, IMHO. I can understand a rash of P's, as they produced those in comparative large numbers, but this seems odd.
Could possibly be a fine opportunity to get a super shooter as a holiday gift.

BTW, no relationship with any of the sellers, or buyers, for that matter.

Harry

 

[physiognomy]

I saw a couple of the auctions you mention & quickly looked away... I would love one, but now is not the right time for me.

Peter

 

[dexdog]

According to Dechert's book, only about 4000 were ever made. It seems that a lot of them are showing up on eBay lately. Great cameras, I own 2 of them.

 

[jlw]

I'm not in the running for anything, as I own too many now, but I wonder at the timing of the whole thing. At least 2, possibly 3 of the Z's are new to my SN list, so they are appearing for the first time, IMHO.

What would you want to bet that "raising money for an M8" figures into this phenomenon? If my theory is correct, we could be seeing a lot of desirable classic RFs turning up on the selling block.

Heck, I'm even thinking about selling my non-Z 7s -- not so much for my M8 fund as simply that anymore I seldom get the chance to use the 7s as much as it deserves. (Fortunately, it's off at Essex getting a CLA, so temptation is removed for the moment.) I agree that the 7s is absolutely stellar to shoot with: effective RF, good selection of framelines, just enough modern conveniences (e.g. hinged back, Oskar) and wonderful quality feel -- I still think the film advance is smoother than that of a L****.


What would I do without a 7s? Probably indulge my Canon cravings by trying to amass all the weird, wonderful little add-ons for my VI-T... which might turn out to be a substantially more expensive pursuit!

Footnote for those who have wondered: Thanks to another RFFer, who last year sent me photos of his 7sZ while its top cover was off for maintenance, I can speculate in an informed way that the only significant design difference is the way the vertical adjuster is incorporated into the RF mechanism. The 7s (like the 7) uses a screw that raises or lowers the secondary mirror on a spring-mounted platform -- effective, but touchy and jiggly to adjust. The 7sZ uses a separate adjuster mounted in a revolving drum just outboard of the beamsplitter -- undoubtedly this makes adjustment easier, but shouldn't change the view that much. In other words, the 7sZ has higher collector value because of its rarity and its status as the last Canon system-RF model, but in terms of user experience, I speculate that the 7s and 7sZ would be pretty similar. Of course, anyone who owns both is welcome to contribute an authoritative appraisal of this speculation!​

 

[John Shriver]

I got my 7s from Adorama's website. They will often list the same item on eBay and their site, although in this case they had two, one on eBay, the other on the website. A very modest $374 -- they seem to overprice their Canon 7 camers, and underprice the 7s cameras.

 

[Mackinaw]

What would you want to bet that "raising money for an M8" figures into this phenomenon? If my theory is correct, we could be seeing a lot of desirable classic RFs turning up on the selling block.

I think you're on to something here. No doubt the M8 phenomena is drawing folks away from classic film rangefinders to digital.

I, too, and considering selling my 7sZ, but not bcause I'm buying an M8. About 99% of my 35mm shooting is with my MP with my Canon rangefinders just sitting in my cabinet collecting dust. I'll probably part with the 7sZ and keep the L1 and 7. Probably soon too, if I can get my act together.

Jim Bielecki

 

[Mackinaw]

Footnote for those who have wondered: Thanks to another RFFer, who last year sent me photos of his 7sZ while its top cover was off for maintenance, I can speculate in an informed way that the only significant design difference is the way the vertical adjuster is incorporated into the RF mechanism. The 7s (like the 7) uses a screw that raises or lowers the secondary mirror on a spring-mounted platform -- effective, but touchy and jiggly to adjust. The 7sZ uses a separate adjuster mounted in a revolving drum just outboard of the beamsplitter -- undoubtedly this makes adjustment easier, but shouldn't change the view that much. In other words, the 7sZ has higher collector value because of its rarity and its status as the last Canon system-RF model, but in terms of user experience, I speculate that the 7s and 7sZ would be pretty similar. Of course, anyone who owns both is welcome to contribute an authoritative appraisal of this speculation![/indent]

Just read the rest of your note. In practice, I find very little operational diference between the 7 or 7s. While adjusting the rangefinder is easier in a 7sZ, Im one of the apparent few who never regarded adjusting the rangefinder in the 7 all that difficult.

Dechert makes a big deal, in his Canon Rangefinder book, about the near-sighted/far-sighted advantage of the 7sZ viewfinder. Honestly, I can't see any visual difference when comparing the viewfinders of the 7 or 7s.

I will say that there are less reflections in the 7sZ viewfinder when compared to a 7, but operationally, to me, this is hadly a deal breaker.

Both are fine cameras.

Jim Bielecki

 

[Will]

What would you want to bet that "raising money for an M8" figures into this phenomenon? If my theory is correct, we could be seeing a lot of desirable classic RFs turning up on the selling block.

Heck, I'm even thinking about selling my non-Z 7s -- not so much for my M8 fund as simply that anymore I seldom get the chance to use the 7s as much as it deserves. (Fortunately, it's off at Essex getting a CLA, so temptation is removed for the moment.) I agree that the 7s is absolutely stellar to shoot with: effective RF, good selection of framelines, just enough modern conveniences (e.g. hinged back, Oskar) and wonderful quality feel -- I still think the film advance is smoother than that of a L****.


What would I do without a 7s? Probably indulge my Canon cravings by trying to amass all the weird, wonderful little add-ons for my VI-T... which might turn out to be a substantially more expensive pursuit!

Footnote for those who have wondered: Thanks to another RFFer, who last year sent me photos of his 7sZ while its top cover was off for maintenance, I can speculate in an informed way that the only significant design difference is the way the vertical adjuster is incorporated into the RF mechanism. The 7s (like the 7) uses a screw that raises or lowers the secondary mirror on a spring-mounted platform -- effective, but touchy and jiggly to adjust. The 7sZ uses a separate adjuster mounted in a revolving drum just outboard of the beamsplitter -- undoubtedly this makes adjustment easier, but shouldn't change the view that much. In other words, the 7sZ has higher collector value because of its rarity and its status as the last Canon system-RF model, but in terms of user experience, I speculate that the 7s and 7sZ would be pretty similar. Of course, anyone who owns both is welcome to contribute an authoritative appraisal of this speculation!​

The winder is smoother than a M2, let me tell you that, it's alright I guess..

Wouldn't mind having a minty body (later, and a mint M3 too...LOL)

Been busy and didn't keep up with rangefinder stuffs over the last 3 months, what's happening to the prices to the P?

 

[Kim Coxon]

Interesting, Kinch-l is a dealer (Kevin Camera) He rarely bids more than "trade" price and so probably thinks that they are still worth something. Thew seller obviously did too if it failed to meet the reserve. I wonder if it is more that people sre reluctant to buy now rather than sellers trying to raise funds for an M8. We are also into the Xmas selling season and this might have more to do with it. The M8 is not the holy grail for all. 😉

Kim

EBay has been a strange, sometimes wonderful thing for a long time, but the recent situation is really strange to me. There are currently 3 7sz and 1 7s offered, with an other 7sz recently closed at $738. One is a re-list, where the high bidder (kinche-l) didn't reach reserve.