nico
Well-known
M. Valdemar said:
If I saw a dictatorship on ebay is from sellers: paid good money for crappy camera and "forced" to leave positive feedback to avoid a negative one on my side. I can't see any buyers' dicatorship here, it's sellers' at least.
About seller scammers, you shift responsibility from ebay poor security system on to the feedback to the buyer.
Last but not at least, would you a sell and ship a good camera before buyer's payment on the promise you'll get your feedback after leaving yours to the buyer? If yes send me a pm
ciao
sepiareverb
genius and moron
nico said:...Last but not at least, would you a sell and ship a good camera before buyer's payment on the promise you'll get your feedback after leaving yours to the buyer? If yes send me a pm
ciao
If ebay had started out that way and feedback was truthful we all might find that normal.
M. Valdemar
Well-known
On items priced over $200 I insist on wire transfer or money order to send overseas.
On items below that I will ship overseas to non-confirmed address if the buyer has good feedback.
In the future, buyer feedback will mean nothing.
Fred, you are in a unique niche where you sell mostly expensive collectibles to reliable collectors and you know your stuff, as they do.
I'm willing to sell internationally with PayPal, but that may have to change.
CASE IN POINT - a few months ago
How about the Canadian buyer who I accepted PayPal from for a Canon FD mount lens? I said in the listing MANUAL FOCUS LENS about a dozen times, then listed the cameras it would fit on, such as A-1, AE-1, etc. I showed clear photos of the lens.
The lens sold for $189 and I allowed PayPal.
One week later, a dispute.
"It doesn't fit on my Canon 5D".
I answered back "Of course it doesn't. Did you read or look at the listing?"
The end result? PayPal lets him win the dispute, of course, gives him back the money. He keeps the lens. I lose over $200, including shipping, with no recourse.
A month later, I see he sold it himself.
How will that play out with the new rules?
On items below that I will ship overseas to non-confirmed address if the buyer has good feedback.
In the future, buyer feedback will mean nothing.
Fred, you are in a unique niche where you sell mostly expensive collectibles to reliable collectors and you know your stuff, as they do.
I'm willing to sell internationally with PayPal, but that may have to change.
CASE IN POINT - a few months ago
How about the Canadian buyer who I accepted PayPal from for a Canon FD mount lens? I said in the listing MANUAL FOCUS LENS about a dozen times, then listed the cameras it would fit on, such as A-1, AE-1, etc. I showed clear photos of the lens.
The lens sold for $189 and I allowed PayPal.
One week later, a dispute.
"It doesn't fit on my Canon 5D".
I answered back "Of course it doesn't. Did you read or look at the listing?"
The end result? PayPal lets him win the dispute, of course, gives him back the money. He keeps the lens. I lose over $200, including shipping, with no recourse.
A month later, I see he sold it himself.
How will that play out with the new rules?
literiter
Well-known
I have had no really bad transactions on Ebay as yet as a buyer or a seller.
But I light of some of the info on this and other sites I will reconsider my dealings through Ebay. I'm not in the mood to get ripped off it I have no recourse.
Ebay may be a little too big now, perhaps a good alternative will spring up.. lets hope.
But I light of some of the info on this and other sites I will reconsider my dealings through Ebay. I'm not in the mood to get ripped off it I have no recourse.
Ebay may be a little too big now, perhaps a good alternative will spring up.. lets hope.
nico
Well-known
M. Valdemar said:
Sorry to hear that but as I wrote above the problem was in the Paypal dispute system when your money got back to the buyer with no need for him to demonstrate he sent you back the lens or not allowing you to "sue" him when he was sellling your lens.
gdi
Veteran
M. Valdemar said:
How can it be worse than the old rules? Under the system you are defending you lost the money and you lost the lens!
How did the fact that you could leave negative for the buyer help you? It is bad that you lost your money but to try to say that this situation was better than what would happen with the new feedback scheme is illogical.
The sellers who are giving examples of how buyers ripped them off are proving the point that the whole feedback extortion approach is not working. I assert that these bad apple buyers are going to find a way to rip off people no matter what. The only logical reason to want to have the ability to neg a buyer seems to be to force them to provide positive feedback so your eBay rep is improved. That is far from protecting the seller from losing money or merchandise.
gdi
Veteran
There seems to be a lot of turmoil around this on the web (not just our civil debate )!
Talk of a large exodus, boycotts, etc. I wonder if eBay will succumb to pressure and back off on the feedback change?
)!Talk of a large exodus, boycotts, etc. I wonder if eBay will succumb to pressure and back off on the feedback change?
CSB 5858
Member
The New Way to Make Money On Ebay?
The New Way to Make Money On Ebay?
The Once and Future Queen?
With long time Ebay CEO Meg Whitman out, and the new CEO seemingly clueless as mistake after mistake is made both on Ebay's and Paypal's new policies, will Meg find herself in position, say two years from now, to "save" Ebay after a disastrous downfall in sales and profit, face to face with a huge contract and new found equity position?
In the mean time, is the new way to make money on Ebay buying Ebay stock SHORT?
Alex
The New Way to Make Money On Ebay?
The Once and Future Queen?
With long time Ebay CEO Meg Whitman out, and the new CEO seemingly clueless as mistake after mistake is made both on Ebay's and Paypal's new policies, will Meg find herself in position, say two years from now, to "save" Ebay after a disastrous downfall in sales and profit, face to face with a huge contract and new found equity position?
In the mean time, is the new way to make money on Ebay buying Ebay stock SHORT?
Alex
ARCHIVIST
Well-known
All good things come to an end.
Peter
Peter
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David Murphy
Veteran
I'm just amused how many eBay buyers seem to have a sense of entitlement to rights of various sorts beyond that extended to sellers. What-in-the world engenders this selfish attitude?! Perhaps the legacy of that lawyer Ralph Nader?
Either the sellers will pass the cost of increased fees and unacceptable exposure to financial risk on to the buyers (some how, some way), or else they'll disappear leaving higher prices and less selection in their wake. Buyers will not win in this divide and conquer strategy of the eBay Wall Street suits -- eBay might gain -- not really clear yet.
Either the sellers will pass the cost of increased fees and unacceptable exposure to financial risk on to the buyers (some how, some way), or else they'll disappear leaving higher prices and less selection in their wake. Buyers will not win in this divide and conquer strategy of the eBay Wall Street suits -- eBay might gain -- not really clear yet.
David Goldfarb
Well-known
I don't see a problem with this change actually, and I both sell and buy on eBay.
It clarifies that the buyer's only responsibility is to pay for the item, and if they don't, it raises the stakes, so that a seller's recourse is to initiate a non-paying bidder dispute. A seller can't complain about a bidder who wins and pays, but is annoying for some other reason. If a bidder is a slow-payer, then there is no halfway measure. The seller either puts up with it or initiates a non-paying bidder dispute.
I've successfully initiated non-paying bidder disputes, and it can be a pain and slows down the process of moving stuff out of my apartment, but I haven't gotten any negative feedback or lost any money or merchandise, and the non-payers have had their accounts closed and negative feedback they've left has been removed. In cases where it was an obvious scam with a high-end item and a Nigerian counterfeit cashier's check scheme, eBay acted quickly, ended the transaction, banned the scammer, and I could relist in about a day or so.
Bidders can now more freely give negative or neutral feedback when sellers don't represent items accurately or state their terms clearly without fear of retaliatory feedback. If there is a disagreement, then the seller can post a response to the feedback, which is more appropriate than posting retaliatory negative feedback, presuming the bidder has paid for the item.
It clarifies that the buyer's only responsibility is to pay for the item, and if they don't, it raises the stakes, so that a seller's recourse is to initiate a non-paying bidder dispute. A seller can't complain about a bidder who wins and pays, but is annoying for some other reason. If a bidder is a slow-payer, then there is no halfway measure. The seller either puts up with it or initiates a non-paying bidder dispute.
I've successfully initiated non-paying bidder disputes, and it can be a pain and slows down the process of moving stuff out of my apartment, but I haven't gotten any negative feedback or lost any money or merchandise, and the non-payers have had their accounts closed and negative feedback they've left has been removed. In cases where it was an obvious scam with a high-end item and a Nigerian counterfeit cashier's check scheme, eBay acted quickly, ended the transaction, banned the scammer, and I could relist in about a day or so.
Bidders can now more freely give negative or neutral feedback when sellers don't represent items accurately or state their terms clearly without fear of retaliatory feedback. If there is a disagreement, then the seller can post a response to the feedback, which is more appropriate than posting retaliatory negative feedback, presuming the bidder has paid for the item.
David Murphy
Veteran
David Goldfarb said:
David I understand where you're coming from -- I really do. I never give buyers a negative rating unless they ding me first, which means they did not try to resolve the matter with me or they tried to rip me off and failed (I'm talking perhaps 0.3% of transactions). Unfortunately though all our feedback scores will go down now since buyers can (and will) give us negative feedback for issues simply beyond our control such as a slow postal system, or even worse: buyers regret.
David Murphy
Veteran
David Murphy said:
The only point of the eBay changes is to make more money for eBay -- don't lose sight of that.
bottley1
only to feel
lift up the ebay rock......you never know what will crawl out! As someone else has observed "there are some real jerks out there"