Shutter Release Problem - Please Chime In

S

Sean Reid

Guest
I'd love to hear from other R-D1 owners about the following:

From time to time (much more often recently) I've found that my shutter release will not trip the shutter even after the advance has been fully cocked. Until today, when this had happened I had been, out of film camera habit, moving the advance lever through its arc a second time. That always seemed to fix the problem (an illusion and coincidence, I now think). Today I discovered a pattern that seemed to point to a problem unrelated to the shutter cocking lever.

The problem does not ever seem to occur when the LCD is folded in (unless the battery is near dead but I'll ignore that exception for obvious reasons). If the LCD is folded out, this problem will sometimes occur even if that LCD is turned off. I discovered today that the solution is to simply release the shutter and press it again (even if the LCD has been off for some time prior to the first shutter press).

First, I think Epson should modify the camera (by firmware if possible) so that a single press of the shutter release not only turns off the LCD (when its on) but also releases the shutter. This is the norm on DSLRs and there's no good reason for needing a double press. It seems to me that my unit is sometimes sending an "LCD on" message to the brain unit responsible for the shutter release *even when the LCD is off*. A loose wire? A bad connection? Dunno yet. Before I bring this problem to Epson I wanted to find out who else (if anyone) is experiencing it.

If you own an R-D1 and can spare a free moment, would you please test your camera to see if it displays this behavior. A friend of mine is currently testing a review unit from Epson and that unit seems to be behaving similarly. I suspect that there could be something amiss in the wires that go from the moveable LCD unit to the body. Might they be fragile?

Along with your response, please indicate approx. serial number and approx. number of exposures made by the camera so far.

Thanks,

Sean
 
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Sean,
No problems with mine. The only time when I have to press again or wait is when the lcd is on or I have shot two frames in rapid succession and I have to wait for it to write.
Serial 192x
No frames approx 500.
Cheers,
Chris
 
Good to hear. That suggests that either:

1) They don't all do it

or

2) The problem develops with "higher mileage" units like the press unit and my own (which has just under 5000 exposures)

Thanks, keep m' coming.

Cheers,

Sean
 
I have had this problem occasionally, but it is not frequent enough to pinpoint a cause. I usually decide that the display was on even though I thought it was likely off. A seoond press of the shutter usually fires it.

Ed
 
My R-D1 (001837) works as follows. When the LCD is folded out (but still flush with camera back) and turned on it takes two shutter presses, the first turns the LCD off and the second actuates the shutter. I agree a single press for both would be better. I also tried it with the LCD folded out to 90 deg positions with the same result. When the LCD is off and in any position I never experienced the double press anomally.
I did find that if you leave the LCD on and fold it back to closed it turns off automatically when it is about half way rotated. This indicates there is position sensing switch of some kind. Could your's be staying on when closed some how? (unlikely)
 
Hi oldheader,

I don't think my LCD is staying on because this shutter release problem doesn't occur with the LCD folded in. It seems to be a matter of the shutter release behaving as if the LCD was on even when it isn't. How many exposures on your camera?

Hi Ed,

I used to dismiss the problem too but when my friend George mentioned it to me I started paying more attention to it. How many exposures on your camera?

Thanks,

Sean
 
Sean, my first unit, which took over 2000 pics, I think exhibited this behavior, as does the 3rd one, which I took ~500 pics and just sent back for the Vertical RF problem. It's becoming 2nd nature to me to tab the shutter a couple times now and then.

If the 4th one comes in with any problem, I am going to ask for a refund :-(
// richard
 
didjiman,

Thanks for the post. We shouldn't have to be working around a possible defect like that. I'll hear from as many people as post this weekend and then get on with Epson Monday. I hadn't noticed the problem so much because I don't use the histogram very often. But since my friend George brought it to my attention, I see that my example does indeed have a problem.

Cheers,

Sean
 
Sean, my R-D1 has always behaved as you describe. Sometimes, not often, when the LCD has recently been active the camera just isn't ready for the next shot. Tapping the shutter release puts it right again. I suspect it's a firmware issue, maybe a timing thing, rather than an electronic problem. IMO the camera should always be in shot priority mode. As soon as it senses the shutter release being pressed it should drop whatever else it might be doing and prepare for a capture.

-Dave-
 
Exactly. As I hear back more people perhaps I'll figure how widespread this behavior is.

Cheers Dave,

Sean
 
Mine too

Mine too

Hi Sean,

Thanks for the reviews on Luminous Landscape. My release works exactly as you describe--seems to be a design feature!?

Best,

Charlie Orzech
 
Sean --

Let me make sure I understand the cases involved in this:

-- LCD folded out and turned on: first shutter press turns off LCD; second press fires shutter. (This is how mine behaves.)

-- LCD folded out but not turned on: first press does nothing (turning "off" the LCD that was already off?); second press fires shutter.

-- LCD folded in: first press fires shutter (this is how mine behaves.)

I think we all agree that the first and third cases are designed-in behaviors, whether we like them or not, as everyone's R-D 1 seems to work that way.

It's the second case that is weird. I haven't experienced it (I'd guess my camera is getting on to about 4,000 exposures, but it could be more) but I think we need to pin it down a bit more:

-- Does this happen when you have folded out the LCD but NEVER turned it on with the button?

-- Does it happen after you have had the LCD folded out, turned it on with the button, then turned it off by pressing the shutter release once?

-- Does it happen after you have had the LCD folded out, turned it on with the button, and then turned it off with the button?

-- Or does the LCD eventually "time-out" by itself? I haven't been able to produce this behavior yet, but if it does, I am guessing it might be caused by the whole camera going into power-save mode -- which, as we've all learned the hard way, requires one press of the shutter release (or cycling the power switch) to wake it up, and then a second press to release the shutter.

I have been sitting here fiddling with my R-D 1 as I type this, and haven't been able to produce any non-standard behavior. But as you say, this is an intermittent problem, and those are always the hardest to troubleshoot!

(Another thought: Does this behavior occur regardless of the battery's state of charge? If the battery is close the flat, the LCD might drain it enough to make it shut off; then, after some recovery time, the battery would again have enough power to make an exposure, but you'd still need two presses because the camera's CPU still registers the LCD as on.)
 
jlw said:
... Let me make sure I understand the cases involved in this:
1) LCD folded out and turned on: first shutter press turns off LCD; second press fires shutter. (This is how mine behaves.)
2) LCD folded out but not turned on: first press does nothing (turning "off" the LCD that was already off?); second press fires shutter.
3) LCD folded in: first press fires shutter (this is how mine behaves.)
I think we all agree that the first and third cases are designed-in behaviors...
It's the second case that is weird...
Click to expand...

Never experienced the second case so far: first press fires shutter.
Serial # 0015xx, about 1600 shots.
Best,
LCT
 
Hi Sean,

There was a post on this somewhere else - may have been dpreveiw epson forum. However, here's the thing. If you've reveiwed an image on the LCD and dont switch off the LCD using the menu button, then, what you describe happens consistently i.e. double shutter press required. Switch off the LCD using the menu button and always a single shutter press. Since I picked this up, I have had no problems when I follow this procedure. However, I do still forget and when I do, guess what - two presses required. It should be fixed so that this doesn't happen, but there's the workaround. Hope this helps.

Regards

Gid
 
Im used to the pressing the shutter twice after a screen review now, but it would definitely be better if Epson fixed it by firmware as per Seans suggestion. I have missed a few good shots due to forgetting the need to press twice. I hope it doesn't take Epson long to do something about this.
 
Serial Number 24xx, Exposures approx 1,000.
I have had the problem occassionally but as Ed says its intermitant and I am not sure I have not been able to identify the cause.
Normally mine behaves as follows (from jlw):
-- LCD folded out and turned on: first shutter press turns off LCD; second press fires shutter. (This is how mine behaves as long as I have remembered to cock the shutter after viewing on LCD).
-- LCD folded out but not turned on: first press fires shutter.
-- LCD folded in: first press fires shutter

I think that the intermiitant problem has ony occured for me when the camera has come out of "sleep" mode when it sometimes takes perhaps a bit longer to wake up than I expect. Normally I tap the shutter as I am bringing it up to my eye and its ready (I have timed this and its less than two seconds in most cases) but on the odd occassion it takes two or three presses before it fires.

I will try some more detailed tests along jlw lines to try and pin point it.
 
"-- LCD folded out and turned on: first shutter press turns off LCD; second press fires shutter. (This is how mine behaves.)"

Right, normal behavior

"-- LCD folded out but not turned on: first press does nothing (turning "off" the LCD that was already off?); second press fires shutter."

Right, strange behavior.

"-- LCD folded in: first press fires shutter (this is how mine behaves.)"

Right, normal behavior.

"I think we all agree that the first and third cases are designed-in behaviors, whether we like them or not, as everyone's R-D 1 seems to work that way."

Right

"It's the second case that is weird. I haven't experienced it (I'd guess my camera is getting on to about 4,000 exposures, but it could be more) but I think we need to pin it down a bit more."

We have guests coming today and I'm currently recharging the R-D1 batteries but as soon as time allows, I'll try to do some more specific tests to isolate this problem further.


"-- Or does the LCD eventually "time-out" by itself? I haven't been able to produce this behavior yet, but if it does, I am guessing it might be caused by the whole camera going into power-save mode -- which, as we've all learned the hard way, requires one press of the shutter release (or cycling the power switch) to wake it up, and then a second press to release the shutter."

When the camera goes into sleep mode, the various dials all go to their null positions. That isn't the case when this happens.

"(Another thought: Does this behavior occur regardless of the battery's state of charge? If the battery is close the flat, the LCD might drain it enough to make it shut off; then, after some recovery time, the battery would again have enough power to make an exposure, but you'd still need two presses because the camera's CPU still registers the LCD as on.)[/QUOTE]"

Yes, regardless of battery state. Like any camera, the R-D1 can get flaky when the batt is low but this does not seem to be connected to that.

Cheers,

Sean
 
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