infinitydreams
Established
Hi I'm new to photography but recently got my hands on an Olympus 35RD and I've purchased some Kodak Ektar 100 and Ilford HP5 Plus 400.
I've done some searching and have seen the sunny 16 mentioned but am wondering if for a camera with an auto exposure that there is a simple guide I.e. HP5 on a sunny day equals 1/250
HP5 on cloudy day equals 1/500
Now I know there is no perfect setting but I'm just after a basic guide so I can shoot some film and start the learning curve.
I've done some searching and have seen the sunny 16 mentioned but am wondering if for a camera with an auto exposure that there is a simple guide I.e. HP5 on a sunny day equals 1/250
HP5 on cloudy day equals 1/500
Now I know there is no perfect setting but I'm just after a basic guide so I can shoot some film and start the learning curve.
Gabriel M.A.
My Red Dot Glows For You
Shutter speeds explained: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shutter_speed
Sunny 16 rule digested: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sunny_16_rule
Sunny 16 rule digested: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sunny_16_rule
Roger Hicks
Veteran
Take a look at the Exposure guide (when you haven't a meter, from Basics) from:
http://www.rogerandfrances.com/subscription/ps basics expoguide.html
Cheers,
R.
http://www.rogerandfrances.com/subscription/ps basics expoguide.html
Cheers,
R.
infinitydreams
Established
Thats interesting.
So for example today at 2pm the sun was out but was low and was creating some serious shadows in the local park. If using iso400 film would you go for a 1/250 shutter speed?
So for example today at 2pm the sun was out but was low and was creating some serious shadows in the local park. If using iso400 film would you go for a 1/250 shutter speed?
gb hill
Veteran
Being new to photography you are aware that HP-5 isn't developed the same as Kodak Ektar don't you?
It's fun to learn B&W at home if you're not aware. welcom to the forum BTW.
TXForester
Well-known
The sunny 16 rule assumes you are not using an automatic (or semi-automatic) setting such as the shutter priority setting on the 35RD. You would be shooting in manual where you set the shutter speed and the aperture yourself.
Correct exposure is based on a combination of the strength of the light, film speed, shutter speed and aperture. Lets say you figured out the settings for your subject. Now if one of those factors changes (often the light if are using ambient light-not flash), then one or more of the other factors must change to get the same exposure again. Usually you only change one factor (shutter speed or aperture).
Example: If you are shooting HP5 (400 ISO film) on a bright sunlit day with your subject in direct light, then you might use 1/500s @ f-16. If the sky becomes lightly overcast, but there are still distinct shadows then the light has dropped roughly one stop. That means you need to change the shutter speed or aperture by one stop to compensate. You could change the shutter speed to 1/250 (shutter stays open longer to let in more light), or you can leave it at 1/500 and open the aperture one stop (go from f16 to f11). What you choose depends on whether shutter speed (freezing or blurring movement) or aperture (depth of field) is more important to you.
There will be other times where your settings are in the middle of the shutter speed range and and aperture range and you have the leeway to change both shutter speed and aperture to account for change of light.
Also in this type of situation if the light stays the same you can change both aperture and shutter speed to get another effect for the photo while keeping the exposure the same. For example you are taking a photo of a friend and you get the right exposure at 1/125 and f8. Now lets say you want your friend to jump off the ground and you are going to freeze his action in mid air. You switch to 1/500 (two stops down from 1/125) to stop the action and you compensate by opening the aperture by two stops (from f8 to f4). The exposure remains the same.
Lets say you wanted to get more depth of field for your friend's portrait. You close the aperture (lets say two stops from the original f8 to f16). Now you must open the shutter two stops to compensate (from 1/125 to 1/30). Again, the exposure stays the same.
For manual shooting, I'd print a small copy of the sunny 16 rule and carry it with you. Try this one. http://www.fredparker.com/ultexp1.htm It is actually two charts that work together, but it will show you that for any lighting condition there is a wide variety of settings for film speed, shutter speed and aperture that will give you the same (correct) exposure.
Correct exposure is based on a combination of the strength of the light, film speed, shutter speed and aperture. Lets say you figured out the settings for your subject. Now if one of those factors changes (often the light if are using ambient light-not flash), then one or more of the other factors must change to get the same exposure again. Usually you only change one factor (shutter speed or aperture).
Example: If you are shooting HP5 (400 ISO film) on a bright sunlit day with your subject in direct light, then you might use 1/500s @ f-16. If the sky becomes lightly overcast, but there are still distinct shadows then the light has dropped roughly one stop. That means you need to change the shutter speed or aperture by one stop to compensate. You could change the shutter speed to 1/250 (shutter stays open longer to let in more light), or you can leave it at 1/500 and open the aperture one stop (go from f16 to f11). What you choose depends on whether shutter speed (freezing or blurring movement) or aperture (depth of field) is more important to you.
There will be other times where your settings are in the middle of the shutter speed range and and aperture range and you have the leeway to change both shutter speed and aperture to account for change of light.
Also in this type of situation if the light stays the same you can change both aperture and shutter speed to get another effect for the photo while keeping the exposure the same. For example you are taking a photo of a friend and you get the right exposure at 1/125 and f8. Now lets say you want your friend to jump off the ground and you are going to freeze his action in mid air. You switch to 1/500 (two stops down from 1/125) to stop the action and you compensate by opening the aperture by two stops (from f8 to f4). The exposure remains the same.
Lets say you wanted to get more depth of field for your friend's portrait. You close the aperture (lets say two stops from the original f8 to f16). Now you must open the shutter two stops to compensate (from 1/125 to 1/30). Again, the exposure stays the same.
For manual shooting, I'd print a small copy of the sunny 16 rule and carry it with you. Try this one. http://www.fredparker.com/ultexp1.htm It is actually two charts that work together, but it will show you that for any lighting condition there is a wide variety of settings for film speed, shutter speed and aperture that will give you the same (correct) exposure.
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infinitydreams
Established
Being new to photography you are aware that HP-5 isn't developed the same as Kodak Ektar don't you?
It's fun to learn B&W at home if you're not aware. welcom to the forum BTW.
I don't understand as they are both negative film not slide. I was going to get the Ilford processed by Ilford and the Kodak I'm still deciding.
Richard G
Veteran
Colour negative (Kodak Ektar) is the ubiquitous, relatively now, C-41 processing. That works reliably for only one Kodak black and white film and one Ilford film both designed to be processed in the standard high street store colour machine. But your HP5+ needs a dedicated black and white treatment less widely available, more expensive usually, and as noted above, more cheaply and quite easily done at home.
infinitydreams
Established
Oh didn't know that thanks, but its all good as I've got my account ready and waiting with Ilford to process.
If i wanted to use the automatic mode on my olympus how would I then know what shutter speed to select?
If i wanted to use the automatic mode on my olympus how would I then know what shutter speed to select?
StaaleS
Established
If you are using an automatic camera, in automatic mode, and the light-meter on the camera actually works and gets the correct voltage from the battery - which is very very far from given, since these cameras were designed for mercury batteries back in the seventies which behave very differently from the batteries you get over the counter nowadays - it will not matter; just set the ISO speed on the camera to whatever ISO the film is, set the shutter speed you _want_ to use, and shoot. The camera will automatically set the aperture to the "correct" value given the light-metering the camera gets when you press the shutter. That's the whole point of automation in the first place
If I remember correctly, the Olympus will refuse to take the shot if it is so bright or so dark that it can't get a correct exposure by adjusting the aperture.
Sunny-sixteen comes into play when you are _not_ using the camera in automatic mode, ie when you explicitly sets aperture and shutter speed manually. In that case: In bright sunlight, set aperture to f/16 (or perhaps f/11 in Northern Europe, for example; the sun is weaker here), set shutter speed to 1/ISO seconds (where ISO is the ISO rating of the film you are using), and shoot. Works pretty well actually. When in doubt, overexpose; common negative film has lots of leeway for overexposure. (Not valid for Kodak Ektar or for positive film.)
If I remember correctly, the Olympus will refuse to take the shot if it is so bright or so dark that it can't get a correct exposure by adjusting the aperture.
Sunny-sixteen comes into play when you are _not_ using the camera in automatic mode, ie when you explicitly sets aperture and shutter speed manually. In that case: In bright sunlight, set aperture to f/16 (or perhaps f/11 in Northern Europe, for example; the sun is weaker here), set shutter speed to 1/ISO seconds (where ISO is the ISO rating of the film you are using), and shoot. Works pretty well actually. When in doubt, overexpose; common negative film has lots of leeway for overexposure. (Not valid for Kodak Ektar or for positive film.)
KenR
Well-known
I use the sunny f/16 rule all the time with generally successful outcomes, but I have never understood the one stop decrease (to f/22) in snow or sand conditions. Isn't the sunlight hitting those places is the same as a grassy field? Isn't the decrease just going to darken the shadows and create more contrast? Shouldn't we actually give N-1 development per the zone system if we want to keep the sand from losing all tones? Please enlighten me.
TXForester
Well-known
If you need to freeze movement, then use a higher shutter speed like 1/250 or 1/500. If you want to blur something moving to give the feeling of motion, then use a slower speed like 1/30 or 1/15.
When you use the automatic mode, you will see the needle in the viewfinder showing the aperture the camera selects when you set a shutter speed. So, in automatic mode if you desire a narrow or deep depth of field, then rotate the shutter speed ring till the needle shows the aperture you want.
From 1/60 to 1/500, you should be able to hand hold the camera steady enough for sharp shots. At 1/30 or slower use a tripod, monopod or brace yourself or camera against a tree or lamp post or anything handy to minimize camera shake.
Here is a link to a pdf file that is a copy of the original 35 RD manual. It has more information. http://www.cameramanuals.org/olympus_pdf/olympus_35rd.pdf
redisburning
Well-known
white reflects a ton of light so your subjects are actually being illuminated as if you had a weak reflector pointed at them. this is assuming a front lit subject and that I am not an idiot.