Yokosuka Mike
Abstract Clarity
Sigma Sd Quattro H, Sigma 30mm f1.4 "Art" lens
Yokohama, Japan
Yokohama, Japan
Larry H-L
Well-known
Mike, what is your impression of the 17mm-70mm zoom?
I noticed today that several retailers have discounted the APS-c SD Quattro and 30mm f1.4 kit down to US$799, and body only is $599.
I noticed today that several retailers have discounted the APS-c SD Quattro and 30mm f1.4 kit down to US$799, and body only is $599.
Yokosuka Mike
Abstract Clarity
Larry, I like the Sigma 17-70mm f2.8-4 "Contemporary" lens just fine.
I live in Japan and I don't own a car which means I use a lot of public transportation (primarily trains) and as such I like to travel light (one camera and one lens). I bought the 17-70mm lens for overnight sightseeing trips so I could have some versatility and the f2.8-4 is something I can live with.
So far I've been impressed with the lens; good image quality and it's not too heavy (actually kind of a light weight).
On the down side, the manual focus ring is not what one finds on the Sigma "Art" prime lenses. It's got a short throw and feels a little feeble. Auto focus works like a champ! (EDIT - Let rephrase that: a champ that is a little slow but very accurate) And, the macro is quite good too!
All-in-all, I like the lens for the intention that I bought it for "lightweight overnight travel".
I hope this helps.
shawn
Veteran
How does the 17-70 do on the Quattro H if you turn off the DC Crop Mode? How bad does it vignette and so on?
Wondering if that lens is usable in 21:9 with DC Crop Mode off.
Shawn
Wondering if that lens is usable in 21:9 with DC Crop Mode off.
Shawn
Jamie Pillers
Skeptic
I have exactly the same question.
Jamie Pillers
Skeptic
shawn
Veteran
FWIW, it looks like the older 17-50 2.8 (on sale for $369 right now) will work fine on the Quattro H in 21:9 mode with DC Crop off. That lens has black corners at 17mm on the Quattro H in 3:2 but look fine in 21:9.
EDIT: See this thread for the 17-50 on the Quattro H with DC Crop OFF. https://www.dpreview.com/forums/thread/4164071
If you download the full resolution 3:2 files and then crop it to 21:9 the vignetting is not an issue.
Shawn
Yokosuka Mike
Abstract Clarity
Larry, here are a few images to go along with my previous comments.
Sigma Sd Quattro H, Sigma 17-70mm f2.8-4 "Contemporary" lens
Yokohama, Japan
Larry H-L
Well-known
Thank you Mike, I have been enjoying your street series. Those look plenty good for a walk around zoom.
I ordered the APS-c version and 30mm lens, it should arrive in a week,or so.
I ordered the APS-c version and 30mm lens, it should arrive in a week,or so.
shawn
Veteran
Thanks, what is your camera's "DC Crop Mode" set to? That is on the first page of the shooting menu.
Shawn
Yokosuka Mike
Abstract Clarity
Hi Shawn, I had to check (I didn't know); it's set to "Auto".
I never gave the DC Crop Mode much thought, I guess I'll have to read the manual and see what's the most advantageous for me. Thanks for bring this point up.
shawn
Veteran
Hi Mike,
With the DC Crop mode ON (or set to Auto with a sigma 'DC' lens mounted) you are essentially turning your camera into a SD Quattro (no-H) as it crops the sensor down to APS-C sized.
If you turn that OFF you will use the full size (and resolution) of the sensor but may or may not have vignetting on your 17-70 lens. From what I have seen I think it will vignette somewhat.
What could be interesting is if the vignetting is just in the corners that lens may be able to be shot in 21:9 format on the Quattro H. The 17-50 f2.8 is like this. It has black corners on the Quattro H but if you shoot 21:9 that isn't a problem.
Some of Sigma DC lenses will vignette all around the frame on larger than APS-C sized sensors. Those might not work on on the Quattro H in 21:9. I'm looking to see if the 10-20 is one of them. You get vignetting all around the frame when shot full frame but if you scale that image by 30% (the crop factor of the Quattro H) it looks like will just have dark corners so shooting 21:9 with the Quattro H may work.
Thanks,
Shawn
With the DC Crop mode ON (or set to Auto with a sigma 'DC' lens mounted) you are essentially turning your camera into a SD Quattro (no-H) as it crops the sensor down to APS-C sized.
If you turn that OFF you will use the full size (and resolution) of the sensor but may or may not have vignetting on your 17-70 lens. From what I have seen I think it will vignette somewhat.
What could be interesting is if the vignetting is just in the corners that lens may be able to be shot in 21:9 format on the Quattro H. The 17-50 f2.8 is like this. It has black corners on the Quattro H but if you shoot 21:9 that isn't a problem.
Some of Sigma DC lenses will vignette all around the frame on larger than APS-C sized sensors. Those might not work on on the Quattro H in 21:9. I'm looking to see if the 10-20 is one of them. You get vignetting all around the frame when shot full frame but if you scale that image by 30% (the crop factor of the Quattro H) it looks like will just have dark corners so shooting 21:9 with the Quattro H may work.
Thanks,
Shawn
Larry H-L
Well-known
I wonder if Sigma will release the new 16mm f1.4 in Sigma SA mount? Currently available in m4/3 and Sony E mount.
It would seem to be a good companion to the 30mm f1.4.
It would seem to be a good companion to the 30mm f1.4.
digi2ap
Newbie
Yes, please, I'd likely be first in the queue.
shawn
Veteran
Nice. I just picked up the SD Quattro H with a 17-50. I am looking to use it as a *much* easier panoramic setup (current is three Coolpix As stitched later on) and also maybe for IR with the removable hot filter.
I previously had a DP2M and DP3M so am familiar with the Sigmas.
The body of the SD Quattro is interesting. Big and very solid feeling. Reminds me of the Bronica RF645 with the big grip and very rectangular body. Lots of nice touches on the body. The diopter adjustment for the EVF is brilliant as it must be lifted to be changed. The diopter adjustments on my Fujis get moved accidentally pretty often. I do not like the location of the power switch as you can not turn it on one handed. The switch is also easily mistaken with the AF/M switch on the lens. The location of the lock switch would have been perfect for power. The extension on the body for the lens mount is also odd when you go to unmount a lens. I keep hitting the unlock button and then trying to twist the body itself.
The combination of two LCDs with the status on the smaller screen is very handy as it gives direct access to exposure compensation, ISO, metering and the mode (PASM) along with aperture and shutter speed displayed on it. In manual mode it will also show the relative exposure.
Menus are similar to the DP2/3M but there is some inconsistencies in how the menus work. For example, when you go into the actual camera menus you can use the front or rear command dials to move through pages of the menu, even when a setting is highlighted. To see the options of that setting you must press OK to get into the options.
However, if you bring up the QS menu (which is customizable for settings) you move through the setting with the D-Pad. If you have a setting selected if you press OK (to get into the options like in the main menu) you exit the QS menu. To actually see the options for each setting in the QS menu you scroll through them with the wheels. In other words the main menu and the QS menus work just about opposite each other which is frustrating.
As far as shooting goes the camera is much more responsive than the DPMs. With a fast card (and image review off) you can basically shoot every couple of seconds and the camera never bogs down as it will continue to flush the buffer even while continuing to shoot. As I recall, on the DPMs it had the same 7 shot buffer but it wouldn't write to the memory card if you kept shooting. You had to stop to let the buffer flush. Buffer writes are much faster on the SD about 4-5 seconds for raw+Jpeg. Like the DPM you can not review any shots if the camera is writing to the card other than using the instant review option.
As all the reviews state the EVF liveview isn't great but it works fine for framing. The 21:9 AR option is great for shooting panoramic. You have the option of it blacking out the top/bottom of 21:9 frame or you can set it to be semi-transparent (darker) to give a sort of rangefinder feel of seeing outside of the framing, at least above and below.
With the EVF a little above the body it looks like you should be able to shoot both eyes open but that does not work at all. The EVF is to the right of the lens. With both eyes open my left eye is above the lens. The combined image of the open eye and EVF is visually confusing as they are vertically misaligned. I think this is because I am basically seeing the same point of view from each eye but vertically misaligned by several inches.
Will be shooting more this weekend to see how it can do.
Shawn
Larry H-L
Well-known
Nice details Shawn, thanks for the write up.
I'm a DPM shooter, so the menus should at least seem similar. I am looking forward to using an EVF rather than the LCD and loupe, and to DNG files to speed workflow. Let us know what you think of the 17-50mm lens.
I'm a DPM shooter, so the menus should at least seem similar. I am looking forward to using an EVF rather than the LCD and loupe, and to DNG files to speed workflow. Let us know what you think of the 17-50mm lens.
shawn
Veteran
I never used a loupe with my DPMs so the EVF is a nice improvement from the LCD screen.
Not sure about DNG yet as I have only used it a little. Under artificial lighting it seemed like WB was more difficult for LR than SPP but I need to spend more time with that. You can not shoot DNG+JPG which I do not like. The JPGs on the SDQ are much improved compared to the SDM.
Regarding the 17-50 the OS works very well and it focus reasonably quickly, faster than the DPM and much faster in low light. I'm shooting with DC crop off. Wide open the lens is sharp in the center but the corners are softer (extreme corners are black out in3:2) with CA present. Stopped down the corners softness improves. Haven't had good weather to really do much with the lens yet.
One thing the SDQ seems to be missing is any sort of DOF preview mode. It isn't a setting option for any of the buttons and the lens does not stop down when the shutter is half pressed, it only does that on release. Not sure if that is an oversight or intentional due to what effect DOF preview might have on live view with the Foveon as it can't gain up as well as other cameras.
The Super Detail mode is interesting. Easy way of shooting a bracket along with keeping the files organized together easier. SPP is a little odd as one time it did not seem to see the SD file. Shooting in that mode eats space. A 32gb card was good for about 43 shoots, felt like using film again.
Shawn
Not sure about DNG yet as I have only used it a little. Under artificial lighting it seemed like WB was more difficult for LR than SPP but I need to spend more time with that. You can not shoot DNG+JPG which I do not like. The JPGs on the SDQ are much improved compared to the SDM.
Regarding the 17-50 the OS works very well and it focus reasonably quickly, faster than the DPM and much faster in low light. I'm shooting with DC crop off. Wide open the lens is sharp in the center but the corners are softer (extreme corners are black out in3:2) with CA present. Stopped down the corners softness improves. Haven't had good weather to really do much with the lens yet.
One thing the SDQ seems to be missing is any sort of DOF preview mode. It isn't a setting option for any of the buttons and the lens does not stop down when the shutter is half pressed, it only does that on release. Not sure if that is an oversight or intentional due to what effect DOF preview might have on live view with the Foveon as it can't gain up as well as other cameras.
The Super Detail mode is interesting. Easy way of shooting a bracket along with keeping the files organized together easier. SPP is a little odd as one time it did not seem to see the SD file. Shooting in that mode eats space. A 32gb card was good for about 43 shoots, felt like using film again.
Shawn
shawn
Veteran
*Love* the C1, C2 and C3 modes on the Sigma as they will save/change many of the cameras shooting settings including aspect ratio and the DC Crop setting. As an example I can set C1 for 21:9 shooting with DC Crop Off and C2 for 3:2 with DC Crop on to avoid the corners of the 17-50 DC lens. C settings are changed as part of the Mode setting using the direct button on the back and the dial. Shooting RAW the camera records the full frame all the time but SPP respects these settings when processing. Raw+Jpeg gives the full frame in the X3F file and the cropped frame in the JPEG.
Nice touch in SPP is that the crop settings include options for all the DC crop settings.
Totally boring example of the 17-50 2.8 shot 3:2 in full frame (at 17mm), in 21:9 (DC crop OFF) and then with the DC 3:2 crop in place.
Increasing the focal length of the 17-50 and the black corners shrink. That also varies a little based on F stop.
As you can see SPP can have a weird quirk in that the colors (WB). Sometimes it does not refresh properly so SPP displays colors pre/WB as it did above.
Shawn
Nice touch in SPP is that the crop settings include options for all the DC crop settings.
Totally boring example of the 17-50 2.8 shot 3:2 in full frame (at 17mm), in 21:9 (DC crop OFF) and then with the DC 3:2 crop in place.
Increasing the focal length of the 17-50 and the black corners shrink. That also varies a little based on F stop.
As you can see SPP can have a weird quirk in that the colors (WB). Sometimes it does not refresh properly so SPP displays colors pre/WB as it did above.
Shawn
dfatty
Well-known
Thanks for the review, Shawn, good info. The 21:9 info and shooting with both eyes open info is new to me.
Larry H-L
Well-known
SD Quattro (APS-c version) arrived with the 30mm f1.4 Art lens. Size is about as expected, larger, but the grip and overall design is good. The odd camera shape has me wondering what type of bag to use? The fact that you can change the battery and SD card while mounted on a tripod is good. The lens mount is long, so the camera feels somewhat nose heavy. The EVF placement to the right side of the camera doesn't bother me, as it is extended enough to keep my nose mostly off the LCD screen.
Controls seem intuitive except for the odd placement of the on/off power. Autofocus is decent speed, not fast but adequate. The EVF is OK, not up to current m4/3 standards but certainly better than using the LCD. Peaking and focus magnification work well. Quick Menu placement is good, and is customizable.
Auto white balance seems better than the DP Merrills. XF3 files look like they have less overall micro-contrast than the Merrills, but I haven't time to experiment with them. JPEGs look quite good straight out of camera. The DNG files open easily in LR /PS, a welcome speed to workflow. Odd though that DNGs won't open in the Sigma software. Black and white files look really good, color seems biased to warmer yellow so far. All files look amazingly sharp, the 30mm "Art" lens seems excellent.
Overall for $799 with the lens included, it seems like an excellent value. I'm happy. Still thinking about which zoom or wide lens to add.
Controls seem intuitive except for the odd placement of the on/off power. Autofocus is decent speed, not fast but adequate. The EVF is OK, not up to current m4/3 standards but certainly better than using the LCD. Peaking and focus magnification work well. Quick Menu placement is good, and is customizable.
Auto white balance seems better than the DP Merrills. XF3 files look like they have less overall micro-contrast than the Merrills, but I haven't time to experiment with them. JPEGs look quite good straight out of camera. The DNG files open easily in LR /PS, a welcome speed to workflow. Odd though that DNGs won't open in the Sigma software. Black and white files look really good, color seems biased to warmer yellow so far. All files look amazingly sharp, the 30mm "Art" lens seems excellent.
Overall for $799 with the lens included, it seems like an excellent value. I'm happy. Still thinking about which zoom or wide lens to add.