amateriat
We're all light!
Got a call from a colleague. He's selling off a fair amount of stuff (photo/studio/computer/household), partly because a lot of it is surplus at this point, partly to drum up some cash (business has been so-so), and partly to make room for a few other things. He needed a laptop he was planning to sell to be given the once-over, and asked if I could do a barter deal this time around. No problem, I say, and I hop on the bike and head over.
While I''m in the middle of the job, I get curious as to the stuff he's actually selling. The Hassy XPan? Nope (as if I had the money laying around to pay a fair price for it). The Leicas? Ditto. The Contax G's? Yeah, but they don't fit my shooting M.O. The Contax T2? Nice enough, but I already have the Tvs. Studio lighting gear? Also nice, but I ain't got a studio, rarely use one for any gigs, and when I have, I've made do with what I have without too much trouble.
But...how about a meter? I've got my Sekonic L-428, with almost all the attachments, and while the thing is sweet in terms of performance, sometimes it's a bit big to drag around. Does he have, say, an L-398 of any vintage? That's not the tiniest, but I could make it work for me.
Well, no, he didn't have that. But he could let me have this:
The Weston wind, is a restless wind...(Note homemade Zone System overlay on right)
So, I took it (among a few other things), and I sit here, and ponder...yes, it appears to work, and I'll do an open-shade comparo with the Sekonic to see how "on" the thing is, but I haven't used one of these in decades...how slow and ponderous will the thing be compared to my so-simple-a-Simpson-could-suss-it Sekonic? (Go ahead, say that three times, fast. I dare you.)
Yeah, I'll Just Bleeping Google It for the manual, but other than feeling a bit out-of-place using this without a wooden tripod, a Burke & James big-bellows'd number, a backpack full of film holders and a buxom companion who's also a licensed chiropractor, what should I know about this "storied" handheld? (I briefly forget the guy/outfit currently in the biz of rebuilding these things, and possibly manufacturing new Westons.)
- Barrett
While I''m in the middle of the job, I get curious as to the stuff he's actually selling. The Hassy XPan? Nope (as if I had the money laying around to pay a fair price for it). The Leicas? Ditto. The Contax G's? Yeah, but they don't fit my shooting M.O. The Contax T2? Nice enough, but I already have the Tvs. Studio lighting gear? Also nice, but I ain't got a studio, rarely use one for any gigs, and when I have, I've made do with what I have without too much trouble.
But...how about a meter? I've got my Sekonic L-428, with almost all the attachments, and while the thing is sweet in terms of performance, sometimes it's a bit big to drag around. Does he have, say, an L-398 of any vintage? That's not the tiniest, but I could make it work for me.
Well, no, he didn't have that. But he could let me have this:
The Weston wind, is a restless wind...(Note homemade Zone System overlay on right)
So, I took it (among a few other things), and I sit here, and ponder...yes, it appears to work, and I'll do an open-shade comparo with the Sekonic to see how "on" the thing is, but I haven't used one of these in decades...how slow and ponderous will the thing be compared to my so-simple-a-Simpson-could-suss-it Sekonic? (Go ahead, say that three times, fast. I dare you.)
Yeah, I'll Just Bleeping Google It for the manual, but other than feeling a bit out-of-place using this without a wooden tripod, a Burke & James big-bellows'd number, a backpack full of film holders and a buxom companion who's also a licensed chiropractor, what should I know about this "storied" handheld? (I briefly forget the guy/outfit currently in the biz of rebuilding these things, and possibly manufacturing new Westons.)
- Barrett
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Roger Hicks
Veteran
Dear Barrett,
Dead easy to use. The A and C indices (either side of the main arrow) are for unusually light and unusually dark subjects; the U is the limit for underexposure; the O, the limit for overexposure; and the only thing I can't remember is whether those are Weston speeds (earlier Westons) or ASA (later Westons). Have you the Invercone for it?
From memory:
O westron wind, when wilt thou blow
And make the small rain to rain?
O Christ that I were in my bed
And my love in my arms again.
I first saw it in Poems on the Underground, several decades ago.
Cheers,
R.
Dead easy to use. The A and C indices (either side of the main arrow) are for unusually light and unusually dark subjects; the U is the limit for underexposure; the O, the limit for overexposure; and the only thing I can't remember is whether those are Weston speeds (earlier Westons) or ASA (later Westons). Have you the Invercone for it?
From memory:
O westron wind, when wilt thou blow
And make the small rain to rain?
O Christ that I were in my bed
And my love in my arms again.
I first saw it in Poems on the Underground, several decades ago.
Cheers,
R.
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naruto
GASitis.. finally cured?
Barrett, this is excellent stuff. The Westons are of excellent lineage. I have later model, the Weston IV, and while intact it performed wonderfully well. I dropped it accidentally, and the spring that moves the needle is now broken. 
You should give it a try. Else, I can always take it off your hands.
You should give it a try. Else, I can always take it off your hands.
nikon_sam
Shooter of Film...
Weston used their own film (emulsion) speeds...(400 film set it at 320) and so on...
I had my Master II rebuilt by George at Quality Light Metric in Hollywood, CA...
It was working fine when I first bought it but died suddenly one day...I sent it off to George and it's been just fine ever since...
I use mine with the Mamiya 645 and Yashica Mat 124...
You'll need a good pair of "Cheaters" as those numbers are hard to see if you're over 50...
Check out this site
I had my Master II rebuilt by George at Quality Light Metric in Hollywood, CA...
It was working fine when I first bought it but died suddenly one day...I sent it off to George and it's been just fine ever since...
I use mine with the Mamiya 645 and Yashica Mat 124...
You'll need a good pair of "Cheaters" as those numbers are hard to see if you're over 50...
Check out this site
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Roger Hicks
Veteran
But later switched to ASA. A quick Google search reveals that the III was the last with Weston speeds.
Cheers,
R.
amateriat
We're all light!
Sam & Roger: Thanks, this was the info I needed.
The Invercone...I had a gnawing feeling I was forgetting something. He might yet have it; I'll shoot an e-mail to him now.
So those are Weston film speeds on the III's dial? I suppose i could have that changed if I want.
- Barrett
The Invercone...I had a gnawing feeling I was forgetting something. He might yet have it; I'll shoot an e-mail to him now.
So those are Weston film speeds on the III's dial? I suppose i could have that changed if I want.
- Barrett
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Roger Hicks
Veteran
Just set the next speed DOWN from the ASA/ISO: as Sam says, 320 for 400, 100 for 125, etc. More than close enough. I think there may be a theoretical difference in the way the speeds are calculated, but if there is, it's less than 5-10%, well inside experimental error.
Cheers,
R.
Cheers,
R.
nikon_sam
Shooter of Film...
Barrett,
Click onto the link in my first reply (#4) and then go to "Manuals" then to "Film Speeds and Weston Dials"
Click onto the link in my first reply (#4) and then go to "Manuals" then to "Film Speeds and Weston Dials"
amateriat
We're all light!
Roger & Sam: Thanks yet again. Yep, I can deal with the relatively-small discrepancy in speed-ratings here. Now I just have to hope my friend has that Invercone close at hand...
- Barrett
- Barrett
bgb
Well-known
Hi Barrett,
I just found a Weston Invercone that is for the Weston Master 2 ... does anyone know if that would do for the 3 as well?
If it will work on the 3 and your friend doesn't have one i will send you mine for free It's in the original beat up box but sadly no instructions.
Brian
I just found a Weston Invercone that is for the Weston Master 2 ... does anyone know if that would do for the 3 as well?
If it will work on the 3 and your friend doesn't have one i will send you mine for free
It's in the original beat up box but sadly no instructions.Brian
amateriat
We're all light!
Brian: Thanks for the offer!
So far, however, the Invercone for the Master II looks fairly different (smaller/flatter, for one thing) than the one for the III.
- Barrett
So far, however, the Invercone for the Master II looks fairly different (smaller/flatter, for one thing) than the one for the III.
- Barrett
Chris101
summicronia
Barrett, I've got a B&J 5x7 I never use. Bike on over.
john_s
Well-known
I inherited two Weston Master selenium meters from the mid 1950s but they both died quite suddenly. I like the elegance of them, but the sensitivity at low light isn't good for available light use. I would give it a try if you get it for nothing or not much, but be prepared for sudden failure.
Gumby
Veteran
I think the answer is, "maybe". AFAIK, the Weston IIIs that use Weston number are marked "Weston Number" and the ones that are ASA are marked "Exposure Index".
Roger Hicks
Veteran
Dear Ed,
Ah... so there were two versions of the III? I never knew that.
Well, actually, I did - US Westons and UK Westons are not identical - but it had never occrred to me that there might be a 'code' like this. Or maybe UK had one and US had the other.
Either way, thanks.
Cheers,
R.
xwhatsit
Well-known
Well, either way, it doesn't matter. Ancient meter, compare it to his modern one and see what correction factor he should use on the speed dial. Even if it does use ASA, it may be out half a stop because the selenium cell is poked.
I got given a Weston Master V, marked `Sangamo Weston', made by Enfield in Middlesex. It has a calibration screw on the back, maybe that will give you enough movement if it is Weston speeds.
It's pretty big and chunky compared to my miniature Sekonic L-VI, which is the cutest little thing; however the Sekonic is decidedly more `consumer' and doesn't read so low light as the Weston Master. I like the moving scale of the needle when you open up the shield covering the selenium cell for low light, very slick.
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Robert Lai
Well-known
I've got the same meter. The scale reads in candles/sq foot. If properly calibrated, when you hold the meter towards the clear north sky between 10AM to 2PM, it should read "320". Mine Weston III matches exactly in readout with my Gossen Luna Pro F, which has always been dead accurate.
US made Weston IIIs (like yours) were the first to incorporate ASA film speeds, so you shouldn't have to convert Weston speeds. The English Sangamo Western meters may say "Weston Rating" on the film speed surround. You can see the two different types here: http://www.westonmeter.org.uk/westonthree.htm
The Invercone from the II should work with the III. However, the system for these earlier invercones is a bit awkward. You need to open up the baffle to install the invercone. This puts you in the low light scale. If the light is too bright, you need to install the accessory neutral density filter that brings up the bright light scale (equivalent to baffle closed).
The later Invercones (for Weston Master IV to Euro-Masters) can be fitted with the baffle open or closed, and dispense with the ND filter. The later Invercones appear commonly on ebay, and sell under $10. I have one coming to me now so that I can make the appropriate modifications to fit my Weston III. The later invercones will fit the Weston Master III with a slight bit of filing. There is a small latch lip on the top of the invercone that needs to be filed down. The width of the slot at the top of the invercone needs to be widened from 3mm to 5.5mm. Two small metal projections at the bottom of the Invercone need to be filed down. These are from John Desq's site on the Weston meters:
http://www.johndesq.com/westonmaster/
Like you, I got the Weston meter because it needs no batteries, and is a lot smaller in size than my Gossen. But, even though it's 50 years old, these can be surprisingly accurate. The best feature is that they show all exposure combinations in 1/3 f/stop increments, so I can get the exposures for my cameras that have 1/75 speed, and lenses that have f/12.5 for example (e.g. Leica IIf with Elmar 9cm f/4).
US made Weston IIIs (like yours) were the first to incorporate ASA film speeds, so you shouldn't have to convert Weston speeds. The English Sangamo Western meters may say "Weston Rating" on the film speed surround. You can see the two different types here: http://www.westonmeter.org.uk/westonthree.htm
The Invercone from the II should work with the III. However, the system for these earlier invercones is a bit awkward. You need to open up the baffle to install the invercone. This puts you in the low light scale. If the light is too bright, you need to install the accessory neutral density filter that brings up the bright light scale (equivalent to baffle closed).
The later Invercones (for Weston Master IV to Euro-Masters) can be fitted with the baffle open or closed, and dispense with the ND filter. The later Invercones appear commonly on ebay, and sell under $10. I have one coming to me now so that I can make the appropriate modifications to fit my Weston III. The later invercones will fit the Weston Master III with a slight bit of filing. There is a small latch lip on the top of the invercone that needs to be filed down. The width of the slot at the top of the invercone needs to be widened from 3mm to 5.5mm. Two small metal projections at the bottom of the Invercone need to be filed down. These are from John Desq's site on the Weston meters:
http://www.johndesq.com/westonmaster/
Like you, I got the Weston meter because it needs no batteries, and is a lot smaller in size than my Gossen. But, even though it's 50 years old, these can be surprisingly accurate. The best feature is that they show all exposure combinations in 1/3 f/stop increments, so I can get the exposures for my cameras that have 1/75 speed, and lenses that have f/12.5 for example (e.g. Leica IIf with Elmar 9cm f/4).
Robert Lai
Well-known
Sorry to misinform you. The invercone from the II will fit the I, but not III. You'll probably end up doing some filing on a more modern invercone anyway.
I got a Master V after the good experience with the III. The benefits are supposedly a newer selenium cell (35 yrs old vs 50), the ability to lock and hold readings (the III has a continuously free reading needle), and a lock for the ASA dial. On the III, if you're not careful you can end up changing the film speed. Mine arrived from the UK with a dead cell. It's off to Quality Light Metric. Charge is $79 for parts and labor to change the cell and calibrate it, for all Weston meters.
I got a Master V after the good experience with the III. The benefits are supposedly a newer selenium cell (35 yrs old vs 50), the ability to lock and hold readings (the III has a continuously free reading needle), and a lock for the ASA dial. On the III, if you're not careful you can end up changing the film speed. Mine arrived from the UK with a dead cell. It's off to Quality Light Metric. Charge is $79 for parts and labor to change the cell and calibrate it, for all Weston meters.
Roger Hicks
Veteran
Dear Robert,
The remarkable thing is that I have always found the cells on the II-series tov be more reliable than the cells on the later meters: my two IIs agree precisely at all times after more than half a century, but my Euro-Master (bought new) died after half a decade or so.
Then again, all Westons are usually pretty good: I once tried five Westons (all UK) against one another, and all agreed withi9n i/3 stop. One of the biggest problems with later s/h Westons is broken glasses, again, at least in the UK; I've never seen a II with a broken glass.
Each model has its advantages in legibility, etc., but unless you need low light reading ability, they really are very good indeed, and come to an accurate reading much faster than CdS cells. Since the advent of silicon photoresistive cells that advantage has disappeared but the old Westons are still among the best meters you can find.
Cheers,
R.
Leigh Youdale
Well-known
I've got the Euro Master. Bought it new many years ago.
Speeds in ASA and readout in EV's (not EI's) Works beautifully.
I've also got a "Bewi" Amateur - now that IS small - made in Germany, with ASA and DIN speeds. The case (which appears to be authentic) is embossed "Bertram Amateur".
Speeds in ASA and readout in EV's (not EI's) Works beautifully.
I've also got a "Bewi" Amateur - now that IS small - made in Germany, with ASA and DIN speeds. The case (which appears to be authentic) is embossed "Bertram Amateur".
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