Sony A9 is here

[newfilm]

I wonder will I ever see the day of sub $500 full frame digital mirror-less that I can use with all the old manual lenses I have *accidentally* have right now... 🙂

 

[HHPhoto]

I wonder will I ever see the day of sub $500 full frame digital mirror-less that I can use with all the old manual lenses I have *accidentally* have right now... 🙂

No, definitely not.
Digital sensors are expensive, and the bigger the sensor area, the more expensive they are. And it is not a linear relationsship, it is an e-function: The costs are increasing in an over-proportional way with bigger sensors.

And there is another severe problem: Since 2012 sales of digital ILC cameras are significantly decreasing, therefore there are no positive economies of scale anymore, but instead negative economies of scale with rising production costs.
That is why lately new models were introduced mostly at higher prices compared to their forerunners.

We will probably not see any (good) FF camera for under 1,000 bucks.
Don't forget: We have FF digital cameras since about 2002, and we've never seen a cheap one.

Those who want very cheap. but excellent FF cameras should currently look at the film camera market:
Outstanding professional 35mm cameras like Nikon F4, F5, F100, Canon EOS 3, EOS 1N, EOS 1V, EOS 30/33V, Minolta Dynax 7 and 9 etc. are all available for (much) less than 500$.
Real bargains!!

Cheers, Jan

 

[newfilm]

Don't forget: We have FF digital cameras since about 2002, and we've never seen a cheap one.

So true... looks like the days of the good old soviet that practically churn out "copy" of their western counter part for cheap is also gone (i know I enjoy the Zorky and Kiev) 🙂

 

[roscoetuff]

FWIW, as a Sony A7RII user who upgraded from a series of digitals to Sony A7 and then the A7RII, I sympathized with the sense of getting out of the digital rat race to the extent that I exited digital for film. For me, this is an avocation not a living, and meant to be fun. I kept my A7RII for scanning film negatives (and rare other uses) and sold off the rest to pick up 35mm Leica and 120 Bronica's that I'm using for 95% plus of my images. And I am thrilled to have a lesser form of image capture... 'cause no matter what camera you have now or buy later, if it is not now a lesser capture device, it will be. Better to live with it, embrace it and become a better photographer rather than complain and/or feel outgunned. Let it be a choice and focus on what you can control rather than what the other guy is doing. Film's one chance to get it right within a range of simple controls is forcing me to learn more about the craft and that's a good thing, and will pay dividends no matter what comes next.

Sony's prices are rising and that's a good thing if you consider that it supports the R&D of expressive photographers. Sony is still very low in price relative to Leica. And all these are low in price relative to the real dollar costs (adjusted for inflation) of early 1970 prices for Hasselblads and other MF camera packages. If the market for high end cameras shrinks because the bottom and middle market subsidies are lost, spreading the cost out over fewer units will force higher prices. As this happens, the appeal of custom, one-of-a-kind cameras to serve the serious "art" photographer in digital and film will become more and more cost competitive and perhaps the only option. There's an option now for a multiple format film system camera coming to market that can do everything from 35mm to LF.... using Mamiya, Linhof and other lenses. Pretty cool stuff. I'll bet digital will see the same thing as younger folks begin to recycle some of the digital sensors, too.