samoksner
Who stole my light?
I'm going to start developing my own film again, except this time, I'll be doing so at home rather than at school, so I'm quite familiar with the process but unsure about certain equipment.
Is there any difference between the plastic and the stainless steel film developing tanks?
http://www.freestylephoto.biz/5041-...el-Developing-Tank-with-two-reels?cat_id=1603
http://www.freestylephoto.biz/9116-Arista-Stainless-Steel-Tank-16-oz.-With-SS-Top?cat_id=1603
http://www.freestylephoto.biz/91216-Arista-Stainless-Steel-Tank-16-oz.-with-PVC-Top?cat_id=1603
Apart from price, which is negligible, is there any difference in these tanks? In school, i used the plastic ones, and they worked fine, they were a bit leaky, but worked well. Is loading the reels the same? Freestyle has the 16 oz stainless steel tanks with PVC or SS tops, does that make any difference?
Thanks for the help!
Is there any difference between the plastic and the stainless steel film developing tanks?
http://www.freestylephoto.biz/5041-...el-Developing-Tank-with-two-reels?cat_id=1603
http://www.freestylephoto.biz/9116-Arista-Stainless-Steel-Tank-16-oz.-With-SS-Top?cat_id=1603
http://www.freestylephoto.biz/91216-Arista-Stainless-Steel-Tank-16-oz.-with-PVC-Top?cat_id=1603
Apart from price, which is negligible, is there any difference in these tanks? In school, i used the plastic ones, and they worked fine, they were a bit leaky, but worked well. Is loading the reels the same? Freestyle has the 16 oz stainless steel tanks with PVC or SS tops, does that make any difference?
Thanks for the help!
payasam
a.k.a. Mukul Dube
In practical terms, there's no difference. All reels are spiral, so putting in the film is not so different from one to another. Good luck.
blackwave
silver halide lover
I use the stainless ones simply because that's what I learned on. Between the stainless and PVC tops, though, I definitely prefer the PVC. They seem to give a better seal and I like how firmly they stay on the tank. They're also easy to take on and off because they're slightly flexible so I can get my fingers under the lip and kind of peel it off the tank.
Any way you go, enjoy! I couldn't do anything but develop my negs at home now.
Any way you go, enjoy! I couldn't do anything but develop my negs at home now.
AgentX
Well-known
I simply can't load plastic reels, so I've always used steel. People in my high school thought I was nuts.
I prefer PVC tops for my steel tanks, because I can never get the metal ones off after development and the cap snaps on positively. If a steel top or cap is slightly bent, it can leak. PVC tops need to be replaced when they crack or the light baffle won't stay in place.
The [supposed?] advantages of steel are better temperature control and easier cleaning.
I prefer PVC tops for my steel tanks, because I can never get the metal ones off after development and the cap snaps on positively. If a steel top or cap is slightly bent, it can leak. PVC tops need to be replaced when they crack or the light baffle won't stay in place.
The [supposed?] advantages of steel are better temperature control and easier cleaning.
samoksner
Who stole my light?
Thanks for the help, that cleared up the suspicion that the steel top would be a pain to remove.
spyder2000
Dim Bulb
I have both.
I prefer the stainless and here's why - I tap the tank on the sink or counter to dislodge air bubbles during agitation. Once, I had a tank split up the side while doing so and I didn't feel as if I had tapped it particularly hard.
I also prefer the steel tops to the plastic/pvc ones. Yes, they leak but they aren't hard to remove. But the internal baffle will sometimes come loose, causing a light leak.
I'd rather leak liquid than light any day of the week.
I prefer the stainless and here's why - I tap the tank on the sink or counter to dislodge air bubbles during agitation. Once, I had a tank split up the side while doing so and I didn't feel as if I had tapped it particularly hard.
I also prefer the steel tops to the plastic/pvc ones. Yes, they leak but they aren't hard to remove. But the internal baffle will sometimes come loose, causing a light leak.
I'd rather leak liquid than light any day of the week.
hks3sgte
Established
I learned on stainless but have used plastic for 10 years now. Same reel, same tank. No problems. Try out both and see what YOU prefer.
Brad Buszard
Established
Temperature
Temperature
The points raised on both sides are good, and I'm not religious about the question. The big difference for me is temperature control. The steel tanks transfer heat energy very quickly, good for a water bath or for getting the initial temperature of your developer to where you need it in a matter of seconds.
Temperature
The points raised on both sides are good, and I'm not religious about the question. The big difference for me is temperature control. The steel tanks transfer heat energy very quickly, good for a water bath or for getting the initial temperature of your developer to where you need it in a matter of seconds.
wgerrard
Veteran
Reviving this thread a bit... I'm new to all this and use plastic reels with no problems. I am careful to throughly rinse them after each use. Just to see the difference, I bought a Hewes steel reel several days ago. I find it trickier to load than the plastic reels. It has no clip for holding the film. Two small prongs at either side of the center axis catch in the sprockets. Once that's done, the film is wound by turning the spool away from the film. I've found it helps to keep a bit of tension on the film. Letting the film go slack seems to encourage curls and bends. When the film is initially hooked on those two little prongs, I've found that any excess film protruding beyond the prongs will also produce a bulge that prevents the film from loading properly.
The steel lid is more difficult to remove. i supposed that might be aggravated as the steel in the lid and the tank expand or contract at different rates during the process. (Due to contact with your hand and removal from the tank, the lid, I'd guess, will be a few degrees warmer, producing a bit more expansion that might increase adhesion to the tank.)
The steel lid is more difficult to remove. i supposed that might be aggravated as the steel in the lid and the tank expand or contract at different rates during the process. (Due to contact with your hand and removal from the tank, the lid, I'd guess, will be a few degrees warmer, producing a bit more expansion that might increase adhesion to the tank.)
Chris101
summicronia
I've used steel tanks (with older, non-Hewes reels) and can spool up a roll lickety-split. With a plastic set however, it involves lots of swearing and restarts on my part. It must be a learned thing Bill.
But as for the 'differential expansion' hypothesis, wouldn't that make the lid looser if it was warmer than the tank? My Nikor tanks never stick, occasionally the small cap to the Printz tank needs a bit of muscle to remove.
About slack, my technique is to push the film into the reel every turn or so, so that it is not too tightly wound. A little bit of slack ensures that the whole operation is smooth all the way to the end of the roll.
But as for the 'differential expansion' hypothesis, wouldn't that make the lid looser if it was warmer than the tank? My Nikor tanks never stick, occasionally the small cap to the Printz tank needs a bit of muscle to remove.
About slack, my technique is to push the film into the reel every turn or so, so that it is not too tightly wound. A little bit of slack ensures that the whole operation is smooth all the way to the end of the roll.
wgerrard
Veteran
Yeah, I think you're right. The diameter of the lid would expand, too.
I haven't used my steel reel or tank in combat yet but the tank lid is, in fact, difficult to remove from the empty tank. On the other hand, the plastic lid on my Patterson tank is often reluctant to seal tightly unless I go around the rim pressing down with both of my thumbs. That messes with the timing a bit.
I can see that a steel reel would load very quickly once the knack is acquired. About one third of my practice efforts, though, still result in misloads and/or mangled sprockets.
Al Kaplan
Veteran
The old Nikor tanks were matched to their tops and don't leak, assuming they're still matched after all the years. Used ones may or may not be. I use DYMO tape to mark my tanks, lids, and caps. My oldest tank and a couple of my reels date back to 1961.
Roger Hicks
Veteran
I use stainless/plastic lid (Kindermann) for 35mm and plastic (Jobo) for 120.
Cheers,
R.
Cheers,
R.
wgerrard
Veteran
People seem to say good things about Nikkor and Kindermann tanks. I'll keep my eyes out for them. That Dymo bit is a good idea, Al.
MRohlfing
Well-known
I have been using Jobo plastic tanks since about 1970, no experience with steel.
The lid screws on, so it can't come off during developing and it is always easy to remove. My oldest tank though leaks just a little bit.
The plastic reels are easy to load and can be put into boiling water for cleaning (which never was necessary for me, though). They can be adjusted to 135 and 120.
The lid screws on, so it can't come off during developing and it is always easy to remove. My oldest tank though leaks just a little bit.
The plastic reels are easy to load and can be put into boiling water for cleaning (which never was necessary for me, though). They can be adjusted to 135 and 120.
eleskin
Well-known
I have used plastic reels since 1989, and I will use nothing else. Metal can be tricky, and can crimp the film quite easy.
My photos are ultra high fine art quality, and many have been published nationally, all done with plastic reels.
My photos are ultra high fine art quality, and many have been published nationally, all done with plastic reels.
ymc226
Well-known
I also use plastic but now am going to try stand development in both 35mm and 120mm format using Rodinal. Is there an issue with plastic versus steel reels.
I've read that plastic can cause artifacts on the edges of the negatives.
I've read that plastic can cause artifacts on the edges of the negatives.
JohnTF
Veteran
Results seem about the same for either, however, I have seen many more ruined frames from film touching film, and cupping/handling marks with stainless.
If you take care with quality plastic tanks, you will have little problem.
I have both, can comfortably use stainless, but prefer the plastic, I like the design and modular approach of Paterson, hope they are still available, but also used Jobo when I bought a set of tanks I keep in Prague, in my friend's storage along with my Manfrotto tripod.
Also, if the stainless are bought used, or shared by someone else, the reels occasionally get warped from dropping or rough handling, and may look fine, but be impossible or difficult to load. The badly warped ones are more obvious.
Stainless tanks are far easier to drop as well, or so generations of students have seemed to find.
I have had Paterson tanks through at least three generations of design, they work fine, and if a reel is hard to load, I have another handy, no point in having to horse the film in to a reel, almost guarantees handling marks.
Differential expansion? What is that? I can assure that I have never heard of any normal plastic having a greater coefficient of expansion than metals, and with the temperatures involved along with the amounts of material, would hardly think it more than a thought experiment.
Now, if you want that jar lid off---
Nikor tanks and their excellent trimmer, I believe had nothing to do with Nikon, FYI, but have not seen their darkroom products for a long time.
Now, film clips, you have to love a good quality stainless film clip, the best were the pre-revolution Czech clips, and the old Kodak Stainless clips with lead weights for the bottom, especially for MF films.
If you take care with quality plastic tanks, you will have little problem.
I have both, can comfortably use stainless, but prefer the plastic, I like the design and modular approach of Paterson, hope they are still available, but also used Jobo when I bought a set of tanks I keep in Prague, in my friend's storage along with my Manfrotto tripod.
Also, if the stainless are bought used, or shared by someone else, the reels occasionally get warped from dropping or rough handling, and may look fine, but be impossible or difficult to load. The badly warped ones are more obvious.
Stainless tanks are far easier to drop as well, or so generations of students have seemed to find.
I have had Paterson tanks through at least three generations of design, they work fine, and if a reel is hard to load, I have another handy, no point in having to horse the film in to a reel, almost guarantees handling marks.
Differential expansion? What is that? I can assure that I have never heard of any normal plastic having a greater coefficient of expansion than metals, and with the temperatures involved along with the amounts of material, would hardly think it more than a thought experiment.
Now, if you want that jar lid off---
Nikor tanks and their excellent trimmer, I believe had nothing to do with Nikon, FYI, but have not seen their darkroom products for a long time.
Now, film clips, you have to love a good quality stainless film clip, the best were the pre-revolution Czech clips, and the old Kodak Stainless clips with lead weights for the bottom, especially for MF films.
Last edited:
Ronald M
Veteran
Those black PVC tops get old and split. When you turn the lights on, the film is fogged.
Used to be lots of confirming opinions.
The two reel Spanish tank works ok. The downside is plastic take more than a standard 8 oz to cover the film and bottles are not sold in those odd sizes. The other downside is photoflow renders plastic reels sticky and they will not load.
stainless is fine if good stainless and I have no idea about these. They look lik Nikor knockoffs, but material cheating is one way to save money. There are many different grades of stainless, some good, some not suitable.
I would get a Kinderman from B&H and pay the price or find used Nikor originals.
You get what you pay for. These will all work for a time, but will eventually give trouble.
Dry the stainless if you go that route after use and leave uncapped until thouroughly dry
http://www.camcor.com/cgi-bin/cat/id=939390728&fg=KIDEKM363
Seems Kinderman has gone the way of the wind. Get one while you can.
Used to be lots of confirming opinions.
The two reel Spanish tank works ok. The downside is plastic take more than a standard 8 oz to cover the film and bottles are not sold in those odd sizes. The other downside is photoflow renders plastic reels sticky and they will not load.
stainless is fine if good stainless and I have no idea about these. They look lik Nikor knockoffs, but material cheating is one way to save money. There are many different grades of stainless, some good, some not suitable.
I would get a Kinderman from B&H and pay the price or find used Nikor originals.
You get what you pay for. These will all work for a time, but will eventually give trouble.
Dry the stainless if you go that route after use and leave uncapped until thouroughly dry
http://www.camcor.com/cgi-bin/cat/id=939390728&fg=KIDEKM363
Seems Kinderman has gone the way of the wind. Get one while you can.
JohnTF
Veteran
I have heard about the photo flo plastic reel thing, and begin to wonder if it is urban legend, or people are really flowing with the flo.
I saw a bottle of Photo Flo the other day at Dodds, and it was 16 ounces, I remarked to the shop that I don't think I have used 16 oz. of Photo Flo in 30 years.
In Europe, I bought a bottle that was a few ounces and was a dropper bottle, much harder to over dose. We are talking wetting agent, it should not take much.
Distilled water is cheap enough, and less is more in the Photo Flo department.
I never used it until I started shooting 35mm and got drying spots on the film base, probably from the calcite added by the city water folks to protect the plumbing.
Have seen very long threads about using it or its cousins, and the dreaded build up on plastic reels, but never experienced it. All reels give a little trouble now and again, if I have three rolls to load, I stack up five reels, if one seems to give me trouble, I take another from the stack.
I always use a final rinse with distilled water, and as I have the drying rack in the darkroom sink, plus a spray attachment with hot water, the only build up I have ever noticed on nylon or plastic reels is a bit of silver. If I ever felt they needed it, I am sure I can find a strong enough cleaner to get them back to new, or buy some more reels, they are not that expensive.
John
I saw a bottle of Photo Flo the other day at Dodds, and it was 16 ounces, I remarked to the shop that I don't think I have used 16 oz. of Photo Flo in 30 years.
In Europe, I bought a bottle that was a few ounces and was a dropper bottle, much harder to over dose. We are talking wetting agent, it should not take much.
Distilled water is cheap enough, and less is more in the Photo Flo department.
I never used it until I started shooting 35mm and got drying spots on the film base, probably from the calcite added by the city water folks to protect the plumbing.
Have seen very long threads about using it or its cousins, and the dreaded build up on plastic reels, but never experienced it. All reels give a little trouble now and again, if I have three rolls to load, I stack up five reels, if one seems to give me trouble, I take another from the stack.
I always use a final rinse with distilled water, and as I have the drying rack in the darkroom sink, plus a spray attachment with hot water, the only build up I have ever noticed on nylon or plastic reels is a bit of silver. If I ever felt they needed it, I am sure I can find a strong enough cleaner to get them back to new, or buy some more reels, they are not that expensive.
John
Last edited: