Summicron 50 V3 or V4?

[kievan81]

Hi guys,

I'm considering this two lenses for my M5, but can't decide on which one to get.
Can anyone help me?
What are the strength and weakness of each version?

Thank you!

 

[Robert Lai]

I prefer the latest version, as it has a pull out hood. The older version requires a separate hood, which may actually be more effective, as the latest version's hood is rather short. It doesn't extend much beyond the front of a UV filter mounted on the lens. However, a separate hood is just more bits and pieces to keep track of, in my view.

Actual lens condition matters more than ver 3 or ver 4.

Both are double Gauss designs by the great Walter Mandler. From Erwin Puts' "Leica Chronicle", it seems that version 3 was meant to emphasize greater contrast, possibly at the expense of resolution. Puts indicates that version 4 exceeds version 3 in performance at the wider apertures.

Having said that, I still like my original collapsible Summicron (version 1), as well as version 4. Sometimes I find the version 4 to be rather clinical and stark.

 

[snot]

V3 - great contrast, smooth/classic rendering, longer focus throw (compared to the V4), conventional focus ring, usually cheaper.

V4 - sharp, more modern-looking rendering, same optics as the V5, focus tab.

I'm sure someone else will give a better comparison than this. I've shot with a V3, V4, and a V5, and they are all fantastic lenses. You can't go wrong either way.

I personally chose the V3. The longer focus throw, and classic rending is what had me sold.

 

[michaelwj]

I agree with Snot, but sold my v3 after only a year - just not a 50mm user

Above any rendering differences, they handle very differently. Focus tab and short throw, vs no tab and long through. V5 gives you no tab and short throw if that's what you like. I'd decide on the handling I prefer and go from there.

 

[Daryl J.]

The V.3 is excellent without being sterile.
The V.3 is excellent without excessive drama.

There! A purely subjective opinion.
My V.3 isn't for sale.

 

[xayraa33]

By the time the image goes through the enlarging lens, you will not notice much difference.

 

[kievan81]

Thanks guys! Seems like a lot of love for V3! Strangely, V3 at the same condition as V4 could be a little more expensive. Maybe because people start noticing it, thus the price increase.

I need to wait until the 20th (when paypal will release my money) to purchase. Untill then, more opinions still welcome!

Cheers!

 

[BLKRCAT]

one thing no one ever mentions with the V4 is if it develops a wobble the lens is essentially garbage. The helical in the V4 summicron is constructed in such a way that in order to disassemble the lens to regrease the lens or repair any wobble it may have you have a high likelihood that it wont reassemble to the same tolerances which means the lens will still be loose.

I had a V4 summicron that spent more time in the shop than with me shooting because of a wobble issue. Once I got it back it still had the same issue. I sold it off to an a7 user and it began its second life.

 

[Dan States]

I have owned all of the pre APO 50 Summicrons and my favorite by far is the v3. It is more resistant to flare than the v4 and very high in contrast. Unless a flat image field is your priority I would go with the V3 any day.

Best wishes
Dan

 

[Nick R.]

I've had both and they're both excellent. I sold the V. 3 and bought a V. 4 because lately I prefer lenses with less contrast while retaining resolution.

 

[mdwsta4]

I've only had the V4 which is my main 50mm lens. I like the retractable hood because of the space it saves, but do wish it had a locking feature like the later versions. I added a heavy star lens tab which has since been replaced by a Lens Taab for easier/quicker focusing.

 

[kievan81]

Just found an article by Gus Lazzari about Summicron 35 "bokeh king" has siginficant amount of plastic parts inside. This lens is in the same era as the 50 V4. Is this mean the V4 also has plastic parts inside?

 

[Rob-F]

I personally chose the V3. The longer focus throw, and classic rending is what had me sold.

I prefer the V3 for its longer focus throw, because it makes the DOF scale easier to read and use. A lot of my shots call for taking DOF into account. I like the focus tab on the V4, but not enough to prefer it to the V3--which is certainly sharp enough! If I need more resolution, I can use my DRS.

Edit: By the way, version IV prices seem to be going through the roof. And there are recent articles calling attention to problems with the focusing helicoid of the V IV. Look before you leap!

 

[Erik van Straten]

Leica M3, Summicron-M 50mm f/2 v4, 400-2TMY, Perceptol.

Erik.

 

[Rob-F]

By the time the image goes through the enlarging lens, you will not notice much difference.

That is something to be aware of. Every link in the chain has to degrade the image somewhat. But I don't think a good enlarging lens would cause significant degradation. They are slow lenses corrected for the range of reproduction ratios that go with enlarging. A while ago I asked at my local pro shop if there was anything better than what I use (Schneider Componon). They said there is nothing better, not the EL-Nikkor, nor anything else.

 

[raid]

I prefer the Rigid Summicron as an overall superb 50mm lens. I have read here that many like the V3 Summicron.

 

[Ronald M]

That is something to be aware of. Every link in the chain has to degrade the image somewhat. But I don't think a good enlarging lens would cause significant degradation. They are slow lenses corrected for the range of reproduction ratios that go with enlarging. A while ago I asked at my local pro shop if there was anything better than what I use (Schneider Componon). They said there is nothing better, not the EL-Nikkor, nor anything else.

Significant jump in contrast when I went from old chrome Componon to original 4.5 Focotar which is the worst of the series.

The large element model which is next in Leica line whips the pants off the original Focotar, flatter field and almost perfect right into corners wide open at 16X. Schneider design.

Lastly came the Focotar 2 and the Usual curvature of field. F8 to get same resolution as large front element (Schneider), but it seems to have some increased clarity.

So it depends which Schneider you have.

I recommend last collapsible Elmar-m or V3 or the APO

 

[Highway 61]

I don't know whether the V4 has plastic parts inside (it may depend on the Canada vs Germany version of the V4, too) but I know for sure for having taken one V3 apart that there are some soft white metal parts inside the V3, which makes getting access to the aperture unit in order to clean the blades a nightmare because those pesky white metal rings can be totally impossible to unscrew. The inner optical barrel of the V3 is made of light alloy too.

The V4 (both Canada and Germany models are affected) has a flare problem which can ruin some pictures in totally unexpected conditions. This happens for some obscure reason even with perfectly clean lenses. I never got inside a V4 but I don't think there is some brass inside.

Starting from scratch, I would be on the market for a mint V2. When you are ready to drop around $700 on a 50mm f/2 you want it to be made of brass inside and out and perfectly built.

 

[santino]

The v4 is the best 50 I've ever used. The silver chrome version is super solid.

 

[Erik van Straten]

Starting from scratch, I would be on the market for a mint V2.

Every v2 will develope haze, sooner or later. You can have this cleaned, but after the cleaning the lens will most likely not be the same as before the haze starts.

Inside the lens is soft coated. The coating will be damaged by a severe cleaning. Also after the repair you will miss that incredible sharpness in the center of the image at full aperture. This demands an extremely precise positioning of the elements for wich special apparatus is necessary. Maybe only Leica can do it, but at quite a price I presume.

Sharpness in the center of the v2 in 1979:

Leica M3, Summicron 50mm f/2 v2, TriX, Microdol.

Erik.