Leica LTM Summitar- resolution at full aperture

Leica M39 screw mount bodies/lenses
Beautifull Pictures! I love the first and last ones.

I seriously did NOT intend to turn test into my primary activity :)

I tested the lens to see if they are ok and if they focus well on my cameras.

I was just surprised and (still) wandered if my Summitar sample is ok...
 
Hi Michael,
As others already have pointed out, a lens test with words as a target may not be the suitable approach to evaluate how useful a vintage lens is for portraits. If the "clinical" resolution count is what you are after, then this is not what many users of vintage lenses would benefit from. The end result is what counts. My repeated lens tests allowme to identify any focus problems in any of my tested lenses. As Frank has suggested, maybe the Summitar deserves a check for focusing accuracy/precision. In my three posted portraits I used a heavy tripod with cable release cord. The window light was soft and it allowed each lens to do well. I was after this fact; with the right light and approach, most vintage lenses can create magic.

Thanks for your interesting efforts here.


Raid


sanmich said:
Hi Raid

I was hoping that you join us...:)

I'll post a small, central part of my tests so you can get an idea of what I'm talking about.
BTW, I see now that part of my tests were done on a IIIc which exclude the adapter problem.

Those who think the resolution is crappy on all of these because they can't read, don't worry, it's Hebrew ;)

I hope I'll get it right but it's the first time I post pictures so...
Click to expand...
 
Raid

I completely agree with you, but does that limit the summitar to portraits?
I just want to understand where does this lens shine and if I have a technical problem with mine (Unprobable after Don's CLA...)
Is this a lesser lens for general purpose photography?
or is it so particular that, when closed down it gives more "soul" to the picture at the expense of a lower full aperture performance?
 
sanmich said:
Raid

I completely agree with you, but does that limit the summitar to portraits?
I just want to understand where does this lens shine and if I have a technical problem with mine (Unprobable after Don's CLA...)
Is this a lesser lens for general purpose photography?
or is it so particular that, when closed down it gives more "soul" to the picture at the expense of a lower full aperture performance?
Click to expand...

Summitar strengths: wide open for portraits and soft/poetic renditions of other subject matter, closed down it is a very good and sharp general purpose lens.
 
sanmich said:
Raid

I completely agree with you, but does that limit the summitar to portraits?
I just want to understand where does this lens shine and if I have a technical problem with mine (Unprobable after Don's CLA...)
Is this a lesser lens for general purpose photography?
or is it so particular that, when closed down it gives more "soul" to the picture at the expense of a lower full aperture performance?
Click to expand...

Michael,


A good lens can be used for many types of images and not just portraits.

I had a lens CLA'd by Don, and it was still giving me unsharp images. I sent it back to him with better instructions that the internal glass elements may have a problem. He then discovered that one glass element had shifted and needed to be placed in its correct position. He told me that he initially thought I wanted only the glass cleaned.

I have a simlar problem [as with your Summitar] with my Summarit. It will be mailed off to Don ... with clear instructions!
 
sirius said:
The more I see of the Rigid/DR summicron, the more I think that it is one of Leica's best.
Click to expand...

Sirius,
I don't think that I will ever sell my rigid Summicron. It came with the M3 in LN condition, and it gives me what I am looking for. No surprise that so many people value such a lens.
 
I own both Leitz Summicron 50 mm f/ 2 Dual Range and Leitz Summitar 50 mm f/ 2. The D.R. is better at full aperture, but the Summitar is good enough. I love very mutch my Summitar.
Ciao.
 
If you photograph the newspaper page at a 45-degree angle, rather than straight on, you will be able to determine if the focus point is correct.

Focus on a particular letter in a headline word, if the letters closer or farther from that letter are sharper, you have a focus issue.
 
Excellent, Thank you gentlemen!

Daniel, is you Summitar as sharp as your Summicron fully open?

I understand that the difference in resolution I perceived isn't inherent to Summitars and I

will do some more testing, and contact Don on this.

The tip on the 45 degrees paper trick is awsome...thanks.

Tomorow I'm flying for a few days to Istanbul and I decided to leave the Summitar for

the days we both will be better friends and we'll stand by each other. The canon 1.8 on a

IIIc will do for the 50 shots... and the Hexar AF for the 35mm... and the Fuji 6x9 for

landscape .... and the stylus epic for color (late K200) and ....my

wife for....

for......

let's see...

ah yeah... to be on the color pictures...:)

Take care,

Michael
 
Hi Michael. I know sending it to Don is the best way to check for focusing error but for those of you who don't like to wait to check these things out, I often do it myself. Here's how. With the aid if an old used interchangable Nikon B or E screen from the FM/FE series camera and a high powered (20 -25x) loupe, simply take the screen, file down either side of the long end to just under 35 mm so it can lay on the inner camera rails vertically oriented. Layer two peices of scotch tape at the top and bottom to the surface of the sccreen that lays against the inner rails and attach the loupe if possible to the back of the sceen so that it's focused exactly on the ground glass surface. Any ecthed lines on the ground glass helps to ensure this is correct. Focus on a target with the rangefinder, open the shutter at "B" and inspect the image with the lens wide open or just 1 stop down if possible to reduce abberations with high speed lenses. You can also focus the image first with the loupe and screen to compare to the rangefinder if you for comparison. Works great!
 
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awilder said:
Hi Michael. I know sending it to Don is the best way to check for focusing error but for those of you who don't like to wait to check these things out, I often do it myself. Here's how. With the aid if an old used interchangable Nikon B or E screen from the FM/FE series camera and a high powered (20 -25x) loupe, simply take the screen, file down either side of the long end to just under 35 mm so it can lay on the inner camera rails vertically oriented. Layer two peices of scotch tape at the top and bottom to the surface of the sccreen that lays against the rails and attach the loupe if possible to the back of the sceen so that it's focused on the ground glass surface. Focus on a target with the rangefinder, open the shutter at "B" and inpect the image with the lens wide open or 1 stop down. You can also focus the image with the loupe and screen to compare to the rangefinder if you want for comparison. Works great!
Click to expand...

My local camera repairman uses the same technique. It works.
 
I'll do everything I can not to send the lens overseas just for a check.
I don't have any screen to spend (I'll keep my eyes open in the future). But I think I can repeat exactly the same test (Journal on the wall) but this time photograph the wall at an angle, carefully focus on one specific point and see if others are sharper. I also read somewhere a technique using a long scale to see how much the focus is off.
I'll figure out something...
BTW, I discovered something ennoying when testing critical focus with the barnack: slight movements of the eye change quite a bit the position of the split image. I think that can influence focusing.
There is also a question I always ask myself about focusing and recomposing:
the focusing distance is not radially distributed from the film meaning that, if I'm not mistaken, recomposing might put your subject out of focus. That should really affects close range subject and extreme recomposing (putting the subject at the edges of the frame)
what do you think?
 
Hmm... I must use more my Summitar (my only Leica lens) wide open ... I made a few tests and found it a bit soft, and usually try to close at f4 or more, but from the pictures of Daniel I see it MUST be very good also at f2

Franco
 
For me the 50 is a FL that gets little use but I had thoughts of getting a new M mount 50 for my M4. Before doing so I put a adapter on my Summitar and the end result is that I no longer crave an M mount 50. I usually use apertures of F4 or smaller and get very good, to me at least, performance from the lens. I can't comment on what it is like at wide apertures but can believe what others have said about it as it is an older lens. Flare, yes a little but a hood really helps.

Bob
 
Todd.Hanz said:
check out Lester Gedimans gallery here: http://www.lesgediman.com/ ....he shot most of these in Italy with a Summitar, I'm always amazed when I go through it.

Todd
Click to expand...

I second that - I came across his photos with Summitar a while back - and they were the reason I got mine. I really like it, but also don't use it as much as I should. Great lens!
 
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