Roger Hicks
Veteran
Not exactly a convincing reply. What blinders? And -- I repeat -- where is your wisdom? Please can we have an example?
Cheers,
R.
NY_Dan
Well-known
One thing everyone likes is a Leica M3. If we could all shoot cameras instead of guns the world would be a better place. Olive branch? No, olive (safari) Leica. Green cameras are cameras too. Don't teach children to hate, teach them to halide. Shoot film, not people! I Leica you, do you Leica me? Go to cameradiplomacy.com right now and register for Camera Peace. I'll accept PayPal donations. And it's not pronounced Neekon, it's Nigh-Kon. Shazbat, I never know when to stop.
Pioneer
Veteran
Too much certainty is most frequently the bedfellow of fanaticism. It is important to be confident in your beliefs, but remain open to discussion and learning. Unfortunately most extremists are not very interested in open discussion and learning. I guess it makes it easier if everyone else is wrong.
edge100
Well-known
Have you not been reading? Everything I've said is valid. The fact that you choose not to accept plain facts is neither here nor there.
Addy101
Well-known
Neither do the Uyghur people and they are Muslims.
Also, the LTTE (Tamil Tigers) are famous for using suicide attacks and they are Hinduists.
I don't think we will solve the problems of this world with big generalizations. Maybe with pictures of colourful tanks
edge100
Well-known
Neither do the Uyghur people and they are Muslims.
Also, the LTTE (Tamil Tigers) are famous for using suicide attacks and they are Hinduists.
I don't think we will solve the problems of this world with big generalizations. Maybe with pictures of colourful tanks
I've never, ever said that all Muslims are suicide bombers.
I've also never said that only Muslims are suicide bombers.
The Tamil Tigers are Hindus, and they believe some very improbable things about the metaphysics of nature, as well. Certain beliefs make suicide attacks seem like a career opportunity.
edge100
Well-known
This is a perversely ignorant concept.
Israel is a democracy, surrounded by dictatorships and monarchies (that are functional - barely - only as a result of an accident of geography) that refuse to acknowledge its right to exist.
Israel is surrounded by neighbours that possess chemical, biological, and possibly nuclear weapons (as, of course, does Israel), and that want nothing more than to see Israel eradicated from the face of the Earth.
Israel is surrounded by neighbours that deny the truth of the Holocaust.
I put it to you that no country in the history of the world, faced with similar threats, has ever exercised as much restraint as Israel has in its dealings with its neighbours.
Moreover, ask yourself what would happen if the situation were reversed. Would Palestine (the hypothetical country) exercise this much restraint in dealing with a minority Jewish population in Gaza? Of course not.
nomadia
Established
That is a weak defense for genocide happening on the ground. If you check the statistics from both sides, the victims, especially among Palestinians, are mostly the most vulnerable and defenseless. I don't care much about nationalism, or religion for that matter, precisely because of the inhumanity of it all.
http://vimeo.com/m/50531435
http://vimeo.com/m/50531435
edge100
Well-known
I think you need to stop tossing around words like 'genocide' as if you knew what you were talking about.
nomadia
Established
not to challenge your immense knowledge about genocide. do check the stats, edge. stats don't lie.
UN report as quoted in the telegraph:
Of 160 deaths that had occurred by Sunday, 133 – 80 per cent – had been among Gaza's civilian population, OCHA said, including 35 children and 27 women. Only 26 were established to have belonged to "armed groups" while the status of another nine men was unverified.
Some 296 children and 233 women have been among the 1,140 wounded, according to Gaza health ministry figures.
UN report as quoted in the telegraph:
Of 160 deaths that had occurred by Sunday, 133 – 80 per cent – had been among Gaza's civilian population, OCHA said, including 35 children and 27 women. Only 26 were established to have belonged to "armed groups" while the status of another nine men was unverified.
Some 296 children and 233 women have been among the 1,140 wounded, according to Gaza health ministry figures.
edge100
Well-known
Not disputing these numbers. I'm also not defending Israel, per se.
I'm disputing the casual use of the word 'genocide'.
Auschwitz. Srebrenica. Rwanda. The Killing Fields.
THOSE are genocides.
Let's conduct yet another thought experiment. Imagine we had access to a perfect weapon; that is, a weapon that could kill or incapacitate a person or group of people, at a distance, without any unintended effects whatsoever.
What would Hitler have done with such a weapon? What about Pol Pot? Or Slobodan Milosevic? What would Hamas do with such a weapon?
Now, what would George W. Bush have done with such a weapon? What about Benjamin Netanyahu? Or Ariel Sharon? Or Barack Obama?
Is there any reason to suspect that the latter group - no matter what you think of their politics - would use a perfect weapon to indiscriminately kill innocent civilians?
Intent matters.
nomadia
Established
if it's a long-drawn murder of civilians of one ethnic/religious group by another, that's genocide. we're not talking of 2014 only, but decades of bloodletting.
edge100
Well-known
It's simply grotesque to use the word genocide to describe this bi-directional conflict.*
* - of course, it's not merely tangential to note that the explicit cause of this conflict is incompatible claims on the same piece of land, based on - you guessed it - the word of the invisible creator of the universe.
nomadia
Established
what do you mean 'grotesque' and 'bi-directional'? as i said, check the stats whether your claims add up to being 'bi-directional.'
edge100
Well-known
So your contention is that Hamas is not currently firing rockets into Israel?
Your contention is that no Palestinians have ever engaged in terrorism against Israel?
Your contention is that Israel does not face utter annihilation at the hands of neighbouring countries that possess weapons of mass destruction (and that are ALREADY arming Hamas), and that therefore it should be permitted to defend itself vigourously?
Is Israel doing all it can to protect against the death of non-combatants? Perhaps not. But that doesn't make its actions genocidal.
nomadia
Established
the reports of international institutions like UN, human rights watch, amnesty international, etc. can clear up your confusion, edge. draw your own conclusions, as i have mine. mass killing of noncombatants in response to terrorism by a few extremists is genocide.
edge100
Well-known
Show me evidence that ANY of those organizations have referred to this as a genocide.