raid
Dad Photographer
I use different brand cards, mostly 4GB and 8GB.
raid
Dad Photographer
To get started with a new card (or "reset" an old card), I format FAT32 in the computer, then format with SDFormatter in the computer, then format in the camera. From then on, after transferring the recent batch of photos to the computer, I format in the camera and reset file numbering for the new batch. I avoid deleting photos in the camera, as some suggest!
As to the lengthy "sleep" between shots, I don't know... but JonB's suggestion about discreet mode sounds useful!
Thanks for the info, Doug. What is SDFormatter?
I already changed the camera setting today away from discrete mode.
https://www.sdcard.org/downloads/formatter_4/
From the SD Association:
This software formats all SD memory cards, SDHC memory cards and SDXC memory cards. SD Card Formatter provides quick and easy access to the full capabilities of your SD, SDHC and SDXC memory cards.
The SD Card Formatter was created specifically for memory cards using the SD/SDHC/SDXC standards. It is strongly recommended to use the SD Card Formatter instead of formatting utilities provided with operating systems that format various types of storage media. Using generic formatting utilities may result in less than optimal performance for your memory cards.
raid
Dad Photographer
Thank you Doug.
Darthfeeble
But you can call me Steve
Formating the card is a way of making it communicate with the device. Logic says that you should format the card with the device that it's to be used in. That said, there's nothing wrong with using the erase function either once the card has be introduced to the device (formatted). Check with the various Leica forums and you will see that the vast majority feel that formatting after every download is the preferred method. I've done both and never have seen a difference either way. I rather doubt that your problem is in the card. You should have the camera looked at by someone familiar with the Leica digitals. Good Luck Raid.
raid
Dad Photographer
I have had such thoughts, but I was/am hopeful that it is not another type of problem. It has to do with the buffer. I have now switched to standard shutter release to see if things will get better or not. One step at a time. If I get again to Wetzlar, I will have them take a look at the M9.
uhoh7
Veteran
It is good to start with a new card, in fact, I found cards did not recover from this issue, once it started. A first format on the camera I think would be OK probably, but I would advise never doing so again. Better is to format on computer. I don't use special software though. There is no need. M9 is FAT 32. In fact I think my current card was already FAT32 so I just put it in new, did not format and shot it. That was some time ago as it has lasted a long time. Easy to check the formatting on a computer. Right click and choose properties. Or "get info" on the mac. If Fat 32, I would insert and take some test shots, no format. Download them and check. If all is working you are good to go. Nice and simple.
I can tell you simply erasing the images en masse in camera works great on this camera, and I have cards which have seen 30K images that way and are still going. In fact I never had a card go bad with that method in over 250K shots on the M9 (two shutters)
On the other hand every card I ever used that was formatted often in camera eventually went bad, often within 5k frames and exhibited exactly the symptoms you describe.
I use 16gb cards which i researched, because the M9 is picky. They also did this.
I'd bet there is no one in this thread with more frames on a card than my current one, and it has one been formatted once, and multiple erased many many times.
Of course this is not the way I do my Sony A7. It gets a format everytime.
It's the way my M9 prefers it, which I learned after the same problem you describe on 5 different cards.
My camera with this old once formatted card locks up very seldom. I cannot remember the last time. That does happen from time to time if you shoot alot. Pull the battery and it's fine. But what you describe is different.
You have already seen the format method likely wreck this card. What do you have to loose trying multiple erase? My previous card lasted so long with that method I wore out the plastic base.
Theories are great. Experience is a better teacher.
Now, perhaps formatting on the computer often would be fine. I never do after once and the camera does not fail. So that seems a better way to me. Fast, simple and effective. Yes the Sony I format every time like you are "supposed to". My M9 hates that, and I don't think yours likes it either as the symptoms are identical. Ask the others if they have had your problem, or tested "not formatting" for 150K shots.
This camera was "like new" in January 2014, when I bought it.
Here I had it a month:
DSC08424 by unoh7, on Flickr
A few days ago
DSC09786 by unoh7, on Flickr
I know it very well now, no offense to anyone
Think about it. When was the last time you formatted your computer HD? A long time I hope, but you delete stuff all the time. People act like this is heresy, if fact it is exactly the way it's supposed to work. The need for frequent formatting is because the other cheap cameras often corrupt card file structures, just writing and erasing. The M9 does not. Except when you format often in camera. That is not illogical as formatting is totally different than writing or erasing files.
I can tell you simply erasing the images en masse in camera works great on this camera, and I have cards which have seen 30K images that way and are still going. In fact I never had a card go bad with that method in over 250K shots on the M9 (two shutters)
On the other hand every card I ever used that was formatted often in camera eventually went bad, often within 5k frames and exhibited exactly the symptoms you describe.
I use 16gb cards which i researched, because the M9 is picky. They also did this.
I'd bet there is no one in this thread with more frames on a card than my current one, and it has one been formatted once, and multiple erased many many times.
Of course this is not the way I do my Sony A7. It gets a format everytime.
It's the way my M9 prefers it, which I learned after the same problem you describe on 5 different cards.
My camera with this old once formatted card locks up very seldom. I cannot remember the last time. That does happen from time to time if you shoot alot. Pull the battery and it's fine. But what you describe is different.
You have already seen the format method likely wreck this card. What do you have to loose trying multiple erase? My previous card lasted so long with that method I wore out the plastic base.
Theories are great. Experience is a better teacher.
Now, perhaps formatting on the computer often would be fine. I never do after once and the camera does not fail. So that seems a better way to me. Fast, simple and effective. Yes the Sony I format every time like you are "supposed to". My M9 hates that, and I don't think yours likes it either as the symptoms are identical. Ask the others if they have had your problem, or tested "not formatting" for 150K shots.
This camera was "like new" in January 2014, when I bought it.
Here I had it a month:
DSC08424 by unoh7, on Flickr
A few days ago
DSC09786 by unoh7, on Flickr
I know it very well now, no offense to anyone
Think about it. When was the last time you formatted your computer HD? A long time I hope, but you delete stuff all the time. People act like this is heresy, if fact it is exactly the way it's supposed to work. The need for frequent formatting is because the other cheap cameras often corrupt card file structures, just writing and erasing. The M9 does not. Except when you format often in camera. That is not illogical as formatting is totally different than writing or erasing files.
Corran
Well-known
Counterpoint - my M9 killed two SD cards when deleting single photos on the camera to make some room. Since stopping that and only doing a (quick) format I haven't had any problems with that again. I always quick format the cards via the M9 menu now before shooting.
One of the cards came back to life a year later when I stuck it in another camera and it very slowly reformatted properly.
Speaking of the M9 killing things - I was using a Nikon SB-800 flash with my M9 and it killed the flash. Not sure what happened exactly but the SB-800 just stopped working on the camera and never shot again regardless of camera I tried it on. Might not have been the M9 but it was strange, and annoying.
One of the cards came back to life a year later when I stuck it in another camera and it very slowly reformatted properly.
Speaking of the M9 killing things - I was using a Nikon SB-800 flash with my M9 and it killed the flash. Not sure what happened exactly but the SB-800 just stopped working on the camera and never shot again regardless of camera I tried it on. Might not have been the M9 but it was strange, and annoying.
radi(c)al_cam
Well-known
edit: my knowledge regarding batteries is outdated; see below.
Dear Raid,
exactly that could be the problem, the so-to-say «memory effect» of the battery. Have you ever completely dis-charged the battery?
There are «dis-charger» contraptions purchasable, but a much simpler (barbaric) way would be to put the battery into the freezer over night. (No warranty that it works!)
Lss
Well-known
The M9 not working correctly in the discreet mode is a known bug that was apparently introduced in some firmware version. It is most easily triggered by using continuous drive, but it may be seen in single shot mode as well. Leica has been unwilling or unable to fix this bug.
If this happens in the normal mode (not discreet), it is something else.
The M8 does not have such issues. It just works.
If this happens in the normal mode (not discreet), it is something else.
The M8 does not have such issues. It just works.
Corran
Well-known
This is not a thing with lithium batteries, and in fact a complete discharge is bad for the battery! Do not do this. Lithium batteries are best recharged before discharging all the way till the camera doesn't function. I try not to go past 20% left on the battery.
I researched this heavily just recently due to buying a very high-end laptop and wanted the batteries to last as long as possible (will be a working laptop for many years). The above advice was true for NiCad batteries, which AFAIK haven't been used in electronics in quite a long time.
radi(c)al_cam
Well-known
Thank you for your clarification!
I wasn't aware what type of battery they were using, sorry.
Richard G
Veteran
Raid, you are right to be confused by all the available advice. The menu items in the M9 are Format or overwrite. Format just resets the file structure. It is all that's needed. Overwriting, which I have never done, takes longer, presumably, and I've read that could cause trouble.
For a long time I have just Formatted in the camera, never interacting with the card in a computer other than to download the images. I will delete files in camera and have never had a problem with that.
Continuous shooting, of more than say two shots, and Discrete mode, sadly, are troublemaking software options. I now avoid them both. Pity they never bothered to fix the latest M9 software.
Here's an old thread I started. I only use OEM batteries and never let them get near flat. I haven't had a problem with the M9 for a few years, but my Monochrom has twice taken a few shots on a Lexar card and then lost them. I reviewed a couple in camera, deleted none, and the card had recently been formatted. I retired that relatively new card. I don't use SanDisk at all in Leica M digitals. I do carry a spare M9 formatted card. Haven't needed it to rescue me (see below) since doing so.
http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/archive/index.php/t-117806.html
For a long time I have just Formatted in the camera, never interacting with the card in a computer other than to download the images. I will delete files in camera and have never had a problem with that.
Continuous shooting, of more than say two shots, and Discrete mode, sadly, are troublemaking software options. I now avoid them both. Pity they never bothered to fix the latest M9 software.
Here's an old thread I started. I only use OEM batteries and never let them get near flat. I haven't had a problem with the M9 for a few years, but my Monochrom has twice taken a few shots on a Lexar card and then lost them. I reviewed a couple in camera, deleted none, and the card had recently been formatted. I retired that relatively new card. I don't use SanDisk at all in Leica M digitals. I do carry a spare M9 formatted card. Haven't needed it to rescue me (see below) since doing so.
http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/archive/index.php/t-117806.html
robert blu
quiet photographer
Raid I'm not expert here, I know you have different digital cameras do you use same cards for different cameras or each camera has a "dedicated" card? Maybe this help.
robert
PS: in your place I would try to buy a new card and use only that on the M9 to see what happens
robert
PS: in your place I would try to buy a new card and use only that on the M9 to see what happens
kj_
Member
I'll second the discrete mode explanation. Had the very same problem. Switching to normal mode solved it completely. Didn't change cards or batteries or anything else.
raid
Dad Photographer
Thank you for your clarification!
I wasn't aware what type of battery they were using, sorry.
I have read on this issue, and the recommendation was that batteries for the Leica benefit from being often recharged.
raid
Dad Photographer
raid
Dad Photographer
Robert, I use different cards in the M8 and the M9 (or Olympus cameras).
I have a few new cards that I could use on the M9.
raid
Dad Photographer
Hi Richard,
I have been doing as you have described. I carry with at all times about 10 cards and one OEM back-up battery for the M9. When I return home (or to a hotel), I start charging the batteries.
I went over your old thread. It has lots of useful comments in it. I am using the firmware that is being discussed as not working well with the discrete mode.
Thanks.
Raid
I have been doing as you have described. I carry with at all times about 10 cards and one OEM back-up battery for the M9. When I return home (or to a hotel), I start charging the batteries.
I went over your old thread. It has lots of useful comments in it. I am using the firmware that is being discussed as not working well with the discrete mode.
Thanks.
Raid
ColSebastianMoran
( IRL Richard Karash )
Reformat in Camera! or Maybe Not!
Reformat in Camera! or Maybe Not!
Hi Raid --
The standard advice is re-format in the camera, because the camera may introduce non-standard items in formatting that the computer doesn't know about. This applies generally across camera brands.
But, from the comments above, that may not be right for some specific cameras. The only reason I can invent is the possibility that the computer formatting routines may be more robust than the camera's.
Reformat in Camera! or Maybe Not!
Hi Raid --
The standard advice is re-format in the camera, because the camera may introduce non-standard items in formatting that the computer doesn't know about. This applies generally across camera brands.
But, from the comments above, that may not be right for some specific cameras. The only reason I can invent is the possibility that the computer formatting routines may be more robust than the camera's.