Vince Lupo
Whatever
Hello All -- I'm putting these photos out for some thoughts from the LTM loyalists. This is a recent acquisition from a reputable dealer friend of mine, and although it is more than likely a fake (and was sold as 'probable', so I'm not under any illusions), some aspects of it have us wondering. 68834 is listed as a Luxus I (c), and upon inspection by a knowledgeable repair person, the top plate is a Leica plate and has not been re-engraved. However, the latch pin for the baseplate is not gilded, and the 'lizard' skin is in really nice shape. As well, I've never seen a pin release like the one on this unnumbered Elmar, but that could be due to my limited knowledge of Elmars (or it could be fake).
Any opinions out there? Is there anything else that we should be looking at to determine its fakery or genuineness?
Any opinions out there? Is there anything else that we should be looking at to determine its fakery or genuineness?
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Vince Lupo
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Vince Lupo
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Vince Lupo
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Vince Lupo
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Vince Lupo
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Vince Lupo
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Vince Lupo
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Erik van Straten
Veteran
Not as nicely done as a Maizenberg, but nevertheless a well done fake.
Erik.
Erik.
P
pshinkaw
Guest
As a fake, I particularly like the wear on the finish. Gives it a nice touch of authenticity.
I think it is based on a Fed. The internals don't resembel my Zorkis or my Leitz bodies.
All of my Leitz lenses are marked in cm rather than mm. Wasn't that the case witht the earliest Leitz lenses too? I know that the Soviet lenses were marked in mm.
-Paul
I think it is based on a Fed. The internals don't resembel my Zorkis or my Leitz bodies.
All of my Leitz lenses are marked in cm rather than mm. Wasn't that the case witht the earliest Leitz lenses too? I know that the Soviet lenses were marked in mm.
-Paul
Erik van Straten
Veteran
Vince Lupo
Whatever
The inside has been checked and it is a Leica (at least according to this particular repair fellow who specializes in Leica). Today I brought the camera to a jeweler friend of mine in Annapolis, and he acid tested the finish and it's 24k gold - not that fakes couldn't be done with 24k, but it does add a little more to the story here. I also checked the inside of a regular I (c) that I have, and it also has that 'h' on the inside of the top plate, and the mechanisms look pretty much the same.
As I say, I'm not under any illusions here, but when you call it definitely a fake, what particular things are you looking at? What are the telltale signs?
As I say, I'm not under any illusions here, but when you call it definitely a fake, what particular things are you looking at? What are the telltale signs?
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HuubL
hunter-gatherer
Is it too impertinent to ask what you approximately paid for it?
Less than 1000
1000-10000
More than 10000
??
Less than 1000
1000-10000
More than 10000
??
Vince Lupo
Whatever
More than $ 500 but less than $ 1500.
HuubL
hunter-gatherer
According to Gandy, the only "official" Luxus models he knows of are between 34803 to 34817.
Vince Lupo
Whatever
I've seen this serial number listed in two different spots, including my copy of 2005-2006 Mckeown's on page 600.
As well, according to the Leica Club website, it's listed there too: http://leicaclub.net/leicaclub2001/guide/serial_number/Camera Serial Number(1).htm
As well, according to the Leica Club website, it's listed there too: http://leicaclub.net/leicaclub2001/guide/serial_number/Camera Serial Number(1).htm
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Erik van Straten
Veteran
The bottom-inside of your camera is not correct for the period. It should look like this (see picture).
Your camera is constructed from mostly genuine Leica parts, but some are not of the period. The shutter release guard was only introduced with the Leica Model II (D).
The engraving on the lens front is very doubtful, as is the engraving of the serial number. But the engraving of the serial number cannot be compared, because all the other camera's are black. They are marked in another way.
I think the best thing to do is to consult a professional Leica historian like James Lager.
Erik.
Your camera is constructed from mostly genuine Leica parts, but some are not of the period. The shutter release guard was only introduced with the Leica Model II (D).
The engraving on the lens front is very doubtful, as is the engraving of the serial number. But the engraving of the serial number cannot be compared, because all the other camera's are black. They are marked in another way.
I think the best thing to do is to consult a professional Leica historian like James Lager.
Erik.
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Vince Lupo
Whatever
We're going to be in contact with Jim, and hopefully he'll be able to weigh in on the matter. As far as the shutter release guard goes, page 33 of Gianni Rogliatti's 'Leica: The First 60 Years' depicts Leica I Luxus 465xx (can't read the entire humber) with a shutter guard. As well, page 47 of the same book shows a black I (c) with a shutter release guard. As far as the bottom of the camera goes, I wondered about that round wheel with the 'o' on it too, as well as the gap on the top of the camera between the underside of the shutter speed dial and the round 'platform' upon which it sits.
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