tilt-shift for rangefinders?

[Particular]

I use a Linhof Technika 70 with rf-coupled lenses. I frequently give the lens a little rise. Although I don't have direct feedback, I use the bottom line of the next smaller frame-line to represent the new bottom of the image. I imagine how much more it extends at the top and I have marked the lens board to indicate a set shift amount.
It is not perfect, but I can get pretty tight architectural shots from a walk around camera without bringing a tripod. The hardest part is holding the camera level, but that is the case without shifting as well.

 

[Particular]

Also, when I am using my 4x5 technika in a hurry, sometimes I don't take the time to use the ground glass. I will RF focus the lens, lock it, level the tripod, and use the wire frame finder. The nice thing about the wire frame is that it moves along with the lens, so that it correctly represents the amount of shift I am using.

 

[Frontman]

For film shooting it is impracticle. The amount of tilt or shift varies according to the postion of the camera, the angle you are holding it, the distance to the subject, and several other variables. With an SLR, large format, or digital camera, you can see the changes in perpective as you adjust the lens, but this is not possible with your garden-variety rangefinder film camera.

 

[Sparrow]

... so that's a 'possibly' ... but life's too short

 

[Roger Hicks]

The shift really is dead easy and has been addressed in a number of medium format cameras with graduated finders. Doing it by "gesstimate" with a PC lens on an M is also pretty easy, as Jaapv and I know (because we've tried it, instead of relying on flawed theory).

Cheers,

R.

 

[sevo]

The shift really is dead easy and has been addressed in a number of medium format cameras with graduated finders. Doing it by "gesstimate" with a PC lens on an M is also pretty easy, as Jaapv and I know (because we've tried it, instead of relying on flawed theory).

Tilts and swings however are difficult to do with a rangefinder or zone focus. Even if you have a camera with the swing axis right through the main node the lens (where one degree of swing still leaves everything along that axis in the rangefinder plane), you'll lose all control as soon as you add a second movement, and will need the ground glass (or live view) to control the effect of the movement on the off-axis parts of the subject. Unless you do one of these fashionable "model landscape" pictures with fairly random inverted swing - but for that purpose, you may as well save your money and blur that shot in the post...

Mind, few things are impossible - I've actually used swings on a Linhof blindly for architecture, thanks to a roll film back with broken darkslide. But it is not pleasant, and I had to swing-bracket the heck out of it in spite of subjects that permitted relatively easy guesses for the proper amount of swing.

 

[Roger Hicks]

Tilts and swings however are difficult to do with a rangefinder or zone focus.. . .
Mind, few things are impossible - I've actually used swings on a Linhof blindly for architecture, thanks to a roll film back with broken darkslide. But it is not pleasant, and I had to swing-bracket the heck out of it in spite of subjects that permitted relatively easy guesses for the proper amount of swing.

cf Post 14

Tilt can't work, of course, because you'd never know what was in focus (unless you bought an M Typ 240...)

All right, not actually impossible. But not dead easy like shift.

Cheers,

R.

 

[Spanik]

I had to swing-bracket the heck out of it

Nice new verb 😀

 

[oftheherd]

Tilt-shift and perspective control lenses for SLR cameras are available, if not widely so. Olympus, Nikon and Canon make them (or made them, in the case of Olympus). Does anyone around here know if there is such a beast in the 35mm rangefinder world?

Plenty of ideas and reasons not to try it on a 35mm camera designed as an RF from the get-go, or ways to do it.

If you aren't commited to finding a way to try it on 35mm, The Mamiya Super Press offers some perspective control with its rear bellows. But no tilt shift. The 50mm WA lens will give you some help in getting more area covered, but no other abilities of rise/fall/shift.

If you are willing to try other formats, you have other suggestions above, and some 9x2 folder cameras were fitted with rangefinders aftermarket. Most 9x12 folders have rise/fall/****, but only a few that seem quite rare have tilt. I have never seen one but have heard of a couple or maybe three that did.

CNJNY below has shown a clever way not to have to rely on the ground glass. I guess you only have to use the ground glass once see how accurate it is and then use the metal frame for rise/fall/tilt hand held.

Thanks CNNY. I don't know why that never occurred to dummy me. It now seems so apparent. :bang: 😛

Also, when I am using my 4x5 technika in a hurry, sometimes I don't take the time to use the ground glass. I will RF focus the lens, lock it, level the tripod, and use the wire frame finder. The nice thing about the wire frame is that it moves along with the lens, so that it correctly represents the amount of shift I am using.

 

[thompsonks]

😉 You can do just what you have in mind – in Photoshop, using the Perspective Crop tool on your RF scans.

 

[Chris101]

I've done tilt with a Crown, without using the ground glass. Visualize the scheimpflug planes and stop down, like this one, where I wanted it all in focus, even though I was right on top of one of the lights:

Didn't use the RF though, I scale focussed.

 

[Sparrow]

😉 You can do just what you have in mind – in Photoshop, using the Perspective Crop tool on your RF scans.

... or this?

 

[Muggins]

It will be interesting to see whether the thread's originator appears, seeing as they've managed less than 100 posts since 2007 when they started this, but have still posted this year. Obviously a person of few words!

Someone, somewhere must have thought that tilt-shift on a camera without TTL viewing was a good idea as I have a No3 Folding pocket Kodak of circa 1908 that has a limited tilt-shift facility, yet only a waist-level viewfinder. One day I must try it out, but as it needs paper negs until I find a 118 backing paper it won't be until I have a bright day and time to waste in the darkroom for all the repeats.

Adrian

 

[sevo]

Someone, somewhere must have thought that tilt-shift on a camera without TTL viewing was a good idea as I have a No3 Folding pocket Kodak of circa 1908 that has a limited tilt-shift facility, yet only a waist-level viewfinder.

Probably a design limitation rather than a feature - in cameras of that period it was quite common for the responsibility for proper alignment after unfolding to be entirely with the photographer.

 

[Muggins]

Well, the plot thickens, because I've just found this:
http://fourtoes.co.uk/iblog/?p=4700

so there may have been a reason for the tilt-shift (though intriguingly the camera pictured does not seem to have the levers for it that mine have). Kodak circa 1910 could teach people a few things about lack of standardisation!

Adrian