Grahamb
Member
Good morning all..
I was thinking on some prints i have been asked to do, and what was the time line on them, ie: how long before they fade, (inkjet)
To my point, inks to-day have 10-25 years depending on how you store them.
Yet 2-3000 years ago they did not have the tech we have to-day, and yet their papers are still with us.
Even to the Romans, less than 2000 years and their plaster has print on them, our we in this age not doing some thing right
I was thinking on some prints i have been asked to do, and what was the time line on them, ie: how long before they fade, (inkjet)
To my point, inks to-day have 10-25 years depending on how you store them.
Yet 2-3000 years ago they did not have the tech we have to-day, and yet their papers are still with us.
Even to the Romans, less than 2000 years and their plaster has print on them, our we in this age not doing some thing right
Sparrow
Veteran
... some pigments are more permanent than others, but even the best fade due to light and oxygen, and paper discolours if they contain or absorb any acids ... oh, and there is very little first century paper made it down to us undamaged anyway ...
Roger Hicks
Veteran
First of all, there's a big distinction between dye-based inks and pigment-based inks. Dyes are normally (but not always) much more fugitive.
Not all pigments fade. Mineral derived pigments (ochres, etc.) and carbon can last for a very long time: the Lascelles cave painting are probably at least 10,000 years old. Other pigments may last for many centuries unless they encounter specific reactants: ultramarine, for example, is bleached immediately by lemon juice.
Then, to make life still more interesting, there's a question of surface-area/volume relationships. A very finely ground pigment has a much larger surface area per volume and therefore, even if reactions are very slow, they will proceed faster than with a coarsely ground pigment.
On top of this there's the question of the medium (the liquid the pigment is suspended in) and the substrate (what it's sprayed, squirted or painted on to). Either may or may not react with the pigment. Frescos (paints applied to wet plaster) are particularly permanent.
Then there's daylight storage versus dark storage. As far as I'm aware (I may be wrong) it's mostly UV that harms inks.
This is a subject that has been studied in some depth by paint manufacturers: see for example http://www.winsornewton.com/resource-centre/composition-and-permanence-tables/#6
Cheers,
R.
icebear
Veteran
I guess all you ever wanted to know about longevity of inkjet prints can be found here :
http://www.wilhelm-research.com/
There are lots of combinations of archival paper and brand name inks tested/rated and some will rival traditional color photos easily.
http://www.wilhelm-research.com/
There are lots of combinations of archival paper and brand name inks tested/rated and some will rival traditional color photos easily.
icebear
Veteran
A very interesting point as the race for more print resolution an smaller and smaller ink droplets will require super fine pigment particles.
There was a Williamsburg (Brooklyn, NY) based painter who ventured into grinding his own oil paint pigments. Eventually after friends and colleagues liked what he did so much , he started small scale production of his paints.
His name is Carl Plansky. Unfortunately he passed away 2009
http://carlplansky.com/
He didn't have a standardized process to grind all pigments into the same specs of particle size but rather he played around with each individual pigment to find the sweet spot for the best performance in his paint. This is a very particular property in the Williamsburg oil paints that are still distributed by another company today, supposedly following Carl's formulas.
Such a craft's man approach is not suitable for inkjets with super fine nozzles but the visual properties of these paints are just stunning. Some people love them, others hate them because they all have individual character and coarseness of the pigments. You will have to adjust a little how to work with them but they are gorgeous, in my book.
Grahamb
Member
Well to start, Roger i never expected an answer like that, i have some serious reading to do.
I have some of your books and very fine reading there lies.
To think these days we take little matters of inks to liberally and not give to much thought to how or why.
I have considered how the inks on walls of caves and villas of 2000 years plus ever stayed.
The way you put your post over, you would think you teach for a living, good on you.
Kind regards Graham
I have some of your books and very fine reading there lies.
To think these days we take little matters of inks to liberally and not give to much thought to how or why.
I have considered how the inks on walls of caves and villas of 2000 years plus ever stayed.
The way you put your post over, you would think you teach for a living, good on you.
Kind regards Graham