menos
Veteran
I got bitten a bit by the panoramic bug, seeing those wonderful things, one can do with this image format (I am not a landscape photographer, but exclusively interested in documenting urban life).
I am trying, to force myself, to think panoramic, searching for scenes, that might "work" this way - quite difficult, when having used the brain otherwise for a while ;-)
Here is one of my experiments:
"morning - a panorama" M9 | Nikkor-S.C 1.4 5cm
a bigger version on my blog
I am trying, to force myself, to think panoramic, searching for scenes, that might "work" this way - quite difficult, when having used the brain otherwise for a while ;-)
Here is one of my experiments:
"morning - a panorama" M9 | Nikkor-S.C 1.4 5cm
a bigger version on my blog
Colin Corneau
Colin Corneau
I own an XPan, and have made several trips to various regions of China with it...it seems such a natural camera for that place. To each his own, I guess...to me, it seems like one would not have to think or try very hard to rationalize that choice there.
If nothing else, you can flip a switch and shoot regular 35mm proportions!
If nothing else, you can flip a switch and shoot regular 35mm proportions!
kuzano
Veteran
Two things to consider....
Two things to consider....
I love panorama and do quite a bit of it myself....
My observations (only opinions)
1. I could never imagine doing panoramic with 35mm film to start with, and never at the price for the X-pan, or the Fuji on which it is based. I would only consider medium format, and not necessarily a dedicated panoramic camera, which leads to point 2.
2. With the great stitching software that is so easy to use, I do panorama with conventional framing formats, ie 6X7 or 6X9, or digital, and stitch.
Two things to consider....
I love panorama and do quite a bit of it myself....
My observations (only opinions)
1. I could never imagine doing panoramic with 35mm film to start with, and never at the price for the X-pan, or the Fuji on which it is based. I would only consider medium format, and not necessarily a dedicated panoramic camera, which leads to point 2.
2. With the great stitching software that is so easy to use, I do panorama with conventional framing formats, ie 6X7 or 6X9, or digital, and stitch.
Harry S.
Well-known
I recently sold my xpan pretty cheaply. Nice camera and lens, but the novelty wore off for me. Im now going the opposite in terms of ratio with 4x5 and 6x6!
nksyoon
Well-known
A bit difficult doing stitched panos in urban environments where you have moving subjects - people and vehicles.
Chriscrawfordphoto
Real Men Shoot Film.
Agreed with what Nick said. For urban scenes, you need a one-shot solution. Here's a cheap and good way to do it: Get a 645 SLR. Mamiya 645 pro or a Bronica ETRSi. Get the 45mm lens. This is cheap for Mamiya, about $200 for one in nearly new condition. The Bronica should be similarly cheap (I have a Mamiya 645, so I'm more familiar with the system). That's the same as your standard Xpan lens. Mamiya makes a 30mm lens that goes for about $400 used. Much cheaper than the outrageously priced 30mm Xpan lens.
Shoot with the intention of cropping some of the top and bottom if the 645 frame. You get the same effective film size as the Xpan at much less cost in a camera that is still small and fast enough to shoot quickly, handheld.
These are a couple I've made by cropping a pano out of a 645 frame.
Shoot with the intention of cropping some of the top and bottom if the 645 frame. You get the same effective film size as the Xpan at much less cost in a camera that is still small and fast enough to shoot quickly, handheld.
These are a couple I've made by cropping a pano out of a 645 frame.
Tim Gray
Well-known
I just bought an Xpan. So far I'm really enjoying it. While the others above make good points, you can get an Xpan for ~$1200-1400 with the 45 lens. You don't really need the 30 in my opinion. Anyway, one of the great things about the camera is that it's small - it's not that much larger than a Leica M.
I'm sure the novelty will wear off at some point, since not everything is a panoramic shot, but so far I've been having fun. It's nice to have a small camera that takes the same film as my other cameras, so it meshes much better with a 35mm rangefinder shooter. It's also nice that you can get it scanned at pretty high resolutions on 35mm film scanners. I only have a Coolscan V so scanning MF would require me to figure something else out for scanning.
But in the end, you don't 'need' it, but if you want it and can afford it, it's ok to pick one up and try it out.
I'm sure the novelty will wear off at some point, since not everything is a panoramic shot, but so far I've been having fun. It's nice to have a small camera that takes the same film as my other cameras, so it meshes much better with a 35mm rangefinder shooter. It's also nice that you can get it scanned at pretty high resolutions on 35mm film scanners. I only have a Coolscan V so scanning MF would require me to figure something else out for scanning.
But in the end, you don't 'need' it, but if you want it and can afford it, it's ok to pick one up and try it out.
Parkes Owen
grain fed
There a plenty of cheap MF options , but they are mostly SLR`s, so to get a 25mm FOV like the xpan will have a typical wide angle look and distortion.
The only real contender is the mamiya m7 which is much bigger and just as expensive, but generally, a true panoramic camera is better for that kind of work, as you won`t need to crop `in viewfinder` or later in print.
You don`t really need an xpan anymore than you need a leica m to make good pictures, but if that`s the format you like, it`s a damn good camera !
The only real contender is the mamiya m7 which is much bigger and just as expensive, but generally, a true panoramic camera is better for that kind of work, as you won`t need to crop `in viewfinder` or later in print.
You don`t really need an xpan anymore than you need a leica m to make good pictures, but if that`s the format you like, it`s a damn good camera !
sanmich
Veteran
Chris, that sounds a great idea.
do you draw lines on the camera screen in order to better visualize the format?
atlcruiser
Part Yeti
My .02
Of course you dont need it
The IQ of the x pan is equal to MF. I think of my x pan as a slice of MF not a long 35mm
I dont like image stiching at all but nothing wrong with it
Of course one can crop other size images down to a pano format with good result. But that is a crop of an overall picture. I enjoy the view of the pano format
I enjoy the constraints of the pano format and find it to be liberating in its limits. The initial challenge of the format soon gave way to the desire to find images that fit well into the format.
Downsides of MF crops...much bigger camera, fewer images per roll, slower to use plus my opinion of the crops listed above.
The mamiya 7 with the pano adapter is a cool idea i might look into one day just to use the lenses but the PITA factor will be there. It could be a nice mid point solution for some folks
The x pan is very robust, very user friendly and quick to use in the field.
My original thought with my x pan was landscapes and such. Although I use it for that a bit I am not thrilled it for that use. I think a 6x17 would do a much better job and some of the Chinese ones are very close in price to the x pan. I have been playing a bit with 5"x10" as well.
My main use of the x pan is a pano street/urban camera. Fast/small/light/easy to use/great IQ
0711 1 bw 35 009.jpg by urbanlandcruiser, on Flickr
Of course you dont need it
The IQ of the x pan is equal to MF. I think of my x pan as a slice of MF not a long 35mm
I dont like image stiching at all but nothing wrong with it
Of course one can crop other size images down to a pano format with good result. But that is a crop of an overall picture. I enjoy the view of the pano format
I enjoy the constraints of the pano format and find it to be liberating in its limits. The initial challenge of the format soon gave way to the desire to find images that fit well into the format.
Downsides of MF crops...much bigger camera, fewer images per roll, slower to use plus my opinion of the crops listed above.
The mamiya 7 with the pano adapter is a cool idea i might look into one day just to use the lenses but the PITA factor will be there. It could be a nice mid point solution for some folks
The x pan is very robust, very user friendly and quick to use in the field.
My original thought with my x pan was landscapes and such. Although I use it for that a bit I am not thrilled it for that use. I think a 6x17 would do a much better job and some of the Chinese ones are very close in price to the x pan. I have been playing a bit with 5"x10" as well.
My main use of the x pan is a pano street/urban camera. Fast/small/light/easy to use/great IQ
0711 1 bw 35 009.jpg by urbanlandcruiser, on Flickr
nksyoon
Well-known
Other advantages of 35mm film over 120 are a wider choice of film types and more shots per roll.
maddoc
... likes film again.
I consider Nate`s (Mr. E) work with the XPAN in the devastated areas of North-East Japan after the Tsunami to be outstanding and think these were amongst the best images I have seen ever taken in panoramic format. For sure it is not everybody`s cup of tea but I think that these photos highly benefited from using a XPAN.
Colin Corneau
Colin Corneau
I've wet-printed my XPan shots up to 20 inches wide, and they look great -- the lenses for that camera are easily the sharpest I own.
As has been noted, if you are dedicated to a panoramic format this is one of the best to use, not just for quality but for ease of use.
As has been noted, if you are dedicated to a panoramic format this is one of the best to use, not just for quality but for ease of use.
didjiman
Richard Man
Readers of this forum would no doubt know what my answer may be; as a owner of two XPan-II, I am very enthusiastic about the camera and the pano format.
But do you need it? Probably not. OTOH, if you want to shoot pano format, it is the most convenient way to do it, with exceptional image quality to boot. The only other similar thing is the Widelux / Noblex etc., but they are swing lens design.
You can crop 645 or 67 for sure, but 35mm rolls cost less and more convenient to use and cost less to develop, and you see (more or less) exactly what you will see in the viewfinder.
Stitching digital frames work also, but again you lose the "this is what I see now" capability and the ability to shoot dynamic images.
(To act as my own devil's advocate, I read about someone who takes multiple up/down across digital frames, with HDR multiple exposures for each frame, and then at post processing selects the best combination of frames to create the final image, and so it goes...)
But do you need it? Probably not. OTOH, if you want to shoot pano format, it is the most convenient way to do it, with exceptional image quality to boot. The only other similar thing is the Widelux / Noblex etc., but they are swing lens design.
You can crop 645 or 67 for sure, but 35mm rolls cost less and more convenient to use and cost less to develop, and you see (more or less) exactly what you will see in the viewfinder.
Stitching digital frames work also, but again you lose the "this is what I see now" capability and the ability to shoot dynamic images.
(To act as my own devil's advocate, I read about someone who takes multiple up/down across digital frames, with HDR multiple exposures for each frame, and then at post processing selects the best combination of frames to create the final image, and so it goes...)
menos
Veteran
You guys are great! ;-)
Thank you all so much for the diverse input.
for the fun of it, I posted a similar post on LUF, prepared to be tarred and feathered, I suggested a M9 variant, replacing the current 18MP sensor with a similarly high resolution 36mm wide panoramic sensor + change of frame line masks.
I am looking for a nice deal on a XPan with 45mm lens now.
I have no interest in the 30mm lens (the cost + low speed + necessary filter is absolutely prohibitive).
Is the XPan II indeed so much better than the XPan ?
I am mainly a AE mode shooter, switching to manual exposure only in tricky light, but need an internal meter with proper meter display.
I understand, the original XPan is inconvenient, shooting manually and metering through the finder?
I am not willing, to do a 2.000 EUR experiment with a XPan II, but a XPan in part exchange with my shelved EPSON R-D1 is a possibility …
I will it the camera markets next weekend.
I understand, that the XPan came over it's life with diverse issues/ malfunctions (normal to any camera).
What would be a good checklist, to work through with a second hand, unwarranted camera?
Is there a nice XPan resource site around?
Thanks for any tips.
Thank you all so much for the diverse input.
for the fun of it, I posted a similar post on LUF, prepared to be tarred and feathered, I suggested a M9 variant, replacing the current 18MP sensor with a similarly high resolution 36mm wide panoramic sensor + change of frame line masks.
I am looking for a nice deal on a XPan with 45mm lens now.
I have no interest in the 30mm lens (the cost + low speed + necessary filter is absolutely prohibitive).
Is the XPan II indeed so much better than the XPan ?
I am mainly a AE mode shooter, switching to manual exposure only in tricky light, but need an internal meter with proper meter display.
I understand, the original XPan is inconvenient, shooting manually and metering through the finder?
I am not willing, to do a 2.000 EUR experiment with a XPan II, but a XPan in part exchange with my shelved EPSON R-D1 is a possibility …
I will it the camera markets next weekend.
I understand, that the XPan came over it's life with diverse issues/ malfunctions (normal to any camera).
What would be a good checklist, to work through with a second hand, unwarranted camera?
Is there a nice XPan resource site around?
Thanks for any tips.
Bill58
Native Texan
Wait and get one here. They're going cheap now. I know--I just sold one that was perfect, had an extremely low no. of shots on it, and got less than the going rate on eBay.
They're fine cameras, but I wonder how you get the complicated electronics fixed if things go wrong.
They're fine cameras, but I wonder how you get the complicated electronics fixed if things go wrong.
menos
Veteran
Thanks Bill,
I am generally too slow for the RFF classifieds though and importing a complete camera to China mainland is messy with the nice people form the customs of the Peoples Republic of China ;-)
I am generally too slow for the RFF classifieds though and importing a complete camera to China mainland is messy with the nice people form the customs of the Peoples Republic of China ;-)
35mmdelux
Veni, vidi, vici
The Xpan was one of my favorite cameras. One of the few cameras I missed after selling.
Tim Gray
Well-known
I bought an XPan, not a II. I'd love to have a II, but after talking to Nate about it, the original sounded good enough. The biggest problem with the original is that when you have the camera AE and you meter, the shutter speed is displayed on the back of the camera, not in the viewfinder. Not a huge deal during good light, but when it starts to get darker, it can be a bit of a hassle to check it to make sure your shutter speeds aren't too long. Not $1000 hassle though.
The other changes are minor in my opinion. Manual works as it should. Activate the meter, and change the shutter speed or aperture until the viewfinder displays the dot.
The other changes are minor in my opinion. Manual works as it should. Activate the meter, and change the shutter speed or aperture until the viewfinder displays the dot.
Colin Corneau
Colin Corneau
FWIW, I almost always shoot on manual on my XPan (I have the first, not the II version). The AE seems to be pretty good, for those that prefer that.
This is a solid, reliable, strong camera. For what you get, the price is very reasonable.
This is a solid, reliable, strong camera. For what you get, the price is very reasonable.