Apologies for the long post. :}
A couple of months ago I posted a thread about a repair experience with Gus Lazzari concerning two Leica CLs.
This is a follow-up post to outline my experience, and evaluate the quality of the work.
Bear in mind, I've sent gear to Gus before (an M4 several years ago) and found the work to be excellent.
Originally, he promised a 10 week turn, after estimate approval, and I was in no rush (which I explicitly stated) so I shipped him the cameras.
This email conversation took place Feb 20, 2019:
"Hi Gus, do you work on these?
I have 2 that have minor issues. Meters appear to work although on one the meter tends to be jumpy, probably a bad connection, viewfinders and RF patches are clean. One appears to have the frameline mask that is out of position. Shutters seem to be fine."
His reply:
"As you may know, these Japanese Leica camera bodies are labor intensive and have among other things, lubricant failures.
This can cause the highest & most critical speeds to be out of factory tolerance. Bad lube can out-gas to other internal areas that
would now be considered contamination. RF systems with possible shock or impact can have their calibrations thrown off.
You can also have metering issues caused mainly by past battery corrosion.
Therefore, the complete teardown, clean, lubricate and adjusting (C L A) to a Leica CL camera averages $325.
Keep in mind that I service a camera as if I owned it, so my repairs are therefore mainly for the perfectionist.
That said, I'm basically not a low cost "speedy" type of service technician.
The camera condition does sometimes vary, so I should see it before finalizing any price.
If you wish for me to perform this Leica restoration, then please send it to:
TLC Camera Repair
4554 Chestnut Street Ext.
High Point, NC 27265-8642 USA"
He received the cameras on Feb 22, and sent a short description of the condition of both cameras on Feb 24.
"They're now on a estimate bench.
Your repair 'place in line' has been added chronologically to our password protected website tab. (After official approval we'll pass that on to you)
We'll soon send you the results of the detailed inspections along with the official repair estimates. "
On June 12, I emailed him to see if the estimates were done yet.
10 week turn after estimate approval, but at this point it was fully 17 weeks since he had received the cameras…and still no estimate…
No reply.
On June 19, I asked again.
On June 22, still without a reply, I sent this:
"It’s been 17 weeks and not even an estimate yet…and no reply to emails.
Please respond, thank you."
On that day, he responded with apologies, and stated:
"Now since both units fell within the average email quoted pricing, I've already proceeded with the various service stages of the bodies."
I thought this rather odd: I had not yet received an estimate nor approved one, but he'd already started work? (He never actually asked for, nor did I ever give him an official 'estimate approval', as things turned out.)
He also sent a link to his repair queue, along with a password.
At this point, the two CLs were number 67 in the queue...which interestingly was filled almost entirely with Leica gear.
On Dec 2, after having no updates for nearly 6 months, I logged in to look at the queue, and the two CLs had now moved up to #48 in the queue….only 19 spots in 174 days, to be exact.
I emailed him:
"At this pace, to move from #48 to #1 will take another 14 months…
I think it’s time to cancel this, if you can box the CLs up and tell me the shipping weight, I’ll email you a prepaid ship label."
He replied that day:
"It's ashamed that I'm so busy, but working for perfection on Leica's is very time-consuming.
I*can*certainly understand your request, & so sorry for having decimated*the original ETA times for completion.
Both CL's have already undergone several repair stages; among other things, I recently finished both of their delicate ('bad' RF) sanitizing procedures.
I do CL & CLE units in batches so they're on several of the shop's benches. In fact, both of yours are in their final reassembly stages prior to the*
fine-tune*calibration*of the shutter, meter & RF.
But now since you've come to the end of your patience, I'll immediately get back to those two and finish them up (anticipate completion on Friday)."
I was ok with this, so asked him to proceed, and reminded him to calibrate the meter for 1.5v silver oxide cells.
At this point he essentially bumped the CLs up in the queue from #48 to #1, although the queue never actually was updated until they disappeared from it.
There were a few follow-up emails regarding the meter adjustment, and then I received an invoice.
On January 31, I emailed to ask if the calibration was completed yet, which it was, so I sent him a prepaid ship label.
The cameras arrived a few days later, extremely well packed, each of them wrapped separately in heavy duty plastic envelopes, with some specific notes about each camera printed on adhesive labels that were attached to the envelopes.
I inspected each camera closely, and can honestly say that I'd never before seen any CL in such condition. If I could imagine what it was like in 1973 to open a new, factory-packaged CL at a camera store, this is what I would have seen…super bright, clean, clear viewfinders, with very contrasty RF patches and framelines, silky smooth shutter dials (I've had a few CLs where shutter dials took an inordinate amount of effort to turn), and very smooth shutter releases, with quiet shutter action.
It's stating the obvious, but a rangefinder is all about the viewfinder and RF patch. When the RF double image definitively syncs, so it's completely obvious to the eye, without any uncertainty whatsoever as to when focus is achieved, that's what makes a rangefinder enjoyable, and I simply hadn't experienced anything that dramatic with a CL before.
I've owned many CLs over the years, and have handled many more, along with untold number of M bodies (from factory new, to decades old), Hexar RFs, Zeiss Ikons, CLEs, and other rangefinders of all types. And I've sent lots of them to the various repair shops (DAG, Youxin, Sherry, etc.) So I have plenty of experience evaluating condition…
It helped, of course, that these two CLs were already in excellent cosmetic condition, no dings or dents or paint loss; that definitely added to the impression; but suffice it to say the work Gus performed was impeccable.
For the first time, I know what it's like to use a 'new' CL, and I have to say it's a great experience. Unlike other CLs that I've owned that had dingy viewfinders and faint/weak RF patches, jumpy/erratic meters, and other such issues, these two are truly a joy to use.
Turns out my impression of the CL was mistaken, based on the fact all my experiences were with cameras that had viewfinders that were in less than optimal condition, making them harder to focus.
I would have to say that it was worth the year wait.
That being said, if you decide to send gear to Gus, I would recommend following up more often than I did. Not being in a rush is one thing, but if I had not followed up in December (fully 10 months after he received the cameras), who knows how much longer it would have taken?
It's a fine line, emailing service techs too often, versus emailing too infrequently, but I would suggest being friendly, fair, but firm is the way to approach things.
If the promise is 10 weeks after estimate, then remind him every communication of that promised timeline (maybe even note the specific calendar date for completion) and perhaps emphasize the importance of getting the estimate done in a timely manner, not just the actual work…
I'll also be suggesting ideas to Gus about how he can improve his queue system.
Hope this helps anyone who is considering sending gear to Gus.
Attached below is the list of work performed on the CLs.
Attachments
ornate_wrasse
Moderator
Thank you for your well written and detailed update. It's always nice to hear about positive experiences when a camera is sent in to be repaired.
Huss
Veteran
I had a similar experience when I sent in an M3 DS. Way past schedule, with no action until I asked for the camera back because I had waited too long. Then all of a sudden it was done.
So it seems that if it looks like he'll lose work, he'll do it.
The work and the camera was good but I was a bit bummed that he did not replace some worn cosmetic parts (which I would have paid for), nor hammered out a little ding from the inside of the top plate. I guess I fell for the line that cameras sent to him would come back looking like new. Perhaps only if that was how they looked like when they were sent to him!
So it seems that if it looks like he'll lose work, he'll do it.
The work and the camera was good but I was a bit bummed that he did not replace some worn cosmetic parts (which I would have paid for), nor hammered out a little ding from the inside of the top plate. I guess I fell for the line that cameras sent to him would come back looking like new. Perhaps only if that was how they looked like when they were sent to him!
mpaniagua
Newby photographer
Thanks. Really enjoy objective review for service people. Sometimes people get all mad and state only the bad experiences. Your review points out to a great technician with an excellent technical service but a little lacking on customer service. Some may find this acceptable and some not. Horses for courses I suppose.
Thanks.
Thanks.
Ambro51
Collector/Photographer
The condition of your returned camera was worth the wait. It IS a fine line between a casual “hows it going? 
“ to a “ITS BEEN 214 Days and YOU SAID blah blah blah...:-( “. We should appreciate these repair folks and give the time and space they need to do the best job. ......camera repair requires good Karma. One nagging email can eat at your craw and shake off good Karma. Let us be kind to our techs..... Again Congrats in your New CLs!!
“ to a “ITS BEEN 214 Days and YOU SAID blah blah blah...:-( “. We should appreciate these repair folks and give the time and space they need to do the best job. ......camera repair requires good Karma. One nagging email can eat at your craw and shake off good Karma. Let us be kind to our techs..... Again Congrats in your New CLs!!
The irony here was that I wasn’t looking for fast turnaround but when the extrapolation resulted in a two year total time, that was a bit much.
For anyone that has a CL, I’d recommend getting it serviced to the same level, the viewfinder is truly superb. Other CLs that I’ve used were usable but there always was extra effort required to confirm focus. It’s a dramatic improvement.
For anyone that has a CL, I’d recommend getting it serviced to the same level, the viewfinder is truly superb. Other CLs that I’ve used were usable but there always was extra effort required to confirm focus. It’s a dramatic improvement.
wjlapier
Well-known
Just curious why you didn't send the CL's to DAG? I've sent two CL's to him and the latest one I received back is also in "As New" condition and can use modern 1.5v battery. Your right about the finder. Very bright, clean, and the RFer patch is easily seen.
I could have, as I’ve sent many cameras and lenses to him before. All the good Leica techs are booked solid, and there are fewer of them who will still work on CLs.
I figured DAG would take a lot longer than 10 weeks.
I figured DAG would take a lot longer than 10 weeks.
wjlapier
Well-known
6 weeks
At least you got them back and in great working order.
Awesome little cameras I'm surprised they haven't gone up in value like the M6's.
Mine was in mint condition and had a jammed shutter so the price was really low to purchase. DAG fixed the jam and did a full CLA which includes the battery mod.
At least you got them back and in great working order.
Awesome little cameras I'm surprised they haven't gone up in value like the M6's.
Mine was in mint condition and had a jammed shutter so the price was really low to purchase. DAG fixed the jam and did a full CLA which includes the battery mod.
Awesome! Can't beat DAG.
Too many Leicaphiles look askance at the lowly CL, keeping the prices low. It's not a real M, made in Japan, blah blah....
Good thing, I'd rather shoot with this CL than any M! Smaller, lighter, it's like a modern barnack with a meter, a good match with small lenses, and easy loading. Love it!
Too many Leicaphiles look askance at the lowly CL, keeping the prices low. It's not a real M, made in Japan, blah blah....
Good thing, I'd rather shoot with this CL than any M! Smaller, lighter, it's like a modern barnack with a meter, a good match with small lenses, and easy loading. Love it!
That's really good news, a strong statement from DAG...
MikeL
Go Fish
Great, please ship me your black paint M5 when you have a chance. Thank you.
D
Deleted member 65559
Guest
"black paint M5" ?
css9450
Veteran
Thirty lashes for mixing up black paint and black chrome!
this one...but it's already en route to Hong Kong to its new owner, sorry @mikel
D
Deleted member 65559
Guest
the forum has spoken
wjlapier
Well-known
Sure, I'll share a pic of my CL:
@wjlapier do you frame the 28mm using the entire viewfinder?
That’s a pretty combo. I need to get an Amedeo adapter so I can use my 50 and 35 S mount Nikkors...
That’s a pretty combo. I need to get an Amedeo adapter so I can use my 50 and 35 S mount Nikkors...
hap
Well-known
Apologies for the long post. :}
A couple of months ago I posted a thread about a repair experience with Gus Lazzari concerning two Leica CLs.
This is a follow-up post to outline my experience, and evaluate the quality of the work.
Bear in mind, I've sent gear to Gus before (an M4 several years ago) and found the work to be excellent.
Originally, he promised a 10 week turn, after estimate approval, and I was in no rush (which I explicitly stated) so I shipped him the cameras.
This email conversation took place Feb 20, 2019:
"Hi Gus, do you work on these?
I have 2 that have minor issues. Meters appear to work although on one the meter tends to be jumpy, probably a bad connection, viewfinders and RF patches are clean. One appears to have the frameline mask that is out of position. Shutters seem to be fine."
His reply:
"As you may know, these Japanese Leica camera bodies are labor intensive and have among other things, lubricant failures.
This can cause the highest & most critical speeds to be out of factory tolerance. Bad lube can out-gas to other internal areas that
would now be considered contamination. RF systems with possible shock or impact can have their calibrations thrown off.
You can also have metering issues caused mainly by past battery corrosion.
Therefore, the complete teardown, clean, lubricate and adjusting (C L A) to a Leica CL camera averages $325.
Keep in mind that I service a camera as if I owned it, so my repairs are therefore mainly for the perfectionist.
That said, I'm basically not a low cost "speedy" type of service technician.
The camera condition does sometimes vary, so I should see it before finalizing any price.
If you wish for me to perform this Leica restoration, then please send it to:
TLC Camera Repair
4554 Chestnut Street Ext.
High Point, NC 27265-8642 USA"
He received the cameras on Feb 22, and sent a short description of the condition of both cameras on Feb 24.
"They're now on a estimate bench.
Your repair 'place in line' has been added chronologically to our password protected website tab. (After official approval we'll pass that on to you)
We'll soon send you the results of the detailed inspections along with the official repair estimates. "
On June 12, I emailed him to see if the estimates were done yet.
10 week turn after estimate approval, but at this point it was fully 17 weeks since he had received the cameras…and still no estimate…
No reply.
On June 19, I asked again.
On June 22, still without a reply, I sent this:
"It’s been 17 weeks and not even an estimate yet…and no reply to emails.
Please respond, thank you."
On that day, he responded with apologies, and stated:
"Now since both units fell within the average email quoted pricing, I've already proceeded with the various service stages of the bodies."
I thought this rather odd: I had not yet received an estimate nor approved one, but he'd already started work? (He never actually asked for, nor did I ever give him an official 'estimate approval', as things turned out.)
He also sent a link to his repair queue, along with a password.
At this point, the two CLs were number 67 in the queue...which interestingly was filled almost entirely with Leica gear.
On Dec 2, after having no updates for nearly 6 months, I logged in to look at the queue, and the two CLs had now moved up to #48 in the queue….only 19 spots in 174 days, to be exact.
I emailed him:
"At this pace, to move from #48 to #1 will take another 14 months…
I think it’s time to cancel this, if you can box the CLs up and tell me the shipping weight, I’ll email you a prepaid ship label."
He replied that day:
"It's ashamed that I'm so busy, but working for perfection on Leica's is very time-consuming.
I*can*certainly understand your request, & so sorry for having decimated*the original ETA times for completion.
Both CL's have already undergone several repair stages; among other things, I recently finished both of their delicate ('bad' RF) sanitizing procedures.
I do CL & CLE units in batches so they're on several of the shop's benches. In fact, both of yours are in their final reassembly stages prior to the*
fine-tune*calibration*of the shutter, meter & RF.
But now since you've come to the end of your patience, I'll immediately get back to those two and finish them up (anticipate completion on Friday)."
I was ok with this, so asked him to proceed, and reminded him to calibrate the meter for 1.5v silver oxide cells.
At this point he essentially bumped the CLs up in the queue from #48 to #1, although the queue never actually was updated until they disappeared from it.
There were a few follow-up emails regarding the meter adjustment, and then I received an invoice.
On January 31, I emailed to ask if the calibration was completed yet, which it was, so I sent him a prepaid ship label.
The cameras arrived a few days later, extremely well packed, each of them wrapped separately in heavy duty plastic envelopes, with some specific notes about each camera printed on adhesive labels that were attached to the envelopes.
I inspected each camera closely, and can honestly say that I'd never before seen any CL in such condition. If I could imagine what it was like in 1973 to open a new, factory-packaged CL at a camera store, this is what I would have seen…super bright, clean, clear viewfinders, with very contrasty RF patches and framelines, silky smooth shutter dials (I've had a few CLs where shutter dials took an inordinate amount of effort to turn), and very smooth shutter releases, with quiet shutter action.
It's stating the obvious, but a rangefinder is all about the viewfinder and RF patch. When the RF double image definitively syncs, so it's completely obvious to the eye, without any uncertainty whatsoever as to when focus is achieved, that's what makes a rangefinder enjoyable, and I simply hadn't experienced anything that dramatic with a CL before.
I've owned many CLs over the years, and have handled many more, along with untold number of M bodies (from factory new, to decades old), Hexar RFs, Zeiss Ikons, CLEs, and other rangefinders of all types. And I've sent lots of them to the various repair shops (DAG, Youxin, Sherry, etc.) So I have plenty of experience evaluating condition…
It helped, of course, that these two CLs were already in excellent cosmetic condition, no dings or dents or paint loss; that definitely added to the impression; but suffice it to say the work Gus performed was impeccable.
For the first time, I know what it's like to use a 'new' CL, and I have to say it's a great experience. Unlike other CLs that I've owned that had dingy viewfinders and faint/weak RF patches, jumpy/erratic meters, and other such issues, these two are truly a joy to use.
Turns out my impression of the CL was mistaken, based on the fact all my experiences were with cameras that had viewfinders that were in less than optimal condition, making them harder to focus.
I would have to say that it was worth the year wait.
That being said, if you decide to send gear to Gus, I would recommend following up more often than I did. Not being in a rush is one thing, but if I had not followed up in December (fully 10 months after he received the cameras), who knows how much longer it would have taken?
It's a fine line, emailing service techs too often, versus emailing too infrequently, but I would suggest being friendly, fair, but firm is the way to approach things.
If the promise is 10 weeks after estimate, then remind him every communication of that promised timeline (maybe even note the specific calendar date for completion) and perhaps emphasize the importance of getting the estimate done in a timely manner, not just the actual work…
I'll also be suggesting ideas to Gus about how he can improve his queue system.
Hope this helps anyone who is considering sending gear to Gus.
Attached below is the list of work performed on the CLs.
I’d that a collapsible Elmer on your CL? Can you collapse it?
I like Gus. Knew him when he was in California. We still miss him. A pro.