Using an external 21mm viewfinder on top of the camera viewfinder?

[umcelinho]

Hello there.

I'm currently with an MP240 with the 21/1.8 and 40/1.2 Voigtlanders. Used to shoot a lot with a 21 using an external viewfinder on my M4 back in my film years. And I remember seeing some hotshoe accessory adapters that had an extension to have an external viewfinder placed on top of the camera's viewfinder.

Wondering if anyone here could share their experiences and/or thoughts regarding that kind of solution vs just having the external viewfinder being used centered with the lens. I feel that the viewfinders are not that accurate anyway for framing, so not being centered perhaps won't be such a big deal, but looking for some first hand feedback.

I wouldn't hunt for one of those double shoe adapters though, I'd just MacGuyver a shoe adapter over gaffer tape so that it's a non permanent hack.

I know the EVF2 would offer the most precise rendition of what the camera will capture, but for when I need precision I can always use the LCD. I mostly shoot with the 21 using hyperfocal anyway so focusing and then framing is not such a big deal to me.

Many thanks!

 

[tunalegs]

😕 Why? The accessory shoe is closer to the lens than the camera's built in viewfinder, which is good. Ideally the viewfinder should be as close to the lens as possible to reduce parallax. The framelines of the camera's viewfinder has a mechanism which compensates for parallax, that an accessory viewfinder will not have, so moving the accessory finder over, further away from the lens would be the worst possible decision to make in this scenario.

 

[Ko.Fe.]

Yes, on Ms it close to the vertical lens axle, no parallax correction is needed on this axle (just like on many folders, while some have it in the corner and it is much worse).

Winogrand was using normally places VFs for framing and RF for focusing. I can't call his photos as inaccurate in framing.

But if you slap it in the corner, the only advantage is to have your breathing apparatus fully exposed, not smashed against of the camera back.

I would still give it a try, but big names adapters are terribly overpriced and MiC is not available, it seems.

 

[umcelinho]

Thanks, guys. I was curious as to having it on the side instead of centered to the lens would make a significant impact, for closer framing which would be the most critical with parallax I'd likely use the LCD anyway.

My idea was to be able to quickly focus using the RF and move the eye up to frame the shot. I guess I'll get the ovf anyway and give it a try, won't hurt.

 

[rhl-oregon]

Marcelo, I use a 21ovf on my M-D with the ZM 21/2.8. No framing problems, though I tend to leave a little room to crop.

Here are two samples:

 

[umcelinho]

So I've done this test with gaffer tape and a cold shoe I've cannibalised from a crappy P&S and it turned out quite alright! Parallax seems to not be an issue even in closer shots. For really close shots (50-70cm) I end up using the LCD on the camera anyway, so far it has been working nicely. I still gotta find a more elegant (read "not as unstable") way to put it together though, but happy with how it feels when shooting. It's silly but it does feel much more natural to focus and frame this way.

 

[giganova]

I think you are referring to the Voigtlander double shoe adapter. Adorama and B&H have some knockoffs since the Voigtlander is no longer in production (but you can still find it on Ebay).

I have the 21mm Voigtlander metal viewfinder on the hot shoe and find that framing is accurate enough. I learned that everything that is within the white frame lines will be on the negative.

 

[shawn]

I use the Voigtlander 21/25 finder and just leave it in the hotshoe. I have the Snapshot Skopar so I don't even use the rangefinder when shooting that lens.

Shawn

 

[umcelinho]

Hi, guys, I'm aware of the Voigtlander double shoe, but it's usually hard to find and when it shows up, it's not cheap.

I'm using a thumbs up on the MP240, so the actual camera shoe is already taken. Removing the thumbs up to put the finder and doing this back and forth is a bit of a hassle. For a new camera I'd get the thumbs up with the added shoe on top, but for now it's what I have in my hands.

To be honest I prefer the plastic 21 viewfinder - it's lighter, this one has only the 21mm framelines and if by any chance they move inside the finder I can open it with a screwdriver and fix it - I got the metal 21/25 finder as soon as it was released and my copy had crooked lines.. and it's sealed shut, which was very frustrating.

I've shot for years with ultrawides (12 and 15 Heliars, a 21/2.8 ZM Biogon, and then the 21/1.8 which for hyperfocal of course does not need accurate focusing but at f1.8 for close to mid ranges it's a must.

ps: giganova, your M4 sets are stunning. wow. I miss mine - it was the default though 🙂

 

[shawn]

I'm using a thumbs up on the MP240, so the actual camera shoe is already taken. Removing the thumbs up to put the finder and doing this back and forth is a bit of a hassle. For a new camera I'd get the thumbs up with the added shoe on top, but for now it's what I have in my hands.

I have the Thumbs Up with the hot shoe (CSEP-10S) which is great for the OVF. You might see about epoxying your taped on hotshoe to the Thumbs Up. JB Weld or something similar would likely take care of it.

Shawn

 

[JoeV]

I can see now how placing the external VF directly over the RF makes it quicker to move your eye between the two. Good idea, maybe we need a more elegant version to sell.

 

[Ko.Fe.]

I think you are referring to the Voigtlander double shoe adapter. Adorama and B&H have some knockoffs since the Voigtlander is no longer in production (but you can still find it on Ebay).

I have the 21mm Voigtlander metal viewfinder on the hot shoe and find that framing is accurate enough. I learned that everything that is within the white frame lines will be on the negative.

Could you, please, provide the link from bh or adorama.
I can"t find any similar to this overpriced one the picture.
Only for DSLRs, which are useless on RF cameras.

 

[umcelinho]

I have the Thumbs Up with the hot shoe (CSEP-10S) which is great for the OVF. You might see about epoxying your taped on hotshoe to the Thumbs Up. JB Weld or something similar would likely take care of it.

Shawn

I'll likely glue the shoe to the gaffer tape to make it more stable and look cleaner. as it is it gives a tiny bid of play if you fiddle with it. I prefer to not do anything permanent for now, because the idea is to go for an M10 in 2019 so a future owner might not see these "features" as such.

 

[jkcampbell]

How about flipping the viewfinder upside down and taping it directly to the camera? Eliminate the cold shoe all together, that gets it closer to the camera's viewfinder too. Cheers, jc

 

[umcelinho]

Good point. It would probably be just a tad quicker to frame but then placing the finder on the camera and removing it would be a bit more troublesome, I guess. The way it is done now it's just a matter of sliding it in position and I'm good to go.

How about flipping the viewfinder upside down and taping it directly to the camera? Eliminate the cold shoe all together, that gets it closer to the camera's viewfinder too. Cheers, jc

 

[narsuitus]

Wondering if anyone here could share their experiences and/or thoughts regarding that kind of solution vs just having the external viewfinder being used centered with the lens.

To aid in composition when I shoot with my 21mm f/2.8 Zeiss lens on my Contax G1 rangefinder, I use an optical Contax 21mm viewfinder.

I also use the Contax 21mm viewfinder on my Leica rangefinders when I shoot with my 21mm f/1.4 Leitz lens.

Accurate framing has never been a problem for me. A bigger problem for me has been forgetting to pack the viewfinder when I pack the 21mm lenses or not having the time to mount the viewfinder on the camera before taking a shot. Many times I have been forced to guess at how the image will look at the 21mm focal length verses the 28mm focal length image that I see through the camera's optical viewfinder.


Rangefinders by Narsuitus, on Flickr