Using Zorki 6 with foreign lenses?

[hoot]

Hi,

can the following lenses be used on a Zorki 6 body with the coupled rangefinder?

* 50mm f/2 Jupiter-8
* 35mm f/2.8 Jupiter-12
* 21mm f/2 Kobalux (Avenon)

(Yes, I realize the two wide lenses will need external finders for framing.)

Regarding the Jupiters, the reason I don't want to get a Kiev 4 is that annoying film advance knob (instead of a lever). Someone handy with mechanics should devise a film advance lever for the Kiev 4-series... but I digress.

On a different note, can the Jupiters be used on a Leica M3 body (with the appropriate screw-mount-to-M-mount adapter)?

Thanks!

 

[Nickfed]

Yes for both the Jupiters.
If the Kobalux has Leica 39mm screw thread, yes for that too.

While Leica M lenses can go on the Zorki, Leica screw lenses cannot go on your M3, so no to that. This is due to the mount-to-film distance.

 

[kiev4a]

Not all non Soviet LTM lenses will focus properly--might even danage the camera. The FSU camers use a solid probe to ride on the collar or the lens that moves in and out when you focus. Some ltm lenses have a probe on the bac of the lens that is supposed to interface with a Leica-type roller on the end of the RF probe. Those lenses won't work on a FED or Zorki,

 

[Laika]

While Leica M lenses can go on the Zorki, Leica screw lenses cannot go on your M3, so no to that. This is due to the mount-to-film distance.

I think you have that back to front?

Leica M lenses are bayonet mount therefore can not be fitted to any Zorki because they use a copy of the older Leica thread mount (LTM)

Leica screw lenses can be used on a Leica M body with a converter made by Leica, Voigtlander etc, The Soviet LTM lenses can be mounted on a M mount camera with the adaptor but the focus may or may not be off depending on the lens etc.

Just a word of warning, the Jupiter 12 has a large rear element that can damage certain cameras (non Soviet) and/or the lens itself when trying to mount it. This lens was made for both the Kiev/Contax mount and the Soviet/LTM mount, make sure you know which one it is when buying.

 

[hoot]

Thanks!

Laika - so if I used the Jupiter 12 on a Leica M3 with the appropriate adapter, do you forsee any troubles due to the lens's large rear element?

One more question - can the new Cosina-Voigtländer lens array in Leica screw-mount be used without problems on a Russian screw-mount body? Can they, too, be used on the Leica M3 (with adapter)?

I'm currently in the unique position of having sold most of my cameras and being able to build up a 35mm rangefinder system from scratch; the only considerations being cost and usability. It looks as though getting screw-mount lenses is the best bet, because they can be used on a wide array of screw-mount *and* M-mount cameras, yes?

 

[Nickfed]

I think you have that back to front?

Leica M lenses are bayonet mount therefore can not be fitted to any Zorki because they use a copy of the older Leica thread mount (LTM)

Leica screw lenses can be used on a Leica M body with a.

Yes. Thread on M, not M on thread.

And there are a heap of warnings around about the Jupiter-12 fouling the TTL sensor on the Voigtlander Bessa. I guess this would apply to any late Leica body if they had TTL sensor too. Since the J-12 is such an obvious choice for a 35mm, this is one reason why I passed up a Bessa.

 

[Laika]

...so if I used the Jupiter 12 on a Leica M3 with the appropriate adapter, do you forsee any troubles due to the lens's large rear element?

I don't know of any problem with a M3 as it has no built in meter. I have heard the large rear element of the J12 will block the light meter of the later M bodies and may even damage the meter on the M5 and CL because of there moving meter arm. The J12 is also a no go on the Voigtlander bessa bodies because element hits the shutter box before it mounts all the way, the bessa doesn't use a Leica style shutter.

One more question - can the new Cosina-Voigtländer lens array in Leica screw-mount be used without problems on a Russian screw-mount body?

Yes, I started out using my Voigtlander 15mm lens on my FED3a with out any problem. I have a photo of a red Chevy in my gallery taken with this combo.

Can they, too, be used on the Leica M3 (with adapter)?

Yes, Voigtlander makes LTM to M converters. They even come three types (28/90, 35/135, or 50/75) that activate the M cameras viewfinder framelines.

http://www.cameraquest.com/adaptltm.htm

I'm currently in the unique position of having sold most of my cameras and being able to build up a 35mm rangefinder system from scratch; the only considerations being cost and usability. It looks as though getting screw-mount lenses is the best bet, because they can be used on a wide array of screw-mount *and* M-mount cameras, yes?

Sounds to me you have it worked out right 🙂 You say you have a M3 so a couple of nice Voigtlander screw lenses and adaptors would give you a superb kit. The ability to be able use many of the Soviet lenses via the adaptors on your M3 is a bonus and you can use the Voigtlander screw lenses (minus adaptors) on any Soviet RF bodies you may buy.

Make sure you look over the Voigtlander range of lenses 😎

http://www.cameraquest.com/voigtlen.htm

 

[Peter Klein]

I have tried to use several Russian lenses on Leica Ms (with adapters). They all focused incorrectly. Either they were OK at infinity, but wrong close up. Or vice versa. I agree with Dante Stella's assessment, and my results matched those of the person who wrote to him with lots of technical details. See:

http://www.dantestella.com/technical/compat.html

Particularly section 3, "Ivan the Incompatible."

All that said, if you only photograph in good light, depth of field may cover up the focusing errors. You may not notice a problem with the slower lenses. The ones that are notorious for being "soft" are the Jupiter-3 (50/1.5) and Jupiter-9 (85/2).

This is a controversial subject. Some people swear by Russian lenses on Leicas. More people swear *at* them. All I know is that my Russian lenses focus correctly on my Zorki 4, and incorrectly on my Leica Ms. My C/V lenses with LTM adapter focus correctly on my Leicas, but not on my Zorki.

Hope this is useful,
--Peter

 

[hoot]

Thank you very much, Laika and Peter. Those are helpful tips.

I never planned on getting an M3, but there was an unbelievably cheap one on the auction site, so I grabbed it. It hasn't arrived yet.

Getting C/V LTM lenses and an LTM-M adapter for the M3 would probably be the best idea, except that even if I only get three of the cheaper lenses and the adapter, I run close to a thousand dollars. This is way beyond my budget.

I suspected there may be alignment issues when using Soviet lenses on non-Soviet rangefinders (and vice versa) (that iron curtain was pretty tight), so when I ordered my LTM Jupiter lenses yesterday, I also ordered a Zorki 6 body to accompany them.

Now, I have handled a Zorki 6 body at Roman's apartment and though it felt great, it had some issues I disliked (mainly the crappy viewfinder and the rotating shutter wheel, which I kept inadvertedly blocking with my finger). (Kievs have a better shutter wheel, but no film advance lever, which I find is indispensible for fast street photography.)

If I nevertheless manage to make friends with the Zorki, I could just sell the M3 for a small profit and be happy and free of GAS for the rest of my life (don't I wish!). On the other hand, if I end up yelling "Suka!" at the Zorki, it looks as though Mr. Gandy will be getting way too much of my hard-earned cash.

Gawd, I knew I should have stuck with that SLR...

 

[Peter Klein]

If you already own an M3, you will probably find that you like it too much to sell it. Or you will regret it later if you do sell it. The M3 is ideal for a 50mm lens. It also has nice frame lines that move to compensate for parallax as you focus closer. The Zorki has just a plain viewfinder, no parallax compensation. It takes some getting used to before you know what the actual picture is. You will need an external viewfinder for a 35mm lens on the M3, as its viewfinder has frame lines for 50, 90 and 135 only.

My advice would be to pick up a used V/C 50mm Nokton and 50mm LTM-to-M-mount adapter for the M3. The Noktons are available for about $260 U.S. used. Use the Nokton on the M3 for low-light shooting and other times when fast shooting is needed. Use the Zorki for wide-angle and when you want a light outfit with one body and two or three lenses.

And there's no harm in trying the Russian lenses on the M3. You could pick up a 50mm adapter, and run some focus tests with the 50 and 35mm Russian lenses. If they work well enough for you, why not use them?

All that said, there is nothing like a Leica 50mm Summicron on an M camera. Pretty much any version is good. But even used, they will set you back $350 for an ugly old one to about $400-600 for a recent one with good glass.

Other good non-Leica LTM lenses in LTM are the 50/1.4 and 50/2 Nikkors, and the 50/1.8 Canon. You might find a bargain in the f/1.8 or f/2 models. One of the less collectible Leica lenses might work for you, like the 50/2 Summitar or 50/3.5 Elmar. And there's always the V/C 50/2.5. Very compact lens. Some people like it because it has a smooth look, others don't because they say it is not razor sharp.

--Peter

 

[hoot]

Well, thanks a lot, Peter. There goes my resolution to fight the GAS. 😛

Yeah, I've been lusting for that V/C 50/2.5 actually. It sounds perfect. 'Course, then I'd find myself wanting to get the matching 21/4 Color Skopar and 35/2.5 Color Skopar "C". All three share the same nice compact look and 39mm filter thread.

Somebody shoot me! :bang: