Scheelings
Well-known
[FONT=tahoma,sans-serif]I wasn't really sure where to actually post this...so any moderators out there, feel free to move it.
I've been asked by a good friend of mine if I would be his wedding photographer - he'd like to keep his costs down and maybe he thinks my photography is OK. I'm not a professional - just an amateur and I've never shot a wedding before.
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[FONT=tahoma,sans-serif]There are some limitations - I only have an x100 as a backup camera, with my main camera being an M9 with a range of lenses (25, 28, 35 and 50mm lenses).
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[FONT=tahoma,sans-serif]I'd appreciate advice from everyone here in what I should do to prepare. I've got 6 months.
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I've been asked by a good friend of mine if I would be his wedding photographer - he'd like to keep his costs down and maybe he thinks my photography is OK. I'm not a professional - just an amateur and I've never shot a wedding before.
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[FONT=tahoma,sans-serif]There are some limitations - I only have an x100 as a backup camera, with my main camera being an M9 with a range of lenses (25, 28, 35 and 50mm lenses).
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[FONT=tahoma,sans-serif]I'd appreciate advice from everyone here in what I should do to prepare. I've got 6 months.
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Addy101
Well-known
Sit down with them and discuss what you can and can't do. Make sure you know what the venue or venues are like. What do they want from you: just documenting the day or do they want more? If they want more, make sure you make clear what you can deliver and what you can't and what you're gonna attempt. Make clear that you're an amateur and confirm anything by email (just in case.....). As Tom said, you're allowed to be present at places/moments other people aren't 
I did three weddings for friends. I used a big DSLR with 24/28-70/2.8 lens as my main lens in somewhat small venues - but I'm sure I could do it with primes. If the venue is small, your lenses will be more then okay - too bad the X100 is 35mm as probably a 28(25?)-50mm combination would be ideal. If you're okay with 50mm, it is a fast 50mm and you have room to move, use that 50mm - if you're a 35mm guy, just put that 35mm on your M9 - same goes for 28mm. Bring that 25mm for a few general pictures that can take in everybody that is present.
Before the first wedding I did, I trained portraiture with a friend before the event. I also read up on wedding photography and looked at a lot of pictures just to get a feeling for it. The only problem is a lot of photographers only show pictures of beautiful twenty-somethings - those are useless for inspiration for weddings of older and/or heavier couples.... Those are around, just a little bit harder to find.
If you're unsure, tell the couple you won't do it as their main photographer. It is a huge responsibility and hard work. I liked all three times, but I can easily image somebody who doesn't like it.
Most importantly: make sure you have fun!
I did three weddings for friends. I used a big DSLR with 24/28-70/2.8 lens as my main lens in somewhat small venues - but I'm sure I could do it with primes. If the venue is small, your lenses will be more then okay - too bad the X100 is 35mm as probably a 28(25?)-50mm combination would be ideal. If you're okay with 50mm, it is a fast 50mm and you have room to move, use that 50mm - if you're a 35mm guy, just put that 35mm on your M9 - same goes for 28mm. Bring that 25mm for a few general pictures that can take in everybody that is present.
Before the first wedding I did, I trained portraiture with a friend before the event. I also read up on wedding photography and looked at a lot of pictures just to get a feeling for it. The only problem is a lot of photographers only show pictures of beautiful twenty-somethings - those are useless for inspiration for weddings of older and/or heavier couples.... Those are around, just a little bit harder to find.
If you're unsure, tell the couple you won't do it as their main photographer. It is a huge responsibility and hard work. I liked all three times, but I can easily image somebody who doesn't like it.
Most importantly: make sure you have fun!
Keith
The best camera is one that still works!
Go to the sites of some known, successful wedding photographers and look at their portfolios.
YYV_146
Well-known
I do weddings for friends now and then. I think you'll be fine, but as others said above, be very clear about your abilities. Don't over-promise or allow them to assume so.
Unless you are supremely confident about your manual skills, I would get a decent AF camera for the really important moments. If your attention falters, even a bit during the vows or the important kiss...AF is perhaps safer for those moments.
There also won't be much time for changing lenses. A second M body on loan might be good. Or just pick a lens you're comfortable with and stick to it all day. I've covered an entire wedding with a 24/75 combo before - it was quite a nice experience.
benji77
@R.F.F
Some really good tips mentioned here, especially the comment about managing their expectations.
On the technical front, I'd recommend that the X100 be your main camera. This is due to the AF. Everything moves very fast, in terms of actions. You need a clear mind and be two steps ahead on what will happen. You would hv to switch cameras on the fly for this, so I recommend you hv your most comfortable focal length ready for wide (28mm + 85/50) for those nice portraits/group shot moments.
I would use the m9 for the times you have time to plan/wait for the shot moments.
Please ask for the timetable and keep a small printed copy in your pocket.
On the technical front, I'd recommend that the X100 be your main camera. This is due to the AF. Everything moves very fast, in terms of actions. You need a clear mind and be two steps ahead on what will happen. You would hv to switch cameras on the fly for this, so I recommend you hv your most comfortable focal length ready for wide (28mm + 85/50) for those nice portraits/group shot moments.
I would use the m9 for the times you have time to plan/wait for the shot moments.
Please ask for the timetable and keep a small printed copy in your pocket.
Richard G
Veteran
Look at the wedding forum on photo.net. It will send chills down your spine and make you want to get out of this commitment ASAP. But, seriously, it will focus you on just how exacting this task is. I did one wedding with two film Leicas and two lenses. I was about 30 at the time. I still can't believe I did that. I am not sure my friends were so happy with the result but they didn't complain. Cheap is cheap.
Scout the location ahead of time, same time of day. Decide on what ISO you are willing to go up to. Experiment. ISO 640 offers flexibility. I have shot at ISO 2500 in poor light and got one passable shot. High ISO with the M9 works in good light, when you don't need high ISO.
Make a decision on whether you will use flash at all. Depending on the time of year and location even outdoor shots are better with flash support, especially in bright sunlight with heavy shadows on faces. Aweful. Maybe you're like me and you've hardly ever used flash. Tell one of the pro wedding photographers you won't have a flash in your bag and they won't look at you more than a second longer.
The X100 is a good back up in a way. There are pros who have said they could shoot whole weddings with just a 35 f1.4. Your X100 is close. RE-READ the manual. Use the camera the day before. It's a complicated little camera. Don't let anyone else touch it. Every now and then my X100 is in some crazy mode with the review function only showing images in the EVF. I get out of that, but I could never tell you later how I do it. The X100's slow sync flash fill in function is really good I think.
The M9. Have a spare formatted card, formatted in the M9, in your shirt pocket at all times. Any funny business from the camera, swap that in as soon as you can. Just the other night my Monochrom told me 'SD card full'. It couldn't have been. I turned off the camera and turned it on and there were only 9 images on the card, of course. How much fun would it be to have that happen when the groom kisses the bride? Haven't you got a film camera still? I'd seriously load one of those with 800 ISO film just in case.
I second the proposal above to borrow an autofocus camera. Haven't you secretly always wanted a second hand D700? There aren't too many pros or other professionals who'd trust one M9 as the main camera for a wedding. And I love the M9.
Scout the location ahead of time, same time of day. Decide on what ISO you are willing to go up to. Experiment. ISO 640 offers flexibility. I have shot at ISO 2500 in poor light and got one passable shot. High ISO with the M9 works in good light, when you don't need high ISO.
Make a decision on whether you will use flash at all. Depending on the time of year and location even outdoor shots are better with flash support, especially in bright sunlight with heavy shadows on faces. Aweful. Maybe you're like me and you've hardly ever used flash. Tell one of the pro wedding photographers you won't have a flash in your bag and they won't look at you more than a second longer.
The X100 is a good back up in a way. There are pros who have said they could shoot whole weddings with just a 35 f1.4. Your X100 is close. RE-READ the manual. Use the camera the day before. It's a complicated little camera. Don't let anyone else touch it. Every now and then my X100 is in some crazy mode with the review function only showing images in the EVF. I get out of that, but I could never tell you later how I do it. The X100's slow sync flash fill in function is really good I think.
The M9. Have a spare formatted card, formatted in the M9, in your shirt pocket at all times. Any funny business from the camera, swap that in as soon as you can. Just the other night my Monochrom told me 'SD card full'. It couldn't have been. I turned off the camera and turned it on and there were only 9 images on the card, of course. How much fun would it be to have that happen when the groom kisses the bride? Haven't you got a film camera still? I'd seriously load one of those with 800 ISO film just in case.
I second the proposal above to borrow an autofocus camera. Haven't you secretly always wanted a second hand D700? There aren't too many pros or other professionals who'd trust one M9 as the main camera for a wedding. And I love the M9.
YYV_146
Well-known
Just adding a bit...
Fortunately these days you can get away with playing a bit loose on the ISO front. I normally just float ISO levels with a hard ceiling at 4000 or 6400. For the important scenes, I try to keep it below 1600.
A flash is virtually mandatory these days, especially if it's not during the day or during bright daylight outdoors. For indoors just get an auto flash (for the X100) and bounce away - the X100 is fortunately very good with flashes and can sync at virtually any speed the shutter can handle. For outdoors the situation is a bit tricky. A larger diffuser, or maybe ground bounce might work.
It is a demanding task, but to some people it could feel very rewarding. There are worse assignments to go on in the world (far worse, recalling someone here mentioning mortar fire). I personally see it as a good challenge, but I'm not above politely asking to be beside a professional wedding photographer or shooting in pairs. Having two people do the job makes thing a whole lot less stressful.
P.S. I would not trust the X100 AF. In fact, I'm not sure I'd trust the AF of most, if not all mirrorless cameras for a wedding. Those are moments when you long for a D4 in your hand...The safest option would be to loan a good, reliable DSLR kit, then spend a day or two learning how to use it.
OurManInTangier
An Undesirable
Professional wedding photographers will need to both give and be given a clear idea of expectations so this won't be any different for you, more so really.
A long lens is always a benefit, a long zoom better still for the versatility. If you can I suggest you pop along and have a look around the venue(s) so you have an idea of light, backdrops, angles, potential problems etc - even a Google Street view would be better than nothing at all.
Keith makes a very good point, checking out various wedding photographers sites for ideas, tips and tricks etc but remain confident in your own ability, they must have chosen you for a reason and so long as you do have a frank and open discussion you should all have a good understanding of what to expect.
Have they asked you for any particular style or type of imagery e.g. a reportage approach, big groups of family and some intimate portraits of the couple...I'd suggest this should affect what kit plays a greater or lesser part. AF is hugely useful but is dependent on your focusing abilities, flash can be a lifesaver on a contrasty day for fill-flash portraits or a small reflector. There's an awful lot to think about generally but ALL of these questions can be answered by having that discussion as soon as you can.
Most important, enjoy it...it will show in your pictures.
Good luck.
A long lens is always a benefit, a long zoom better still for the versatility. If you can I suggest you pop along and have a look around the venue(s) so you have an idea of light, backdrops, angles, potential problems etc - even a Google Street view would be better than nothing at all.
Keith makes a very good point, checking out various wedding photographers sites for ideas, tips and tricks etc but remain confident in your own ability, they must have chosen you for a reason and so long as you do have a frank and open discussion you should all have a good understanding of what to expect.
Have they asked you for any particular style or type of imagery e.g. a reportage approach, big groups of family and some intimate portraits of the couple...I'd suggest this should affect what kit plays a greater or lesser part. AF is hugely useful but is dependent on your focusing abilities, flash can be a lifesaver on a contrasty day for fill-flash portraits or a small reflector. There's an awful lot to think about generally but ALL of these questions can be answered by having that discussion as soon as you can.
Most important, enjoy it...it will show in your pictures.
Good luck.
OurManInTangier
An Undesirable
^^^
Two new answers before I hit POST, ignore as necessary
Two new answers before I hit POST, ignore as necessary
ruby.monkey
Veteran
Talk with the bride-to-be before you agree to anything. Make damned sure she's OK with this, since most likely she'll be the one most affected if things go tits-up.
Try to do it over a drink or two and with the groom absent, so you can get an honest opinion from her.
Try to do it over a drink or two and with the groom absent, so you can get an honest opinion from her.
lynnb
Veteran
1. everything already mentioned above
2. with the bride and whoever's paying you, draw up a check list of all the shots they want, with names of the people to be included in each of the important people shots.
3. arrange for someone (preferably chief bridesmaid or best man) to be your nominated go-to person to help you sort out any difficult situations that arise on the day. Meet this person and ensure they understand their role and commit to help you if needed. Useful for rounding up people for group shots or dealing with difficult/drunk guests etc.
4. Do a test shoot with the bride and groom at the venue at the same time (in terms of where the sun will be). Do this well in advance.
- This lets you preplan your shooting strategy/access/shooting positions and angles
- gets bride and groom used to working with you
- allows officials/celebrant to meet you and clarify any shooting rules during the ceremony and at the venue
- allows you to experiment with poses
- allows you to estimate time needed for important shots
- allows you to check your workflow procedures, swapping memory cards etc
- allows you to trial your post processing workflow
6. Backup, backup, backup. You must have a backup strategy for everything, including equipment failure whether by accident, misuse or theft. I had a main shooting lens stop working, dead, at the moment a bride was about to walk down the aisle. I grabbed my backup camera and kept shooting. The backup had similar control layout (Canon) so there was no confusion, just a moment of ***!!!*@#!!
7. Fill flash is highly desirable for shadow control and skin colour temperature standardisation; use a diffuser if possible to soften the flash e.g. Sto-Fen, Fong, whatever.
8. Have enough fully charged spare batteries and empty memory cards available to shoot the entire event. Relying on copying memory cards to a laptop or storage device to re-use them is an invitation to over-write existing shots that were accidentally not backed up.
2. with the bride and whoever's paying you, draw up a check list of all the shots they want, with names of the people to be included in each of the important people shots.
3. arrange for someone (preferably chief bridesmaid or best man) to be your nominated go-to person to help you sort out any difficult situations that arise on the day. Meet this person and ensure they understand their role and commit to help you if needed. Useful for rounding up people for group shots or dealing with difficult/drunk guests etc.
4. Do a test shoot with the bride and groom at the venue at the same time (in terms of where the sun will be). Do this well in advance.
- This lets you preplan your shooting strategy/access/shooting positions and angles
- gets bride and groom used to working with you
- allows officials/celebrant to meet you and clarify any shooting rules during the ceremony and at the venue
- allows you to experiment with poses
- allows you to estimate time needed for important shots
- allows you to check your workflow procedures, swapping memory cards etc
- allows you to trial your post processing workflow
6. Backup, backup, backup. You must have a backup strategy for everything, including equipment failure whether by accident, misuse or theft. I had a main shooting lens stop working, dead, at the moment a bride was about to walk down the aisle. I grabbed my backup camera and kept shooting. The backup had similar control layout (Canon) so there was no confusion, just a moment of ***!!!*@#!!
7. Fill flash is highly desirable for shadow control and skin colour temperature standardisation; use a diffuser if possible to soften the flash e.g. Sto-Fen, Fong, whatever.
8. Have enough fully charged spare batteries and empty memory cards available to shoot the entire event. Relying on copying memory cards to a laptop or storage device to re-use them is an invitation to over-write existing shots that were accidentally not backed up.
Addy101
Well-known
Reading these newer posts, some remarks:
It is important to know your camera for a wedding - more important then AF.
AF is nice, I used my Sony A900 with pro lenses.
I decided mirrorless' AF isn't good enough for the difficult stuff - I considered changing my NEX F3 with an A6000 but was told by several people the point-to-point AF hasn't improved as much as the continious focus. I wouldn't rely on the AF of the X100. For less critial work in good light, a mirrorless is good enough.
You know the couple, you know whether she is okay with you - but talk to them both!
For some inspiration, some galleries:
Sony A900 with mainly Minolta 28-70/2.8G and Minolta 70-210/4
Sony A900 with Minolta 28-70/2.8G and Sony NEX F3 with Sigma 19/2.8
Sony A900 with Sony/Zeiss 24-70/2.8
I used flash with all for the ceremony.
It is important to know your camera for a wedding - more important then AF.
AF is nice, I used my Sony A900 with pro lenses.
I decided mirrorless' AF isn't good enough for the difficult stuff - I considered changing my NEX F3 with an A6000 but was told by several people the point-to-point AF hasn't improved as much as the continious focus. I wouldn't rely on the AF of the X100. For less critial work in good light, a mirrorless is good enough.
You know the couple, you know whether she is okay with you - but talk to them both!
For some inspiration, some galleries:
Sony A900 with mainly Minolta 28-70/2.8G and Minolta 70-210/4
Sony A900 with Minolta 28-70/2.8G and Sony NEX F3 with Sigma 19/2.8
Sony A900 with Sony/Zeiss 24-70/2.8
I used flash with all for the ceremony.
lynnb
Veteran
9 Shoot pictures in which format? RAW, RAW+jpg?
NB: DO NOT SHOOT JPG ONLY. REPEAT. DO NOT SHOOT JPG ONLY. Only RAW allows full capture of maximum image data. You may need that if there is any need for significant post processing corrections.
10. What product will you give them - decide amongst:
a: contents of your memory cards
b: edited contents of your memory cards, after discarding duds
c: edited, post processed files in lossless TIFF format
d: edited, post processed files in JPG format
Your success will be judged on what you give them. For that reason, I recommend c and/or d.
Explain to them clearly what you will be giving them.
11. Doing this on your own first time is risky, ensure they understand that. You cannot guarantee success, although you will make every effort. Put that in writing, as well as your recommendation they hire a professional if they want guaranteed results, and get a written acknowledgment from your client, legally speaking.
12. If possible, minimise the risks during the shooting period by having an assistant with you to make sure the check list is fully covered, who can also help arrange people, ensure hands, feet and posture are synchronised during group shots, that the flowers are held in the most flattering way, that background details like bystanders, telegraph poles and signs are considered while shooting. You will be extraordinarily busy.
13. As you have not done this before, better to take too many than too few photos. Have way more than enough memory cards and charged batteries.
14. Take a power board and chargers for your cameras, an extension lead, and a torch. Make sure the reception venue can have a place for you to plug in, away from people and kids.
15. Keep exposed memory cards in a safe location on you or your assistant, in a clearly labelled container/wallet. You cannot afford to lose them or have them stolen. Back them up as soon as possible to two separate hard drives. Lightroom will copy and back up to a separate hard drive in one step.
16. Despite the pressure, it can be very rewarding. SMILE A LOT. BE FRIENDLY AND CONFIDENT. The quality of the pictures you get will depend a lot on this. People will relax and smile back at you and they will be more cooperative, so you will get better pictures.
17. As mentioned by others, know your camera/s backwards. Test them the day before. Bring the camera manuals with you. That might sound superfluous, until you get some obscure error message and the camera freezes, as happened to me when the lens failed.
NB: DO NOT SHOOT JPG ONLY. REPEAT. DO NOT SHOOT JPG ONLY. Only RAW allows full capture of maximum image data. You may need that if there is any need for significant post processing corrections.
10. What product will you give them - decide amongst:
a: contents of your memory cards
b: edited contents of your memory cards, after discarding duds
c: edited, post processed files in lossless TIFF format
d: edited, post processed files in JPG format
Your success will be judged on what you give them. For that reason, I recommend c and/or d.
Explain to them clearly what you will be giving them.
11. Doing this on your own first time is risky, ensure they understand that. You cannot guarantee success, although you will make every effort. Put that in writing, as well as your recommendation they hire a professional if they want guaranteed results, and get a written acknowledgment from your client, legally speaking.
12. If possible, minimise the risks during the shooting period by having an assistant with you to make sure the check list is fully covered, who can also help arrange people, ensure hands, feet and posture are synchronised during group shots, that the flowers are held in the most flattering way, that background details like bystanders, telegraph poles and signs are considered while shooting. You will be extraordinarily busy.
13. As you have not done this before, better to take too many than too few photos. Have way more than enough memory cards and charged batteries.
14. Take a power board and chargers for your cameras, an extension lead, and a torch. Make sure the reception venue can have a place for you to plug in, away from people and kids.
15. Keep exposed memory cards in a safe location on you or your assistant, in a clearly labelled container/wallet. You cannot afford to lose them or have them stolen. Back them up as soon as possible to two separate hard drives. Lightroom will copy and back up to a separate hard drive in one step.
16. Despite the pressure, it can be very rewarding. SMILE A LOT. BE FRIENDLY AND CONFIDENT. The quality of the pictures you get will depend a lot on this. People will relax and smile back at you and they will be more cooperative, so you will get better pictures.
17. As mentioned by others, know your camera/s backwards. Test them the day before. Bring the camera manuals with you. That might sound superfluous, until you get some obscure error message and the camera freezes, as happened to me when the lens failed.
lynnb
Veteran
As you've got 6 months, why not watch a few weddings at the same venue in the intervening time, observing how the pros do it? Most weddings are public ceremonies, so it shouldn't be a problem.
When I have shot weddings, I've always done engagement shoots and/or trial runs with the couples for reasons outlined above. It makes the actual day much easier all round.
Good planning is always better than good luck..
When I have shot weddings, I've always done engagement shoots and/or trial runs with the couples for reasons outlined above. It makes the actual day much easier all round.
Good planning is always better than good luck..
leicapixie
Well-known
I seldom shot a wedding, cold.
I met the Bride to be and her man and did a shoot.
Engagement, Love story whatever..
Show the images, make prints.
Meet the families and do a few photos.
Show the results.Get the Bride and Her mother to understand you are not a pro, have never shot a wedding..
If they are happy, do it..
Use a simple auto camera.
I met the Bride to be and her man and did a shoot.
Engagement, Love story whatever..
Show the images, make prints.
Meet the families and do a few photos.
Show the results.Get the Bride and Her mother to understand you are not a pro, have never shot a wedding..
If they are happy, do it..
Use a simple auto camera.
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Keith
The best camera is one that still works!
Vicki Lamburn who was a member here at some stage I think has made a career recently shooting weddings. I like her approach and she is very open with advice. Some of her shots aren't my style but over all I like her work.
MCTuomey
Veteran
Vicki Lamburn who was a member here at some stage I think has made a career recently shooting weddings. I like her approach and she is very open with advice. Some of her shots aren't my style but over all I like her work.
+1 Vicki's work speaks for itself. The OP might consider following at least some of her style and planning concepts.
bobbyrab
Well-known
I've shot about 400 weddings over the last 14 years www.robertlawler.co.uk , and I have many many things I could advise you, but no one can absorb the amount of advise you've been given so far, especially as some is conflicting and some just a little OTT in my opinion.
The best advice I can give really is do what you do now, I found your flickr page and your style seems quite natural, so don't try and stray too far from what you do naturally. Keep it simple including poses, minimise flash as it's ugly and intrusive unless you know how to use it well. Very important, make sure to get photos of the couple on their own [you wouldn't believe photographers would miss this but they do], ideally away from everyone else so they relax and don't look awkward. Get all the important family covered.
I always visit the venue on the morning of the wedding, that way you have a good idea of what the weather holds and what the light might be like, this is especially important for group shots which can be difficult if the light is strong, or the caterer has set up the bar where you thought was a good spot on your visit two weeks previously.
Finally and importantly, it's a wedding, make sure they flatter.
The best advice I can give really is do what you do now, I found your flickr page and your style seems quite natural, so don't try and stray too far from what you do naturally. Keep it simple including poses, minimise flash as it's ugly and intrusive unless you know how to use it well. Very important, make sure to get photos of the couple on their own [you wouldn't believe photographers would miss this but they do], ideally away from everyone else so they relax and don't look awkward. Get all the important family covered.
I always visit the venue on the morning of the wedding, that way you have a good idea of what the weather holds and what the light might be like, this is especially important for group shots which can be difficult if the light is strong, or the caterer has set up the bar where you thought was a good spot on your visit two weeks previously.
Finally and importantly, it's a wedding, make sure they flatter.
MCTuomey
Veteran
what excellent professional advice, bobbyrab ... (for the avoidance of doubt i mean this with all sincerity)
Luke_Miller
Established
When photographing the ceremony I find the biggest challenge is being at the right place at the right time. If there will be a rehearsal I make a point to shoot it like it was the actual ceremony. That way I know where to stand in order to best capture the various elements of the service. Nothing worse in my opinion than being caught out of position or in the middle of a lens change when a significant event occurs.