picker77
Established
Here's a pictorial diagram of the Leica M2/M3 shutter release mechanism. Put a big wide release button on top and press on just the edge instead of the center of it. Depending on how tightly the release button shaft fits in the hole in the camera's top plate (after 50 years or so of use), picture what happens to the release rod every time that off-center load is placed on it. Now repeat hundreds or even thousands of times.
Seems reasonable to me that it could eventually at the least cause unusual wear where the release shaft passes through the camera's top plate, or other problems like a sticky release or bent release rod. If people always pressed the soft release with evenly distributed vertical pressure there could be no problem. If not, then... So I suppose a lot depends on how you routinely use that button. Tom A's recommended method seems to be sensible to me, but how many of us follow that?
Problems, or lack thereof, are also greatly dependent on the design of the shutter release mechanism of the camera involved. Presumably for many cameras there would never be a problem, but I can certainly see how there COULD be a problem with Leica M cameras if the button is mis-used or abused. Size would matter, too. I've seen some from Hong Kong that are bigger than the starter button on my John Deere tractor.
Seems reasonable to me that it could eventually at the least cause unusual wear where the release shaft passes through the camera's top plate, or other problems like a sticky release or bent release rod. If people always pressed the soft release with evenly distributed vertical pressure there could be no problem. If not, then... So I suppose a lot depends on how you routinely use that button. Tom A's recommended method seems to be sensible to me, but how many of us follow that?
Problems, or lack thereof, are also greatly dependent on the design of the shutter release mechanism of the camera involved. Presumably for many cameras there would never be a problem, but I can certainly see how there COULD be a problem with Leica M cameras if the button is mis-used or abused. Size would matter, too. I've seen some from Hong Kong that are bigger than the starter button on my John Deere tractor.
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Justin Smith
Established
I think Al is just referring to accidental exposures taken by bumping the soft release (burning film).
Al Kaplan
Veteran
Yes, when I tried soft release a few times over the years my elbow took lots of pictures, and carrying more that one camera hanging from my neck set the release off too. On digital that wouldn't waste money photographing the underside of your arm or the back of another camera.
Tom A
RFF Sponsor
Interesting - I have been using Softreleases on my cameras for at least 12-13 years. Every camera I own have one on it - except when Tuulikki raids them for colors when she is out of stock!! I have never had a problem with any of the cameras due to the Softie.
If your release shaft would be affected - it would mean that it had a problem anyway - as the very low pressure you put on a release would not be strong enough to bend or damage it!
The Softie also spreads the pressure - you dont have to "push" on the small button. The "tangential" release action (touching the edge to shoot) is a benefit to fast firing (and accidental shots too).
The only case where I know a Softie can cause damage happened when someone put a M7 with the locking collar in a suitcase and pushed the lid hard enough to force the release down and "locking" the lock until it could be disassembled and released!
Leica used to make a release that would stand proud about 1/2 inch - this was to clear finders and MR meters. This one could twist the shaft if it was hit on the side - but it took a lot of force to do so.
As for keeping a meter on "all the time" - not really a case as the weight of one of my softies is only 1.7 grams and that is not enough to engage a meter circuit. I tried some softies in brass and they were heavy enough to have the meter flicker on and off.
The biggest problem with some of the small softies that are around (usually with either a brandname or a store stenciled on the top) is that they are made from very soft aluminium and "pressed" threads. These can break off in the cable release thread and are difficult to remove. Mine are made from high strength alloy and wont do that.
As with everything camera related - some people like it some don't. Remember that initially I made the Softie for my own use - the reason for it being a stock product was mainly that CNC machines are geared to run off a lot of pieces once they are started. I really only wanted 20-25 of them - but the machine likes running them in batches of 1000 - so I figured out I might as well sell them to those who want and need them!
If your release shaft would be affected - it would mean that it had a problem anyway - as the very low pressure you put on a release would not be strong enough to bend or damage it!
The Softie also spreads the pressure - you dont have to "push" on the small button. The "tangential" release action (touching the edge to shoot) is a benefit to fast firing (and accidental shots too).
The only case where I know a Softie can cause damage happened when someone put a M7 with the locking collar in a suitcase and pushed the lid hard enough to force the release down and "locking" the lock until it could be disassembled and released!
Leica used to make a release that would stand proud about 1/2 inch - this was to clear finders and MR meters. This one could twist the shaft if it was hit on the side - but it took a lot of force to do so.
As for keeping a meter on "all the time" - not really a case as the weight of one of my softies is only 1.7 grams and that is not enough to engage a meter circuit. I tried some softies in brass and they were heavy enough to have the meter flicker on and off.
The biggest problem with some of the small softies that are around (usually with either a brandname or a store stenciled on the top) is that they are made from very soft aluminium and "pressed" threads. These can break off in the cable release thread and are difficult to remove. Mine are made from high strength alloy and wont do that.
As with everything camera related - some people like it some don't. Remember that initially I made the Softie for my own use - the reason for it being a stock product was mainly that CNC machines are geared to run off a lot of pieces once they are started. I really only wanted 20-25 of them - but the machine likes running them in batches of 1000 - so I figured out I might as well sell them to those who want and need them!
fbf
Well-known
Tom, I remember someone told me that the cheap softies could theoretically cause problem as the material is really soft and is prone to bend the shutter button.
I have the softies on every single cameras I own, even the two rolleiflex s . Never had any problems.
I have the softies on every single cameras I own, even the two rolleiflex s . Never had any problems.
Chuck Albertson
Well-known
Name three of them. Seriously, were they authorized reps of Leica Camera, or just independent repair people passing along a bit of lore they'd heard?
kshapero
South Florida Man
sepiareverb
genius and moron
I've been using Tom's releases for as long as I've had M's, and other than the occasional accidental shot I find them to "fix" the perfection missing from my M's.
And I should note that I've not yet lost one. Knock wood.
And I should note that I've not yet lost one. Knock wood.
ray*j*gun
Veteran
I have 2 and I honestly don't remember where they came from. I'm always snagging them or accidently firing them....you know I really hate them.....I think I'll sell them....lol.
picker77
Established
Well, I sure didn't meant to poor mouth softies in general, Tom. Especially yours, which are clearly better made than most, and also come in two sizes, which makes sense. Lots of folks have used them for years with zero problems, and if there were any kind of serious problem the red flags and smoke signals would have been all over the web long before now! This was the first I've ever heard that a paranoid shop would void a warranty over a softie. I can't imagine it was one of the big guns in the repair/CLA world, though.
The release on my old M2 is so butter-smooth and linear I can't imagine a softie would benefit me much on that camera. My ZI has a completely different release feel, a nice two-stage affair that I quickly grew to really like. I've spent a lot of time on rifle target ranges over the years, and this release feels much like a custom-tuned target rifle trigger. The "takeup" part of the motion is smooth and soft, and you can feel the exact place where it will fire with just an ounce or so more pressure. It makes (for me) an ideal release feel, and makes using the metering very easy, so I think Zeiss got that exactly right. Of course it's an electronic shutter camera and I'm not about to take it apart to see how they did it, but I suppose the key to all that is careful selection of springs and switches.
I have a favorite little Vitomatic II that I consider my mini-Leica because of it's amazing heft for it's size (feels like a small solid metal brick), beautifully precise all-metal build quality, nearly silent leaf shutter, and excellent Color-Skopar lens. But I have never liked the feel of the camera's shutter release, which is long, springy, and a little stiff. I've even considered taking it apart and replacing the factory spring with a softer one. That one is probably the ideal candidate for a softie, so maybe I'll try one on it.
The release on my old M2 is so butter-smooth and linear I can't imagine a softie would benefit me much on that camera. My ZI has a completely different release feel, a nice two-stage affair that I quickly grew to really like. I've spent a lot of time on rifle target ranges over the years, and this release feels much like a custom-tuned target rifle trigger. The "takeup" part of the motion is smooth and soft, and you can feel the exact place where it will fire with just an ounce or so more pressure. It makes (for me) an ideal release feel, and makes using the metering very easy, so I think Zeiss got that exactly right. Of course it's an electronic shutter camera and I'm not about to take it apart to see how they did it, but I suppose the key to all that is careful selection of springs and switches.
I have a favorite little Vitomatic II that I consider my mini-Leica because of it's amazing heft for it's size (feels like a small solid metal brick), beautifully precise all-metal build quality, nearly silent leaf shutter, and excellent Color-Skopar lens. But I have never liked the feel of the camera's shutter release, which is long, springy, and a little stiff. I've even considered taking it apart and replacing the factory spring with a softer one. That one is probably the ideal candidate for a softie, so maybe I'll try one on it.
chippy
foo was here
Chuck; i am disinclined to acquiesce to your request (impolite demand?). I have not asked the question with a purpose to produce any negative feedback to the CLA tech/s/company (many probably would consider 'big guns' and authorized btw). If a tech from a company that frequents this forum on occasion can give an informed comment then i leave it to them, if i get an answer myself to the reasons behind this curious position i will pass it along. after all if there is a reasonable reason i am sure we would at least like to know in what possible way it can cause a problem, though scores of people so far seem to indicate they have not encountered a problem ever. save perhaps stainless steel buttons cutting into chrome, soft aluminium buttons with the potential to break off, accidental firing (obvious but not a reason to void a warrantee). i appreciate maddoc's and picker's comments as well for there technical aspects, at least showing the other side of the coin and a possibility of problem, though it seems no one has actually come across the problem first hand, and as Tom mentions it may be possible there would have to be problem already with the shutter button assembly for it to cause uneven wear .
I would just like to add, although i have Leica's myself this question is not specifically directed, signaling out Leica's (i forgot people often jump to the conclusion it must be a Leica) or Tom's 'softies' but a general question encompassing all brands of RF and other popular camera, as well as softies in general, used by forum members. I ask the question in this section because this is where 'softie' question's seem to get asked and Tom is no doubt an expert in the soft release buttons, as such his opinion is valued.
perhaps it is just people looking for anyway to duck out (Void) of warrantee obligations, and it has been suggested that i thought was apt, 'hey what s next type thing', restricting the use of putting film in the camera for fear of putting strain on the wind mechanism lol.
anyway, given the 'void warrantee' stipulation, i simply thought it was a reasonable question to ask; whether anyone has encountered a problem from using a soft release button? if there is i would like to hear it, even if there was a chance, i dont think it will affect Tom or sales of the buttons, obviously there are overwhelming scores of people extremely happy with them, not to mention with some information given i have changed my mind; i was considering getting a stainless steel button, now i think i wont
I would just like to add, although i have Leica's myself this question is not specifically directed, signaling out Leica's (i forgot people often jump to the conclusion it must be a Leica) or Tom's 'softies' but a general question encompassing all brands of RF and other popular camera, as well as softies in general, used by forum members. I ask the question in this section because this is where 'softie' question's seem to get asked and Tom is no doubt an expert in the soft release buttons, as such his opinion is valued.
perhaps it is just people looking for anyway to duck out (Void) of warrantee obligations, and it has been suggested that i thought was apt, 'hey what s next type thing', restricting the use of putting film in the camera for fear of putting strain on the wind mechanism lol.
anyway, given the 'void warrantee' stipulation, i simply thought it was a reasonable question to ask; whether anyone has encountered a problem from using a soft release button? if there is i would like to hear it, even if there was a chance, i dont think it will affect Tom or sales of the buttons, obviously there are overwhelming scores of people extremely happy with them, not to mention with some information given i have changed my mind; i was considering getting a stainless steel button, now i think i wont
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lewis44
Well-known
Nikon actually made one for the F3 and it works on most of their cameras. It was the AR-9, so either Nikon makes better shutter release mechanisms or it's just not true that there is a problem.
I've used Tom's releases for as long as I can remember and the Nikon ones as well, never a problem.
I've used Tom's releases for as long as I can remember and the Nikon ones as well, never a problem.
SolaresLarrave
My M5s need red dots!
Tom's wife, Tuuliki, said jokingly in an e-mail that I should use red... but we only have transparent stuff at home. So, I compromised.
Damaso
Photojournalist
I've had nothing but good experiences! If you leave your camera cocked, which I don't, you can accidentally trigger it but I have to say it is perhaps my favorite accessory, next to the rapidwinder of course!
Sjixxxy
Well-known
Same here. Eighteen or so months of using a camera every day with a softie, and I've just learned how to handle it without popping off accidental frames. They are few and far between these days.
As for bags, haven't had a problem with that either. I mean really, why put my camera in a bag? It can't take pictures from in there.
scott kirkpatrick
Member
Nikon and scavenged softies
Nikon and scavenged softies
My M2 for its first 40 years with me had a 1/2" long machine screw wedged into the shutter button to provide easy mid-finger triggering. After a recent CLA, I replaced it with the genuine Abrahamsson softie. I've lost several of these from my M8's and will have to explore LockTite or nailpolish in the future.
The Nikon F softies have always worked well for me. B&H still has them in their catalog, but they are out of stock at present.
scott
Nikon and scavenged softies
My M2 for its first 40 years with me had a 1/2" long machine screw wedged into the shutter button to provide easy mid-finger triggering. After a recent CLA, I replaced it with the genuine Abrahamsson softie. I've lost several of these from my M8's and will have to explore LockTite or nailpolish in the future.
The Nikon F softies have always worked well for me. B&H still has them in their catalog, but they are out of stock at present.
scott
Nando
Well-known
I'm at the point where using a camera without a softie feels strange. I use them on all my cameras. Some are Tom's softies, some are Luigi's, a few are generic ones. I must say that if you get a painted Luigi softie, be careful not to get it mixed up in big bowl of Smarties. (Yes, that actually happened to me.)
giellaleafapmu
Well-known
I have seen a camera (at a camera shop) which was apparently damaged by putting too much pressure on a soft release button while the camera was in a bag (I am not sure of what happened, possibly somebody by accident sat on the bag). According to the technician if the soft release had not been on that could never have happened. I am not sure whether that is true or not but I now unscrew mine when I have the camera in the bag and I know the bag could get hit (like when I put the bag on the seat of a car or in the overhead compartment during a flight).
GLF
GLF
Tom A
RFF Sponsor
I have been using Softies (mine and others) for many years. Every camera has one on it and i have never had a problem with it. Any excess force applied to a camera can damage it. In the case of the "sat" on bag - a test should be done with or without a Softie and see if it makes any difference!
There is a lot of "urban myth" around any of these things like early M4-2 winders damaging shutters (didn't do it- just gave you a lot of blank exposures), gear jamming in M4P/early M6 (steel gear and a bit rougher than the old brass ones), focus shift with Konica lenses on M's (if people knew how to focus - focus shift would go away) ... etc. The list is long and every new camera/lens/accessory falls prey to these rumors.
Leica made Softies at one time - different from mine. It came with a threaded ring so it could be used as a lapel-pin!!!!!!
There is a lot of "urban myth" around any of these things like early M4-2 winders damaging shutters (didn't do it- just gave you a lot of blank exposures), gear jamming in M4P/early M6 (steel gear and a bit rougher than the old brass ones), focus shift with Konica lenses on M's (if people knew how to focus - focus shift would go away) ... etc. The list is long and every new camera/lens/accessory falls prey to these rumors.
Leica made Softies at one time - different from mine. It came with a threaded ring so it could be used as a lapel-pin!!!!!!
kshapero
South Florida Man
I had this happen to me when being jostled at a wedding. I was then told to never tighten the soft release all the way as it puts too much pressure on the shutter rod. Luckily no permanent damage. But scared the hell out of me when the shutter started to stick. I still use my Softie's.
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