When cleaning a lens with peroxide/ammonia fails, what else?

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biginovero

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I'm cleaning the central element of a 50 collapsible by FED.

Other elements came out pristine, but the central element still had a little spot or two.

being overzealous I cleaned it with a 1:1 mixture of hydrogen peroxide and ammonia, which should clean fungus, isn't it, so it should have been e good on other kind of less pesky dirt.

As a result dirt spread all over the surface following my finger's motion, leaving a footprint exactly like it is found when you perfunctory clean viewing glasses with a tissue and it does just spread skin fat all around.

Washing with distilled water had no effect.

I was thinking of using hot or boiling distilled water but I do not know if the coating would resist.

Element is a negative lens so it shouldn't be cemented.

Experimenting in corpore vili so no problems if I lose something.
 
91% isopropyl alcohol aka rubbing alcohol
You should be cleaning with something that evaporates quickly w/o leaving any residue.
This does that.

Make sure it is the 91%, not the weaker version.
 
Proper optics are cleaned in a certain way with certain materials. This is possibly a lens cleaning tissue, tweezers, and methanol.
As said above you can use isopropanol, as a safer replacement.


You can also do it by breathing on it and wiping it off with your t-shirt. For camera lenses imaging, doesnt really matter:) Will not look sparkling clean but image will be fine.

Your choice.
 
You supposed to drop peroxide/ammonia mix only to affected by fungus area. And let is seat for several minutes to make effect. After it has to be removed not by cleaning it like reading glasses, but "sponge" way. With cotton swab or cleaning tissue...
No water, it is not noodle dish. Russians like vodka, but clear spirit is preferable.
In Maizenberg book it is mentioned to take extra care with cleaning of internal optics, due to anti-glare layer applied on the lens surface.
 
I would try putting some "Cold Cream" on the lens surface for a couple hours, overnight if the 2 hours doesn't clear it up (fungus, that is).

For getting it absolutely clean, use a cotton swab (as many as you need, they are cheap) and Ronsonol and lots of patience.

If the cold cream doesn't clear it up and you want to polish off the coating, you can use bare aluminum polish then chrome polish like SIMICHROME if the aluminum polish doesn't move it. Go slow, be cautious and gentle until you know it needs more/the next step.
 
You will get lots of answers so consider what you have already done, and what you know about the dirt before you have a go. I've wrestled with this a little, with mixed success.

Peroxide/ammonia is indeed only good for fungus, and as said, it needs a few minutes to soak in. I would then rinse off with water but use distilled water not tap water. All the components are polar so are only good for similar things - the opposite of grease. Don't use hot water, the glass won't be borosilicate (Pyrex) so could well just break.

Greasy marks need a solvent to remove them, these are non-polar so need like materials to remove them. Isopropanol is good for this, methanol is a little different, but if you can get some, then always use this as the last clean. Methanol is said to be fine for coatings and I've had no problems in my shirt time. The provisos here are be careful what you clean with. I was using Q-tips and some days a little residue would be left on the lenses, this may have been leached out of the cotton. Paper can be abrasive though and tissues can have things other than just paper in them. If in doubt, a soft cloth is good.

As Phernidand says, a bit of breathing and polishing can remove the last things, when I removed some bad fungus from one camera, this last step did the trick.

I've heard the cold cream one, I haven't tried it but I expect it's just that cream and grease are similar, so it'll soften greasy stuff and wipe it away.

Hope this helps
 
I've been told that Coca-Cola can remove fungus. I haven't tried it myself, but if everything else has failed, it may be worth a try. I gather you wash it off with water afterwards.
 
I agree with johnnyrod the culprit is a hydrophobic substance such as grease or oil. In this case even pure alcohol will not efficiently dissolve the grease.

There is a special purpose (but expensive) lens cleaning product called ROR by V-Vax Products (www.ror.net). ROR has done a super job for me eliminating smears other methods could not touch.

ROR contains:

Ammonia 26°, Sodium Chloride, Isopropyl Alcohol, Liquid Soap, Distilled Water

I suspect the proprietary ingredient is the liquid soap formulation.

Since you have the element removed from the lens, you might carefully experiment with some mild liquid soap products.

I would just buy ROR since it is a the best all purpose lens cleaner I've ever used.
 
biginovero said:
...
Element is a negative lens so it shouldn't be cemented.
...
Click to expand...

False assumption! The fact that it has a overall negative FL doesn't insure that it is not a cemented doublet or triplet.

With all of the recommended cleaning methods, care should be taken to keep the cleaning solution away from the edges of the element.

Personally, I've found ethanol effective for cleaning oily and/or waxy smudges on lenses.
 
Soap doesn't rely on dissolving things, it just eases it away from surfaces, like getting a limpet off a rock. Interesting, never heard of ROR.
 
johnnyrod said:
You will get lots of answers so consider what you have already done, and what you know about the dirt before you have a go. I've wrestled with this a little, with mixed success.

Peroxide/ammonia is indeed only good for fungus, and as said, it needs a few minutes to soak in. I would then rinse off with water but use distilled water not tap water. All the components are polar so are only good for similar things - the opposite of grease. Don't use hot water, the glass won't be borosilicate (Pyrex) so could well just break.

Greasy marks need a solvent to remove them, these are non-polar so need like materials to remove them. Isopropanol is good for this, methanol is a little different, but if you can get some, then always use this as the last clean. Methanol is said to be fine for coatings and I've had no problems in my shirt time. The provisos here are be careful what you clean with. I was using Q-tips and some days a little residue would be left on the lenses, this may have been leached out of the cotton. Paper can be abrasive though and tissues can have things other than just paper in them. If in doubt, a soft cloth is good.

As Phernidand says, a bit of breathing and polishing can remove the last things, when I removed some bad fungus from one camera, this last step did the trick.

I've heard the cold cream one, I haven't tried it but I expect it's just that cream and grease are similar, so it'll soften greasy stuff and wipe it away.

Hope this helps
Click to expand...

willie_901 said:
I agree with johnnyrod the culprit is a hydrophobic substance such as grease or oil. In this case even pure alcohol will not efficiently dissolve the grease.

There is a special purpose (but expensive) lens cleaning product called ROR by V-Vax Products (www.ror.net). ROR has done a super job for me eliminating smears other methods could not touch.

ROR contains:

Ammonia 26°, Sodium Chloride, Isopropyl Alcohol, Liquid Soap, Distilled Water

I suspect the proprietary ingredient is the liquid soap formulation.

Since you have the element removed from the lens, you might carefully experiment with some mild liquid soap products.

I would just buy ROR since it is a the best all purpose lens cleaner I've ever used.
Click to expand...

Dwig said:
False assumption! The fact that it has a overall negative FL doesn't insure that it is not a cemented doublet or triplet.

With all of the recommended cleaning methods, care should be taken to keep the cleaning solution away from the edges of the element.

Personally, I've found ethanol effective for cleaning oily and/or waxy smudges on lenses.
Click to expand...

Ty, so far I have been able to buy some isopropyl alcool (substantially banned in my country, nanny state thinks we could moonshine tut tut tut) through Amazon.

i will definitely not boil anything without knowing the lens' schematic at this point, in effect the lens might be a cemented group. Also it might break so I would experiment with hot water only as last resort.

ROR will also be next on my buying list, when I'm done experimenting with cheap stuff and I'm ready for doing serious repairs.

It is not available locally but I might end up importing some.
 
mcfingon said:
I've been told that Coca-Cola can remove fungus. I haven't tried it myself, but if everything else has failed, it may be worth a try. I gather you wash it off with water afterwards.
Click to expand...

Fixcinater said:
I would try putting some "Cold Cream" on the lens surface for a couple hours, overnight if the 2 hours doesn't clear it up (fungus, that is).

For getting it absolutely clean, use a cotton swab (as many as you need, they are cheap) and Ronsonol and lots of patience.

If the cold cream doesn't clear it up and you want to polish off the coating, you can use bare aluminum polish then chrome polish like SIMICHROME if the aluminum polish doesn't move it. Go slow, be cautious and gentle until you know it needs more/the next step.
Click to expand...

Coca-Cola? Cold Cream? Not Chivas Regal or Irish Whisky? No Baron de Rothschild Burgundy? And no one has mentioned Mountain Dew yet? Really, I would exhaust all the more conventional ideas first . . .
 
Rob-F said:
Coca-Cola? Cold Cream? Not Chivas Regal or Irish Whisky? No Baron de Rothschild Burgundy? And no one has mentioned Mountain Dew yet? Really, I would exhaust all the more conventional ideas first . . .
Click to expand...

Mountain Dew is too mellow on fungus. Here we have less expensive (3CAD difference) and stronger (45) Crown Royal's Northern Harvest Rye.
Taste like gasoline with orange hint.
 
Lots of hearsay, urban legends and wild assumptions here.

Really. I don't mean to sound a wiseass, but i work in laser optics for 15 years already, where mirrors are soft frint coated and all optics need to be sparkling clean otherwise 20 kilowatts of light will burn into the glass even the smallest nudge.
One uses lens cleaning tissue, tweezers and methanol, if the optics is important.
If it's not important, your t-shirt and breath is perfectly adequate.

Never boil stuff, never use magik stuff the grandma told you will work, ammonia, liquid soap, coca cola, you guys are serious??
 
Pherdinand said:
Lots of hearsay, urban legends and wild assumptions here.

Really. I don't mean to sound a wiseass, but i work in laser optics for 15 years already, where mirrors are soft frint coated and all optics need to be sparkling clean otherwise 20 kilowatts of light will burn into the glass even the smallest nudge.
One uses lens cleaning tissue, tweezers and methanol, if the optics is important.
If it's not important, your t-shirt and breath is perfectly adequate.

Never boil stuff, never use magik stuff the grandma told you will work, ammonia, liquid soap, coca cola, you guys are serious??
Click to expand...

Pretty much what I was trying to say.
 
Here's some chemistry.

Soap is a diverse mixture of amphiphilic molecules. Amphiphilic molecules have both polar (water soluble) segments and non-polar (oil soluble) segments. This is how come soap is highly soluble in water yet soaps efficiently dissolve grease. Anyone who has washed dishes knows soaps are soluble in water and also completely dissolve grease.

Detergents are chemically pure soaps. Detergents are used to dissolve biological molecules that are water insoluble. Different mixtures of amphiphilic molecules have different oil/grease dissolving properties. A properly designed detergent formulation will not simply push grease and oils around. It dissolves them in water. Then simple rinsing dilutes and removes the oils and grease.

Methanol, ethanol and isopropyl alcohol are primarily polar molecules and this is why they are ineffective at dissolving grease and oils.
 
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