jsrockit
Moderator
+1 ... once reality takes over fantasy.
When photography becomes work ...
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+1 ... once reality takes over fantasy.
giellaleafapmu
Well-known
To me professional work (even at the low low level at which I practice it, as a side job) had one invaluable feature: it obliged me to learn how to make a decent picture of things I wouldn't otherwise photograph. This skill helps me a lot with any photography, job or not.
When you are given fast food you wouldn't probably eat and are asked to make look it delicious you have to learn your craft at a level you wouldn't probably learn if you were not forced.
This for me included in particular using artificial light (something I could not stand when I started) and "make up" (in my case food make up but I guess it must be similar for those working with models).
Having said all this, after learning the skills, the most enjoyable way to use them is in a personal projects, not at work.
GLF
When you are given fast food you wouldn't probably eat and are asked to make look it delicious you have to learn your craft at a level you wouldn't probably learn if you were not forced.
This for me included in particular using artificial light (something I could not stand when I started) and "make up" (in my case food make up but I guess it must be similar for those working with models).
Having said all this, after learning the skills, the most enjoyable way to use them is in a personal projects, not at work.
GLF
KM-25
Well-known
I love how people kid them selves on these kinds of threads, basically saying they have more fun with their photo hobby than a National Geographic Photographer does on a brilliant assignment.
Face reality guys, if you were as good and as famous as some of the people you all talk about, you would love photography as a profession far, far more then 99% of those who do it as a hobby.
Face reality guys, if you were as good and as famous as some of the people you all talk about, you would love photography as a profession far, far more then 99% of those who do it as a hobby.
jsrockit
Moderator
How can you speak for everyone? Perhaps some of us aren't into National Geographic or prefer not to travel for work.
The bottom line is that some of us like photography as that escape from work and like to do it on our own terms.
Roger Hicks
Veteran
No, I don't think they're saying that. I read it more as "Even if you shoot for National Geographic [or shoot Pirelli calendars, or whatever], life ain't always perfect, and you have to do stuff you don't want to do."
Staying in a village in the Himalayas with no toilets (anywhere in the village): yeah, OK, done that. I'd rather have stayed somewhere more comfortable, but it's better than being an accountant, and it was worth it for the pictures. Filing my quarterly VAT (Valued Added Tax) returns? Hell, that IS being an accountant.
If I were a rich accountant, and could stand accountancy, I might prefer to stick with the day job too. But different people have different priorities. The fact that a steady, dull job is neither your first choice nor mine does not mean we can speak authoritatively about what others think.
Cheers,
R.
emraphoto
Veteran
i am often struck by how difficult situations like your Himalayan experience are. i mean i am a pretty seasoned 'off the grid' type but really, that sort of environment starts to become very, very difficult unless you were born into it or have spent a great deal of time acclimatizing. when you are on a timeframe for assignments it can be down right maddening. throw in the often different pace of negations in cultures outside our own? i have about a 60 day threshold.
emraphoto
Veteran
add that some of the photographers i consider to be super innovative, driven and exceptional talents have zero interest in doing it for a living.
Spanik
Well-known
How can you be so sure those brilliant photographers enjoyed what they did? For them it is work with a deadline and great expectations from the clients. You have to perform whatever the assignment and at least as good as last time. No goofing off trying out some alternative, you're on someone's payroll.
If I feel like taking the C330 out and it turns to be a wrong choice, so what? I might have enjoyed the day out without any photo's. But if they expect some glorious stuff at your return, would you enjoy it?
KM-25
Well-known
How? Because I know at least a dozen of them on a personal level, we talk about this stuff and get a good chuckle out of it,
The reason I posted what I did is that it is often the way these topics come off sounding, simply put that pros do not enjoy photography as much as hobby shooters do.
For example, I am a pretty decent guitar player, but I do it for my self and have never entertained the idea of bieng a rock star. But when I see someone like Stevie Ray Vaughn ripping it, the energy of the crowd, the life lived to the fullest, I would be kidding my self to say that would not be a great life.
That's really all I meant, that at least some on here are likely *Fully* kidding them selves.
KM-25
Well-known
We have been down this road before. It really has nothing to do with NG and more to do with the fact that there are pros who shoot on their terms and get paid to do it, would never dreeeeam of trying to "escape" it, because it is their life, not just their job.
So as this topic comes up, this *never* gets talked about so you get the typical "I would hate it if it were my job" replies.....it's as if this part of the equation is too hard to even look at, let alone discuss.
It's really bizarre, how can you even answer the question if you do not consider all levels of talent and success?
Roger Hicks
Veteran
giellaleafapmu
Well-known
I agree that part of the pleasure of having a job is how successful one is at that job and when we talk of "side jobs" or "job I did while student" we are probably talking of some job which did not evolved in the best possible way but, where is the kidding?
- Do you like running?
- I do, but not when it is raining...
- I see how you are kidding yourself, if you were a multimillionaire Olympic champion you would love always...
Come on... Of course we all, pro, ex-pro, semi-pro, amateur, casual shooter, love photography, otherwise we would not be here, and, no kidding, someone don't always like every assignment they get, or even don't like every day one gets out with a camera to take casual pictures... We would be kidding if we were saying: "Yeah, it's always all great, all which is not perfect is due to our technical limitations, if we were better or more famous our life would be heaven".
Just a last word: I know several guys who were many times better than I would ever dream of being, technically and for their stamina, and who were hard-working and lucky enough top have their photographs published in famous magazines (including NG), and most of them eventually needed to get "a proper job", with no bullets involved and a paycheck every mount. It's sad but these days it is not so easy to make a living out of photography alone, even for good talented persons.
GLF
jsrockit
Moderator
Fair enough. I understand. Of course, some people just have it made in life. I guess those of us of average talent aren't thinking about the A level jobs. 🙂
Paul Luscher
Well-known
If photography was my work it would be JUST A JOB. I'd have to shoot things I didn't necessarily want to, and I'd have to do all the the business , finance and tax stuff, which I don't like, but also client schmoozing , which I'm not good at, and don't like either.
Know a a pro photog who told me she spends more of her time in the office than out shooting. She's gone for weeks at a time without picking up a camera. Also, she's now $72K in the hole, and about to file for personal bankruptcy. So I know photoging can be a hard and uncertain dollar.....especially in these times....
No, I'll keep photography as an avocation, something fun for me to do AFTER work (which at least guarantees me a secure income, so far). If someone picks up on my work and wants to buy it, great.
Know a a pro photog who told me she spends more of her time in the office than out shooting. She's gone for weeks at a time without picking up a camera. Also, she's now $72K in the hole, and about to file for personal bankruptcy. So I know photoging can be a hard and uncertain dollar.....especially in these times....
No, I'll keep photography as an avocation, something fun for me to do AFTER work (which at least guarantees me a secure income, so far). If someone picks up on my work and wants to buy it, great.
Roger Hicks
Veteran
I fully see your point (believe me!) but equally, like Chris Crawford, I'll put up with the bad stuff rather than doing anything other than photography (well, except writing).
Cheers,
R.
jonasv
has no mustache
The thread was about whether YOU would like it to be YOUR job. Thinking about that can be done in a very realistic way, accepting your own strengths and flaws and from that point of view, deciding whether you would like it or not...
If you are entering "becoming a brilliant shooter all of a sudden" into the equation, sure, that might change the discussion, but that wasn't the original question. You say "it never gets talked about" when the topic comes up, but failed to see it was a different topic altogether... So I think your comments are a bit off really. If you read some of the above comments, for example, you can see that some people aren't interested in doing this professionally because they aren't comfortable enough with their photographic skills... Which seems fair enough to me!
jonasv
has no mustache
This thread has been a really good read for me.
I stopped taking pictures a few years back because I couldn't combine it (as a hobby) with my career (consultancy) any more. Recently I have done a lot of thinking about where I really want to go, professionally, and every time 'photography' is the first thing that comes to mind.
So I'm in the process of building a website, writing a small business plan, networking, finding clients... to start up my own photobusiness. Have to say it's incredibly exciting, even though I am taking it slowly and planning on making the 'start-up-phase' a process which will last a few years.
I stopped taking pictures a few years back because I couldn't combine it (as a hobby) with my career (consultancy) any more. Recently I have done a lot of thinking about where I really want to go, professionally, and every time 'photography' is the first thing that comes to mind.
So I'm in the process of building a website, writing a small business plan, networking, finding clients... to start up my own photobusiness. Have to say it's incredibly exciting, even though I am taking it slowly and planning on making the 'start-up-phase' a process which will last a few years.
radical7
Olivier Duong
The opposite happens for me... it kills the creativity!
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