Disaster_Area
Gadget Monger
I live in Ottawa, and it doesn't come up often, but shooting in public every once in a while I get someone that not only gets pissed that they were in a shot I took... but starts getting up in my face that it's illegal to take their picture without permission. And the weirdest thing is more often than not it's buskers, people making a living performing in public, that start this kind of argument, even if I drop a coin in their tin.
To my knowledge it's NEVER been illegal to take someones picture in public in North America... and unlike most cultural misinformation it's not something that's portrayed in North American pop-culture, in fact North America has a HUGE culture of celebrity gossip/paparazzi fascination. So how can the same people that HAVE to read about what Brad Pitt wore to the park today possibly believe that it's perfectly legal for people to use a telephoto lens to follow Branjolina around but I'm doing something wrong taking a picture they might have been in?
Is it simply the ignorant/hypocritical idea that "I don't like when it happens to me it so it must be illegal" or am I missing something. I'm not saying someone doesn't have the right not to like the fact that their picture was taken, in fact if they approach me rationally nine times out of ten I'll delete the shot... but to actually call me a criminal is just kind of surreal...
To my knowledge it's NEVER been illegal to take someones picture in public in North America... and unlike most cultural misinformation it's not something that's portrayed in North American pop-culture, in fact North America has a HUGE culture of celebrity gossip/paparazzi fascination. So how can the same people that HAVE to read about what Brad Pitt wore to the park today possibly believe that it's perfectly legal for people to use a telephoto lens to follow Branjolina around but I'm doing something wrong taking a picture they might have been in?
Is it simply the ignorant/hypocritical idea that "I don't like when it happens to me it so it must be illegal" or am I missing something. I'm not saying someone doesn't have the right not to like the fact that their picture was taken, in fact if they approach me rationally nine times out of ten I'll delete the shot... but to actually call me a criminal is just kind of surreal...
Al Patterson
Ferroequinologist
It is ignorance of the law by self-centered idiots.
kossi008
Photon Counter
I'm guessing it's misinformation paired with social envy.
The people you write about probably have read somewhere that Brangelina have fought throught a restraining order against this and the other Paparazzi, they don't know any details, they confuse intrusion into a person's privacy with shooting in public, and now they are thinking that they have every right to challenge this guy (you), even if they're not celebrities...
The people you write about probably have read somewhere that Brangelina have fought throught a restraining order against this and the other Paparazzi, they don't know any details, they confuse intrusion into a person's privacy with shooting in public, and now they are thinking that they have every right to challenge this guy (you), even if they're not celebrities...
Disaster_Area
Gadget Monger
hmmm... I hadn't thought of that ... good point. I guess I can see how a busker might get it into their head that since they're a performer they might some how fall into the "celebrity" zone... and therefor get to bitch about people taking their picture...
oftheherd
Veteran
I guess some people think if they aren't a celebrity (in the USA at least, celebrities have less expectation of privacy) they have a right to whether or not they are photographed. The courts have decreed that celebrities have less right to privacy. Incorrect logic would imply if they don't, private citizens do. A search might get you a lot more answers from RFF forums.
Disaster_Area
Gadget Monger
oh I've read all the previous threads...but they mostly focused on what was and what wasn't legal... and what to do about it/ how to stand up for your rights... I was more interested in WHY people think it's illegal.
kossi008
Photon Counter
Arjay
Time Traveller
I don't know about Canada, but over here in Germany, it is allowed to photograph people in public, but it may be illegal to publish these pictures in the internet under certain conditions.
In Germany, you are allowed to publish a picture if a person appears as part of a crowd. If, however, the picture is a portrait, then publishing is illegal, provided the person isn't a celebrity who has participated in some kind of activity that might be described as an event of contemporary history in a fairly wide sense.
Of course, if no harm is done, and nobody complains, then I guess this isn't a problem. There's a German saying - where there's no plaintiff, there'll be no judge. But - it's a good idea to be aware that you'd better remove a picture from the internet as soon as there is a complaint, because this could lead to fairly complicated legal proceedings in Germany (like claims for modeling fees, indemnities for breach of privacy etc.).
In Germany, you are allowed to publish a picture if a person appears as part of a crowd. If, however, the picture is a portrait, then publishing is illegal, provided the person isn't a celebrity who has participated in some kind of activity that might be described as an event of contemporary history in a fairly wide sense.
Of course, if no harm is done, and nobody complains, then I guess this isn't a problem. There's a German saying - where there's no plaintiff, there'll be no judge. But - it's a good idea to be aware that you'd better remove a picture from the internet as soon as there is a complaint, because this could lead to fairly complicated legal proceedings in Germany (like claims for modeling fees, indemnities for breach of privacy etc.).
yanidel
Well-known
That is the most common claim here in Paris I get. When I hear it, I just pass my way because I have found that people who claim that usually don't have enough education for a clarifying discussion.
Why is it so? Indeed because of celebrities suing people magazines which are mostly read by less educated people.
Why is it so? Indeed because of celebrities suing people magazines which are mostly read by less educated people.
Disaster_Area
Gadget Monger
See I can understand it in European countries where the line is a lot fuzzier between legal and illegal in public... it's one thing not to know the exact letter of the law... but over on this side of the pond people are just making it up 
Last edited by a moderator:
Rob-F
Likes Leicas
Where did it come from? I'd say it came from the Bush administration's policy of management by fear. Then I guess it spread to other countries as well. I don't recall it ever being an issue before the year 2001.
robert blu
quiet photographer
In Italy it is like Arjay says in germany. Where it comes from? In my opinion when mob phones made it easy to public pictures on the web many persons have been found where they had not to be. Someone pretending not to work because sick was discovered by his boss photographed on a beach, someonelse pretending to do extrwork was seen by the wife on the background of a picture taken in a pub together with a nice girl etc etc.
robert
robert
Harry Lime
Practitioner
Sparrow
Veteran
Next time pretend you're a mime trapped in a box and can't hear them...
Aren’t mime-artists also illegal?
yanidel
Well-known
That illustrates today's people lack of responsibility after decades of providence state. It's never one's fault, somebody else must be blamed. I cheat on my wife but someone else has to pay if I get uncovered.
Krzys
Well-known
What about these folks who walk around in public blasting rap and hiphop out of terrible phone speakers. Nobody has the guts to tell them to shutup, even on the bus.
However the thought of my icy stare gazing at you through my negatives is enough to shutdown your whole shop till you drop agenda and give me a lecture on the law of Jane Nobody. Yes, enjoy looking at your favorite celebrities at the beach in Woman's Day later as you have lunch.
However the thought of my icy stare gazing at you through my negatives is enough to shutdown your whole shop till you drop agenda and give me a lecture on the law of Jane Nobody. Yes, enjoy looking at your favorite celebrities at the beach in Woman's Day later as you have lunch.
scottwallick
ambition ≥ skill
Even when in public, perhaps those people are assuming some type of privacy or perhaps an anonymity in certain contexts. Having someone take their photo conflicts with that presumption. Of course, we know the law and the 'if anyone can see it, it can be photographed' mantra. They don't.
At some point, I stopped being surprised when someone reacted when they were aware I was taking of photo that might include them (their presumption), from confused and dirty looks to verbal confrontation. I just anticipate it now.
At some point, I stopped being surprised when someone reacted when they were aware I was taking of photo that might include them (their presumption), from confused and dirty looks to verbal confrontation. I just anticipate it now.
Roger Hicks
Veteran
Dear Rob,
It does not come easily to me to defend Bushes, but the gutter press and the cult of celebrity are at least as much to blame as either Sr and Jr.
'Management by fear' by finding an 'enemy' against whom the country can unite goes back a very long way: before terrorism there were Commies and the Cold War; before that, WW2 (unless you were a Nazi sympathizer, who were surprisingly common), WW1, the Wobblies... It's always easier to frighten the hard of thinking, and who are the ones who object most to being photographed...?
Cheers,
R.
Ken Smith
Why yes Ma'am - it folds
I always find these types of discussions here rather interesting. When is my right to walk around in a public place taking photos of complete strangers more important than a total stranger's right not to have their picture taken if they don't want it to happen? When is one individual's rights more important than another's.
Roger Hicks
Veteran
Dear Ken,
Practicality. If you always had to ask everyone's permission before taking their picture, it would effectively ban ALL photography in public wherever there was a risk of a person being in the shot.
This does not sound like a healthy society to me.
Cheers,
R.