Where is this problem coming from?

[Ash]

I thought my Fed-2 might be slightly out of alignment, but after running a roll through yesterday I found the focus is perfect - its everything else that's going wrong!

Below I've attached an image showing everything thats going wrong. The blurring is due to lazy grip on a slow shutter speed.

Equipment:
# Fed-2, Collapsible 50mm
# Bulk Rolled Ilford Pan F+
# Plastic reel developing equipment


What's causing:
# The huge dark 'tape' patch?
# The scratching?
# The artefacts? (evident on the sky)


My thoughts are the scratching is caused by the bulk loading, as its happened in 3 of my 4 FSU cams, and no clear sign of a problem in them - some films look fine. I'm blaming the bulk loader. As for the dark patch, theres a whole line spanning multiple frames (I think about 5 photo's or so are affected). The artefacts, no idea. Maybe dirty chemicals (although I mixed a fresh batch and wash out the equipment immediately) or something on the lens itself, as it's evident in a couple frames I think.


What do you guys an gals think?

Thanks for any help! 🙂

 

[boarini2003]

The scratching definitely seems to be because of dust when bulk loading. That's why I don't bulk load anymore.

The "artifacts" could be particles of dust or something that stuck to the negative inside the developing tank, thus preventing developer from properly coverimg the area, or it could be at printing, due to grabbing fresh paper with a trace of fixer on your fingers, or it could be a particle of dust resting on the negative as it was being projected by the enlarger. Check the negative and see if the spots are also there.

The tape thing seems very mysterious to me. Is this one of the last images in the roll? If you use a long tape strip, it could have overlapped onto the last frame.

 

[Xmas]

Ash

I use concentric caswettes and a loader without a felt trap.

It required 40 years before I'd use a squeegee/wiper after washing and omit tha hardening bath.

Does your loader have felt?

Noel

 

[Xmas]

An afterthought what sort of tape do you use, sorry to say I only use the physical traps in the reels.

Noel

 

[Ash]

I'm scanning negs, but the artefacts are visible on the neg itself, the tape is only a slither to attach to the lip sticking out of the cassete - rather than a strip, the use of the term 'tape' was only to make it easy to talk about, I'm not sure it actually IS tape.

 

[FrankS]

Ash, did this frame come from the middle of the roll or the end? Is that dark patch the same width as the tape you use to attach the end of the film to the spool?

 

[Xmas]

Ash

Once upon a time Kodak wrote a disclaimer about crud in cameras causing spots on negatives, but your spot is white in positive so must be black on negative? If you splashed it with cheminal before processing you might get a black mark.

Physcial damage or chemical action can 'fog' film. I fing it pretty impossible to avoid 'cinch' margs on 120 file, and always remove the tape attachment with scissors. If your tape is wound in under tension it might create a problem.

I get lots of problems on 35mm rebates but dont worry too much.

Noel

 

[Ash]

The patches are towards the end of the film, but the 5 or so frames affected seem to be 2 different marks, as it doesnt match up in a consistent line (but the dark patch is regular in shape). The film cassette I used was a fuji can, rather than kodak. It doesnt line up with the tape I used either - I wrap a small amount round sprocket-to-sprocket and around the back to tape the loose leafs of the film together. The dark patch is also very fuzzy, its really confusing!

It might be tension problems, and the film felt a bit rough going through the camera, like it was dragging, so maybe theres a problem somewhere, but I'm really not all too sure whether to blame the camera or the film can

 

[Xmas]

Ash

If you omit the tape what happens, i.e. what is the tape doing?

Inless the tape is low profile i.e. not thick physical stress will cause a ghost mark.

Noel.

 

[Fred]

Ash, I know a few people who stopped bulk loading because of scratches. Then they blamed the lab for the same scratches. Scratches can of course be caused by contaminated loaders or a reused can thats gone once to many times. The fact was for one of them was a tiny bit of crud moving around the inside of the camera body. Easy for this to get stuck between the pressure plate and the film during rewinding (overlapping a few frames before falling out). Give the inside of the camera body a bloody good blowout with a hurricane or rocket air brush (one of those things that looks like a blower brush but without the brush bit).

Also before loading a new bulk roll to the loader, give the loader a blast with air as well.

As for the dark mark, thats an intersting one. Is it possible that a finger was not completely clean when the film spiral was loaded. This could cause under development on the affected area. It might not even be on the last frame of the roll but more likely as this is where you would handle the film.

Hope this helps.

 

[Ash]

Hmm yea I can see how it could be a loading/dirty-finger problem, but I load emulsion-side-IN, so this shouldnt happen?

The bit of tape that IS in the can is to physically stick the new film I'm loading to the old lip. It's packing tape (thin, brown) and very low profile - if I remove it then what is to hold the film onto the lip on the spool? These are crimped cans remember 😉

 

[Fred]

Hmm yea I can see how it could be a loading/dirty-finger problem, but I load emulsion-side-IN, so this shouldnt happen?

The bit of tape that IS in the can is to physically stick the new film I'm loading to the old lip. It's packing tape (thin, brown) and very low profile - if I remove it then what is to hold the film onto the lip on the spool? These are crimped cans remember 😉

With your soon to be recieved used once cans, just stick the new film to the bit of the old thats sticking out that was cut by the lab. I use them only once then bin them.

Wonder if the mark was caused by a faulty piece of film 😱

 

[Ash]

Thanks Tony, I'll probably use them twice however, and hope I dont get a problem!

The most likely problem is faulty film yea

 

[Xmas]

Ash

It the tape you used is was the same width as the fogged area it may be chemical - lots of chemicals will develop a latent image and the chemical might print through a layer off film. I think I recall Ilford used fibre tape but they sandwiched the film which would heve reduced chemical outgassing through the film.

Can you inspect the film in the region of the white mark on the positive to see if there is any surface damage.

Can you inspect the rebates to see if there are any similar marks...

Sorry I'm, not able to be more helpful, I get depressed by my film marks.

Noel

 

[Ash]

there arent any physical marks. it looks like its in the emulsion or part of printing.

possibly the film touched on the reel... thats the only thing I think is reasonable, there was NO TAPE anywhere near the marks on the film!

 

[petebown]

My guess is the film has been slightly fogged. Something has prevented light getting to the rectangle area.

I've never bothered with bulk loading... Too much likelyhood of dust and scratches.

p.s. I know that building in your avatar! My sister once lived on the 13th floor! Here's a shot of her taken 22 years ago looking down at where you took the photo from.

 

[Ash]

Heh, you're the first one to notice!

Yep its swindon's "tallest building" which can be seen from everywhere. I love the 80's look to your photo. Very 'retro' 😀

I was stood on the high street between the brunel plaza overpass and the lion statue. Around where Topshop/Topman is/was.


I'll run another roll through the fed and write that last lot of problems as a mystery, but thanks for the help 🙂

 

[Xmas]

Ash

Ive given up on this e.g. the post with the bus stop looks to be the same density through the darker area, the bus stop sign seems to be the same as the one on the other side of the road.

If you look at the gap between frames what if the density like and how does your scanner see it?

Noel.

 

[bsdunek]

That rectangular dark area is sure a puzzle. It's such a definate area, not very fuzzy. If you were wet printing, I would say your paper had some light strike. If the film had a light strike, it would be a lighter area.
Is there something in the camera between the lens and film that can cast a shadow on the film?
I don't believe the 'tape' thing, as pressure on the film is the same as exposure, which would produce a lighter area on the print (darker on the film).
Let us know if this happens to the next roll.