flamingo
flamingo
I posed this question on the Bessa Forum about a week back regarding the R2, 2a and R3a and I received opinions all over the place. I have since re-thought my next major purchase and decided to forgo the Bessa body route and go straight to an "M".
I like the feature set of the M6 TTL since they are also a relatively more modern camera in the Leica line that is still within my budget.
I am eyeballing the 90 2.8 Tele-Elmarit late version black "Made in Canada" version as a first lens along with a new Voigtlander Nokton 40 1.4 as my "normal" lens. BTW, does anyoner know the closest focus on a 90 2.8 Tele Elmarit ?
Later down the road, a 21mm, perhaps also the Voigtlander 21/4 if I like the results I get from the 40 Nokton. Since the 21 uses the seperate finder, the 40 will be my widest lens thru the viewfinder.
The 21/2.8 Leica is ridiculously out of my price range, I'm afraid.
I also understand from reading Steve Gandy's website that the Nokton 40 actually brings up the 50mm frameline in the M6's, so I will have to visualize "outside the box" so to speak.
So the question is, since I wear glasses, does the .85 finder on the M6TTL make better sense than the .72 for my use as an eyeglass wearer if the 40 is the widest "viewfinder" lens I plan on using ? I like the idea of having an easier focus on the 90, but at the same time I am a bit concerned that I may not "see" the full framing ability of the 40. I would imagine that the 40 would be just about the full frame with the .85 mag.
Also as a last thought on the lenses, do my choices sound like the best "bang for the buck" in those focal lengths ? (21, 40, 90 ?)
I would love to stay with the all Leica German made glass, instead of Canadian made, and Japanese made lenses on a German camera. As a sh*thouse wannabe purist, the idea disgusts me, but my wallet (and my wife) will surely be happier for it.
I know I have posed a lot of questions but I sincerely appreciate all your views. Thanks all and I welcome your opinions.
I like the feature set of the M6 TTL since they are also a relatively more modern camera in the Leica line that is still within my budget.
I am eyeballing the 90 2.8 Tele-Elmarit late version black "Made in Canada" version as a first lens along with a new Voigtlander Nokton 40 1.4 as my "normal" lens. BTW, does anyoner know the closest focus on a 90 2.8 Tele Elmarit ?
Later down the road, a 21mm, perhaps also the Voigtlander 21/4 if I like the results I get from the 40 Nokton. Since the 21 uses the seperate finder, the 40 will be my widest lens thru the viewfinder.
The 21/2.8 Leica is ridiculously out of my price range, I'm afraid.
I also understand from reading Steve Gandy's website that the Nokton 40 actually brings up the 50mm frameline in the M6's, so I will have to visualize "outside the box" so to speak.
So the question is, since I wear glasses, does the .85 finder on the M6TTL make better sense than the .72 for my use as an eyeglass wearer if the 40 is the widest "viewfinder" lens I plan on using ? I like the idea of having an easier focus on the 90, but at the same time I am a bit concerned that I may not "see" the full framing ability of the 40. I would imagine that the 40 would be just about the full frame with the .85 mag.
Also as a last thought on the lenses, do my choices sound like the best "bang for the buck" in those focal lengths ? (21, 40, 90 ?)
I would love to stay with the all Leica German made glass, instead of Canadian made, and Japanese made lenses on a German camera. As a sh*thouse wannabe purist, the idea disgusts me, but my wallet (and my wife) will surely be happier for it.
I know I have posed a lot of questions but I sincerely appreciate all your views. Thanks all and I welcome your opinions.
SolaresLarrave
My M5s need red dots!
I use glasses (bifocals, mind you) and find the 0.72 magnification fine. The 0.58 is usually the most recommended for eyeglass wearers, but it actually was designed for heavy use of wide-angles like 35mm and 28mm because the framelines are easier to view.
Given your choice of lenses, the 0.58 would be fatal with your projected 90mm lens (I believe the minimum focusing distance is about one meter, or roughly 3 feet) and wouldn't help much with the 50mm framelines. Go for the standard, which is 0.72.
Have fun shopping!
Given your choice of lenses, the 0.58 would be fatal with your projected 90mm lens (I believe the minimum focusing distance is about one meter, or roughly 3 feet) and wouldn't help much with the 50mm framelines. Go for the standard, which is 0.72.
Have fun shopping!
SolaresLarrave
My M5s need red dots!
Oh, BTW, there's nothing wrong with Canadian glass or Japanese-made lenses. I have both kinds, plus a Summicron made in Germany... Try get stuff sharp at f4!! 
You can with any of them...
As for focal lengths, the best combo: 35, 50 and 90. If you haven't purchased the 40mm, you can always snatch any old one for around $400, and add the rest of the glass later. Shopping for glass takes time and patience, but it's a rewarding endeavor.
You can with any of them...
As for focal lengths, the best combo: 35, 50 and 90. If you haven't purchased the 40mm, you can always snatch any old one for around $400, and add the rest of the glass later. Shopping for glass takes time and patience, but it's a rewarding endeavor.
flamingo
flamingo
Francisco, thanks for the truly practical user advice ! That is exactly what I was looking for. Anyone out there to second Francisco's recommendation on the .72 viewfinder for my situation ?
I am ready to pull the trigger on the M6TTL, but I am still teetering on the fence a little with the good angel/bad devil over my shoulder saying ".72", no, ".85" !! They seem to be pretty plentiful in both flavors at some of the better known NY dealers for reasonable money right now, eh ?
I am ready to pull the trigger on the M6TTL, but I am still teetering on the fence a little with the good angel/bad devil over my shoulder saying ".72", no, ".85" !! They seem to be pretty plentiful in both flavors at some of the better known NY dealers for reasonable money right now, eh ?
denishr
アナログ侘・&#
I can second Francisco's opinion regarding VF magnification. I find that .72 is the best "universal" magnification. That's what I have on my M2 and M6, and since I wear glasses, it works just fine with 50mm lenses (or 40mm, if that's what you go for). If you will be using 90mm lens, then I would advise against "wider" ones (i.e. .58).
Denis
Denis
Both Denis and Francisco refer to the .58x magnification, whereas you were talking about .85x... That viewfinder choice will be the best for the 90mm lens, as you suggest, but I've never used one so don't know how close the 50mm frames are to the edge of the finder. I have an M2 with .72x, and the left and right sides of the 35mm frames are both just barely visible at once, but not with glasses on.
All the finder frames will display slightly less than you'll actually get on film, as a safety margin. So the 35mm frames are very close to being right on for 40mm, but you'll have to be aware you may inadvertently cut off bits of your subject's anatomy if you let it get to the edge! So I would use the 35mm frames with this in mind... but the 40mm lens inconveniently brings up 50mm frames automatically on the Leica. Since the frame selector lever moves to the left-most position to select the 35mm frames, you could hold it there with a rubber band going around it and the left-side strap lug. Never seen or heard of anyone doing this, but I tried it and it works!
I'm not sure of this, but I suspect the 40mm f/2 Summicron from the Lecia CL would bring up the 35mm framelines on an M6, not the 50 frames, since the CL has 50 frames too. Further, this is one fine Leica lens that is very economical, might fit your budget and your desires too.
All the finder frames will display slightly less than you'll actually get on film, as a safety margin. So the 35mm frames are very close to being right on for 40mm, but you'll have to be aware you may inadvertently cut off bits of your subject's anatomy if you let it get to the edge! So I would use the 35mm frames with this in mind... but the 40mm lens inconveniently brings up 50mm frames automatically on the Leica. Since the frame selector lever moves to the left-most position to select the 35mm frames, you could hold it there with a rubber band going around it and the left-side strap lug. Never seen or heard of anyone doing this, but I tried it and it works!
I'm not sure of this, but I suspect the 40mm f/2 Summicron from the Lecia CL would bring up the 35mm framelines on an M6, not the 50 frames, since the CL has 50 frames too. Further, this is one fine Leica lens that is very economical, might fit your budget and your desires too.
flamingo
flamingo
BillP, Doug and Denis,
I thank you all for your input. In phoning around this morning, I found none of the better known and respected dealers had a Black M6TTL in stock either in a .85 OR a .72. I do want to purchase one from a dealer with a storefront and a liberal, no questions asked , no re-stocking fee policy in the event I do not like the piece as opposed to buying one off *-Bay. However one dealer who I have dealt with in the past talked me into sending me a black .85 M6 Classic, "as new" in the box with everything except a warranty card. Along with this body he is sending me a 90 2.8 matching black Elmarit, a modern version made in Germany also in as new condition with caps, hood and box. He truly made me an offer I could not refuse on the package. And the best part is, I have 10 days to decide if I want to keep it and THEN I can pay him. That's right, he took no money from me yet, not even a credit card # !!!! So this guy is OK in my book. This person who has dealt in Leica as well as many other fine cameras for the past almost 50 years assured me that as an eyeglass wearer, the .85 version will not cause a problem with the 40mm Nokton, and it is definitely the preferred finder mag for the 90 Elmarit. So I will have it in 2 days (he gave me free shipping as well). I did prefer the TTL over the Classic, if not for anything else but the 3 LED metering, the on/off switch and the larger shutter dial. Flash I was not so concerned with. But I shall wait and see.
Since I had a few hundred left to burn from my original projected budget for this project, from the astounding offer Mr. H made me, and while I was in the negotiating mode this morning working the phones, I also did order a new CV 40mm 1.4 Nokton with LH-5 hood, as well a CV 21/4 Color Skopar w/M mount adapter and a dozen rolls of T-Max 400. So this completes my package.
I will post my user report in the near future with images.
Thanks everybody !
I thank you all for your input. In phoning around this morning, I found none of the better known and respected dealers had a Black M6TTL in stock either in a .85 OR a .72. I do want to purchase one from a dealer with a storefront and a liberal, no questions asked , no re-stocking fee policy in the event I do not like the piece as opposed to buying one off *-Bay. However one dealer who I have dealt with in the past talked me into sending me a black .85 M6 Classic, "as new" in the box with everything except a warranty card. Along with this body he is sending me a 90 2.8 matching black Elmarit, a modern version made in Germany also in as new condition with caps, hood and box. He truly made me an offer I could not refuse on the package. And the best part is, I have 10 days to decide if I want to keep it and THEN I can pay him. That's right, he took no money from me yet, not even a credit card # !!!! So this guy is OK in my book. This person who has dealt in Leica as well as many other fine cameras for the past almost 50 years assured me that as an eyeglass wearer, the .85 version will not cause a problem with the 40mm Nokton, and it is definitely the preferred finder mag for the 90 Elmarit. So I will have it in 2 days (he gave me free shipping as well). I did prefer the TTL over the Classic, if not for anything else but the 3 LED metering, the on/off switch and the larger shutter dial. Flash I was not so concerned with. But I shall wait and see.
Since I had a few hundred left to burn from my original projected budget for this project, from the astounding offer Mr. H made me, and while I was in the negotiating mode this morning working the phones, I also did order a new CV 40mm 1.4 Nokton with LH-5 hood, as well a CV 21/4 Color Skopar w/M mount adapter and a dozen rolls of T-Max 400. So this completes my package.
I will post my user report in the near future with images.
Thanks everybody !
Wow! Flamingo, I think you're in for a bunch of fun! That sounds like a great combination of gear. Why was it that you wanted to go Leica for the 90mm, while the Voigtlander 90 is only a half-stop slower? Not that I'm criticizing the choice (I like my Tele-Elmarit), but you chose Voigtlander for the other lenses...
flamingo
flamingo
I chose the 90 Elmarit strictly from the purist standpoint. I wanted one camera / lens combination that was totally German.
My wife was made in Germany, so I know they build things real nice over there I wanted a completely German made instrument for documenting slices of time.
My wife was made in Germany, so I know they build things real nice over there I wanted a completely German made instrument for documenting slices of time.