v3cron
Well-known
if you can stand 645, fuji used to make a fully manual, zone-focusing camera with a 45mm lens. i think it was called a gs645w or something like that. cheap.
i used to shoot the mamiya 6 w/ 50mm lens, and it is stunning. cheaper, sturdier, and more compact than the 7.
i used to shoot the mamiya 6 w/ 50mm lens, and it is stunning. cheaper, sturdier, and more compact than the 7.
Attachments
Terao
Kiloran
Sikario said:C'mon, where are the results?
Currently demonstrating about 30% front focus I think
Very 3D and microcontrasty compared to 35mm/digital. And I can't believe the fineness of the grain, even on boggo Fuji Superia ISO400 colour neg (all that was available for a test shoot)
Impressed with the camera, just need to get a formal test roll done to confirm the front focus and then get it adjusted
Terao
Kiloran
9 months on and the 7ii is up for sale. We have the War on Terror and airport hand luggage restrictions to account for its demise, it takes up too much space in the Lowepro. I've also found that the Coolscan 8000 doesn't play nice with 6x7 frames. To replace it I've bought a GA645 Pro. Now its actually not that much smaller, but the collapsible lens makes all the difference. AF is nice to have too. In fact its the only point and shoot camera I own, which makes me chuckle
Test roll from the 645 looked good, not quite the look that the 80mm on the 7ii gives but still "medium format". Having the ability to scan 4 frames at a time, and to get 32/33 shots from 220 is going to be very handy. I even like the portrait format.
Test roll from the 645 looked good, not quite the look that the 80mm on the 7ii gives but still "medium format". Having the ability to scan 4 frames at a time, and to get 32/33 shots from 220 is going to be very handy. I even like the portrait format.
keithwms
Established
Terao, you might consider a mamiya 6 or 6MF. It collapses nicely.
Not that I look down on the Fujis, they are great! Enjoy!
Regarding scanning, I think after you see a drum scan, it's very hard to compare to anything else. My approach now is, if a [colour] shot is really important then I will have it drummed. For $30/frame it's actually a bargain when you see what a good Aztek drum can do. I mean, photoshop schmotoshop, I usually don't have to touch the drum scans at all.
B&w I print traditionally, of course
N.b. I also really like the portait format of the Fujis, I really missed it when I recently started using the 645AFD, since there isn't even a vertical grip for it and it's a whole lot bulkier than those little fujis!
Not that I look down on the Fujis, they are great! Enjoy!
Regarding scanning, I think after you see a drum scan, it's very hard to compare to anything else. My approach now is, if a [colour] shot is really important then I will have it drummed. For $30/frame it's actually a bargain when you see what a good Aztek drum can do. I mean, photoshop schmotoshop, I usually don't have to touch the drum scans at all.
B&w I print traditionally, of course
N.b. I also really like the portait format of the Fujis, I really missed it when I recently started using the 645AFD, since there isn't even a vertical grip for it and it's a whole lot bulkier than those little fujis!
Terao
Kiloran
I take a lot of portrait format shots so its going to suit me once I get used to it, and yes those Mamiya SLRs are cumbersome...
W
Way
Guest
Sorry to see that you had to sell your M7II. My next MF camera would be one of the Fuiji 645s or 6x7 so it would be great to see some of your shots with the GA645. And the portrait orientation of the 645 interests me too.
I recently purchased from KEH a "bargain" grade Mamiya 6 outfit with 75/f3.5 lens and find that to be a great camera. One thing that I discovered is that the protruding lens of a camera the most cumbersome part of carrying a camera around and that took the Mamiya 7 out of the picture. Since I've discovered the old folders (I now have a Agafa Super Isolette 6x6 and a Bessa RF 6x9) that issue has disappeared. So the Mamiya 6 does have a collapsing lens and now my camera kit consists of the Leica MP or Zeiss Ikon with a 35 cron and the Mamiya 6. If I want to go smaller I can still take a 35mm RF and the Super Isolette. And even smaller kit (but even bigger negatives) would be the Super Isolette and the Bessa RF. This last combo is can easily fit into any small bag. Add a few rolls of film and a Gossen Digisix meter and I'm good to go. I've also been trying to work on my Sunny 16 technique and I gotta say that I haven't missed an exposure (outdoors) using it since.
Posts some pics!
I recently purchased from KEH a "bargain" grade Mamiya 6 outfit with 75/f3.5 lens and find that to be a great camera. One thing that I discovered is that the protruding lens of a camera the most cumbersome part of carrying a camera around and that took the Mamiya 7 out of the picture. Since I've discovered the old folders (I now have a Agafa Super Isolette 6x6 and a Bessa RF 6x9) that issue has disappeared. So the Mamiya 6 does have a collapsing lens and now my camera kit consists of the Leica MP or Zeiss Ikon with a 35 cron and the Mamiya 6. If I want to go smaller I can still take a 35mm RF and the Super Isolette. And even smaller kit (but even bigger negatives) would be the Super Isolette and the Bessa RF. This last combo is can easily fit into any small bag. Add a few rolls of film and a Gossen Digisix meter and I'm good to go. I've also been trying to work on my Sunny 16 technique and I gotta say that I haven't missed an exposure (outdoors) using it since.
Posts some pics!
Terao
Kiloran
@Way
I guess the new Fuji folder if it appears will be a dream second body for a lot of people. Have always fancied playing with a classic folder but am put off by the usability. Also getting more confident/accurate with Sunny16 so maybe later. The shots I've seen from the GA645 lack a little something, certainly don't have the signature of a say a YashicaMat or Rollei or Hasselblad but I hope to be proven wrong. I'm going on holiday on Wednesday so its going to get extensive use. Will also be my first holiday for years where I don't shoot any digital, the R-D1 is staying on the shelf. Have Kodachrome, Velvia, some expired Agfa RSX, assorted Fuji B&W and a single roll of SPUR Agfa Copex to play with, excited
I guess the new Fuji folder if it appears will be a dream second body for a lot of people. Have always fancied playing with a classic folder but am put off by the usability. Also getting more confident/accurate with Sunny16 so maybe later. The shots I've seen from the GA645 lack a little something, certainly don't have the signature of a say a YashicaMat or Rollei or Hasselblad but I hope to be proven wrong. I'm going on holiday on Wednesday so its going to get extensive use. Will also be my first holiday for years where I don't shoot any digital, the R-D1 is staying on the shelf. Have Kodachrome, Velvia, some expired Agfa RSX, assorted Fuji B&W and a single roll of SPUR Agfa Copex to play with, excited
Steve_F
Well-known
Which Modern MF RF too.....
Which Modern MF RF too.....
Hello All,
I've been reading this thread with some interest. Currently I own a Nikon FM3A and a Mamiya RZ67II. The dilema I have is that I love the flexibilty of the Nikon (and also the quality) but as soon as I look at the 6x7 negs I realise that I need a 67 for street-style photography. The RZ is abit obtrusive to say the least. I have narrowed it down to a Mamiya 7II or one of the Fuji 670's RF. I am unlikely to need keep changing lens which takes me in the direction of the Fuji. Now I had forgotten all about the Fuji 690!!. This would mean a new enlarger head and bigger lens for the enlarger (more expense).
It seems that the Fuji 670 has it, now just one tiny question......
What are the differences in focal length on the models; wasn't there a 'wide' and 'super-wide'?
Many thanks,
Regards
Stephen Fell.
PS. Or maybe I should wait for the new Fuji 670 folder....grrrr
Which Modern MF RF too.....
Hello All,
I've been reading this thread with some interest. Currently I own a Nikon FM3A and a Mamiya RZ67II. The dilema I have is that I love the flexibilty of the Nikon (and also the quality) but as soon as I look at the 6x7 negs I realise that I need a 67 for street-style photography. The RZ is abit obtrusive to say the least. I have narrowed it down to a Mamiya 7II or one of the Fuji 670's RF. I am unlikely to need keep changing lens which takes me in the direction of the Fuji. Now I had forgotten all about the Fuji 690!!. This would mean a new enlarger head and bigger lens for the enlarger (more expense).
It seems that the Fuji 670 has it, now just one tiny question......
What are the differences in focal length on the models; wasn't there a 'wide' and 'super-wide'?
Many thanks,
Regards
Stephen Fell.
PS. Or maybe I should wait for the new Fuji 670 folder....grrrr
Terao
Kiloran
Steve, I've just put my Mamiya 7ii in the classifieds...
keithwms
Established
Steve, you might consider a 645 SLR for street stuff. The main drawback of the MF RFs is that the lenses are not very fast at all, which becomes a problem if you are interested in available light work or isolation by DOF. Don't get me wrong, I think the MF RFs haul a*s when it comes to scenic/documentary stuff, but... recently I went out with a mamiya 645AFD to a club and shot with the 80/1.9 and... oh yeah, big difference in what you can do with the light you have. Really nice results even with Fuji pro z pushed two stops and delta 3200, almost no grain in 645. And the 645 negs/chromes are quite a thing. Not 6x7 and certainly not as quiet as a leica or hexar AF but the camera is totally handholdable and appropriate for impromptu available light street shooting.
Just to give you something else to think about
I also had two of the fuji fixed lens RFs, the ga645Zi (the zooming one) and the ga645W (very nice wide), loved them both. But again the lenses are a tad slow. I recall there was a fuji fixed lens 45mm f/4 that is quite nice but I can't remember the model, maybe it was ga645w or something like that. But f/4 is also pretty slow.
I use a mamiya 6 and love it, and there is the 75mm f/3.5 lens for that. But let me be honest, the thing is not so good for available light or isolating a subject by DOF, the lens would need to be at least a stop faster for that.
I guess I am saying, you might let the glass guide you to the body. I mean, you see all kinds of silly discussions about mamiya 7 versus leica... I'd say just think about the focal lengths and apertures you need and let that steer you to the camera(s) that is(are) appropriate.
Just to give you something else to think about
I also had two of the fuji fixed lens RFs, the ga645Zi (the zooming one) and the ga645W (very nice wide), loved them both. But again the lenses are a tad slow. I recall there was a fuji fixed lens 45mm f/4 that is quite nice but I can't remember the model, maybe it was ga645w or something like that. But f/4 is also pretty slow.
I use a mamiya 6 and love it, and there is the 75mm f/3.5 lens for that. But let me be honest, the thing is not so good for available light or isolating a subject by DOF, the lens would need to be at least a stop faster for that.
I guess I am saying, you might let the glass guide you to the body. I mean, you see all kinds of silly discussions about mamiya 7 versus leica... I'd say just think about the focal lengths and apertures you need and let that steer you to the camera(s) that is(are) appropriate.
vdonovan
Vince Donovan
Great thread, especially since I'm considering the same thing, a lightweight medium format RF. An important consideration for me is that I shoot a lot of portraits and I like using a portrait lens, a 150 or 180. This rules out pretty much all the Fujis for me with their fixed wide lenses. It seems to leave only the Mamiya 6/7. Is there another interchangeable lens MF RF?
keithwms
Established
Vince, there is also the plaubel makina with a Nikkor 80/2.8, but good luck finding it!
There is also the Koni omega Rapid M...
Then there are the RF-coupled graphics, on which you can put roll film backs.
Then there are the older folders.
Consider, also, the 645s.
But note that very few of the MF RFs have the combination of longish lenses and lens speed that you typically want for portraiture.
There is also the Koni omega Rapid M...
Then there are the RF-coupled graphics, on which you can put roll film backs.
Then there are the older folders.
Consider, also, the 645s.
But note that very few of the MF RFs have the combination of longish lenses and lens speed that you typically want for portraiture.
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Terao
Kiloran
Don't forget the Bronica RF645. Portrait orientation. The portrait lens is rarish and expensive though.
Terao
Kiloran
Well, I've finally got all my MF holiday shots back and scanned and I'm completely sold on the format for the first time. The GA645 is so easy to use its basically a high-end large neg point & shoot. So much so I've bought a GA645zi to complement it
Has turned out to be truly exceptional for landscapes and I've got some beautiful shots from a recent big family event that I really love. I also love the flexibility to crop, that lens is properly sharp and AF seems to be good once you adjust to its quirks.
Ultimately highly-recommended for anyone who fancies dabbling in medium format - easy to use (nearly foolproof) and great results...
Has turned out to be truly exceptional for landscapes and I've got some beautiful shots from a recent big family event that I really love. I also love the flexibility to crop, that lens is properly sharp and AF seems to be good once you adjust to its quirks.
Ultimately highly-recommended for anyone who fancies dabbling in medium format - easy to use (nearly foolproof) and great results...
oftheherd
Veteran
I didn't look to see if I have commented on the Mamiya Universal/Super Press 23 before in this thread, but I certainly have in many other threads. I have done nice portraiture with the 100mm f/3.5. At least I liked it. YMMV. I have and prefer the Super Press 23 because it does everything the Universal does except Polaroid, and unlike the Universal, it has a bellows back.
There are frame lines for 100/150/250 in the viewfinder, and wide 65mm and 50mm with aux viewfinders. You can purchase extention tubes and cut film backs and holders if you are into that. The 150mm (75mm equivalent), and the 250mm (135mm equivalent) would make great portrait lenses if you don't want to try the 100mm.
It is a little big, but it is after all a 6x7 (645 to 6x9 with different film holders, but I don't do that myself). But I find it surprisingly 35mm like in handling as the film backs (with the mult-format exception), all have a wind crank like 35mm cameras.
I think the 65mm, as it is quite small, would make a good street camera/lens combo. I can't swear to that as I am not into that genre.
At least work a look on your part I think.
Riemann
Newbie
Steve, you might consider a 645 SLR for street stuff. The main drawback of the MF RFs is that the lenses are not very fast at all, which becomes a problem if you are interested in available light work or isolation by DOF. Don't get me wrong, I think the MF RFs haul a*s when it comes to scenic/documentary stuff, but... recently I went out with a mamiya 645AFD to a club and shot with the 80/1.9 and... oh yeah, big difference in what you can do with the light you have. Really nice results even with Fuji pro z pushed two stops and delta 3200, almost no grain in 645. And the 645 negs/chromes are quite a thing. Not 6x7 and certainly not as quiet as a leica or hexar AF but the camera is totally handholdable and appropriate for impromptu available light street shooting.
Just to give you something else to think about
I also had two of the fuji fixed lens RFs, the ga645Zi (the zooming one) and the ga645W (very nice wide), loved them both. But again the lenses are a tad slow. I recall there was a fuji fixed lens 45mm f/4 that is quite nice but I can't remember the model, maybe it was ga645w or something like that. But f/4 is also pretty slow.
I use a mamiya 6 and love it, and there is the 75mm f/3.5 lens for that. But let me be honest, the thing is not so good for available light or isolating a subject by DOF, the lens would need to be at least a stop faster for that.
I guess I am saying, you might let the glass guide you to the body. I mean, you see all kinds of silly discussions about mamiya 7 versus leica... I'd say just think about the focal lengths and apertures you need and let that steer you to the camera(s) that is(are) appropriate.
Whats the difference between street and documentary? And why do you need more than f/stop 4 for street, I don't get it. If you want that grainy 70's Bruce davidson look like etc, then buy a Leica and and a roll of Tri-X. Also keep in mind that leafshutters can be hand held at around 1/15 with decent result, you can't do that with SLRs.
kuzano
Veteran
I vote the GA645Zi based on all your points...
I vote the GA645Zi based on all your points...
But be very picky.. There is an abundance of them ..... Always 3-4 at any time on eBay, plus other sources. Nice examples selling at very reasonable prices. Very (VERY) sharp, flare resistant lens, superb metering. A Good one is so quiet, you can't hear the shutter, but know the shot is taken when you hear the whir of the wind-on. Be careful on noisy zoom... that's the excessive wear sign on a Zi. Has shutter actuation count available. I have had them with 6500 and 8000 actuations and going strong.
I vote the GA645Zi based on all your points...
But be very picky.. There is an abundance of them ..... Always 3-4 at any time on eBay, plus other sources. Nice examples selling at very reasonable prices. Very (VERY) sharp, flare resistant lens, superb metering. A Good one is so quiet, you can't hear the shutter, but know the shot is taken when you hear the whir of the wind-on. Be careful on noisy zoom... that's the excessive wear sign on a Zi. Has shutter actuation count available. I have had them with 6500 and 8000 actuations and going strong.
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pevelg
Well-known
But at what focal length? I am acquiring a Mamiya 7ii for this summer with the 65mm. I use the reciprocal rule in selecting shutter speeds (1/focal length, thus my 35mm I will shoot at 1/30). Then again, I have yet to get a blury shot with my 90mm Elmar hand held at 1/50 (flash sync). Basically what I am asking is at what focal lengths would I be able to shoot at 1/15 of a sec. on the Mamiya? It is improtant due to slow lenses.
Riemann
Newbie
If your subject is not moivng and your'e not, then 1/15 at 80mm is possible. I haven't used other lenses on my camera. If you mean sharp pics at 1/50 with flash, its probably the flash 'drawing' the sharp image and not he shutter speed.