Who knows a lot about Moskva cameras?

[raid]

I have a Moskva-5 camera that somehow came with the Industrar 23 lens, which is a 110mm/4.5. It should have been the Industrar 24 lens, a 105mm/3.5. The question is whether KMZ built some early Moskva-5 cameras with 110mm lenses or not. The Moskva-4 came regularly with a 110mm/4.5 lens. The shutter on my Moskva-5 is a Moment 24C, as it should be.

The camera was built in 1956,making it an early Moskva-5 model.

Raid

 

[cacs88]

What is the year of your Moskva-5? Of the Moment 24C, and of the lens?

There's an example on ebay of a '58 Moskva-5 with a '56 I-23, but the shutter is a Moment 23: item 320133284153. Ignore his text about the lens being an I-24; look at the pictures.

henry

 

[raid]

What is the year of your Moskva-5? Of the Moment 24C, and of the lens?

There's an example on ebay of a '58 Moskva-5 with a '56 I-23, but the shutter is a Moment 23: item 320133284153. Ignore his text about the lens being an I-24; look at the pictures.

henry

Henry,
Yes, the ebay camera is similar to mine, but the ebay camera is a 1958 model whereas mine is a 1959 model. The shutter on my camera is Moment 24C.
The lens is a 53xxxxx and the shutter a 59xxxxx, making the shutter a 1959 make and the lens a 1953 make. Seeing a similar Moskva-5 suggests to me that maybe KMZ made such cameras with the older lenses. Do you agree?

Raid

 

[cacs88]

I'm not really that knowledgeable about Soviet manufacturing processes. But, a 1953 lens on a '59 body (with a '59 shutter) seems unlikely to be from the factory. KMZ started the Moskva 5's in 1956 with the I-24 right from the start (I think).

Most Moskva 4's prior to 1956 (with the old viewfinders) have I-23 lenses where the serial no. has the yy***** format. Most I-24 lenses do not have that format (more like: 00*****). As you probably know, there's a transitional Moskva-4 with the new top (without the flip-up viewfinder). I've seen a picture of one such body where the shutter is a Moment 23 with an I-23. But, interestingly, that I-23 does not have the yy***** format serial number. The serial number is more like that of the I-24 (000****).

Maybe someone replaced a lens at some point? To me that's not necessarily a bad thing; at least it showed that somebody cared enough to make it work. Of course, it's possible that they found a cache of I-23's...

Either way, enjoy your Moskva 5!

henry

 

[raid]

I'm not really that knowledgeable about Soviet manufacturing processes. But, a 1953 lens on a '59 body (with a '59 shutter) seems unlikely to be from the factory. KMZ started the Moskva 5's in 1956 with the I-24 right from the start (I think).

Most Moskva 4's prior to 1956 (with the old viewfinders) have I-23 lenses where the serial no. has the yy***** format. Most I-24 lenses do not have that format (more like: 00*****). As you probably know, there's a transitional Moskva-4 with the new top (without the flip-up viewfinder). I've seen a picture of one such body where the shutter is a Moment 23 with an I-23. But, interestingly, that I-23 does not have the yy***** format serial number. The serial number is more like that of the I-24 (000****).

Maybe someone replaced a lens at some point? To me that's not necessarily a bad thing; at least it showed that somebody cared enough to make it work. Of course, it's possible that they found a cache of I-23's...

Either way, enjoy your Moskva 5!

henry

Thank you, Henry. You right; I will just use this camera and enjoy it for what it is.

Raid

 

[varjag]

Some hardcore Moskva shooters claimed that I-23 is a bit sharper lens than (faster) I-24. True or not, this is a popular opinion; could be enough to prompt someone adapting it to the overall better body of model 5.

 

[Spider67]

When I brought my first Moskva III back to the shop for control because the aperture blades had a weird pattern, the guy took it and started to repair and instantly started to cannibalize other Moskvas (some 5's and others) in order to get it in order. So it could have been a similar repair job. It would be intersting to see the results!

 

[raid]

I bet that this is what happened to my camera too.
I have completed two rolls of film the past two days, and I will post some results once I get the rolls developed and scanned.

Raid

 

[fidget]

Wouldn't a change to a 110mm lens in the same mount as a 105mm lens cause some focus problems?

 

[raid]

Yes, it would, unless some extra shimming is added.

 

[raid]

The images came out sharp with my Moskva_5 camera. So the lens is slower, but that's OK.


Raid

 

[napchop]

It's likely someone just changed the lense at sometime. I have a Moskow 5 with a Zeiss lens and compur shutter that someone added. Also my Moskow 3 has a Moskow 2 lens and rangefinder stuck on it. Shims arn't neccesary for changing the lens from 10,5cm to 11cm, I tried it and akll remained sharp and good.

 

[literiter]

I have seen the camera named: Moskva, Moscou, Mockba, and Moscow. A rose by any other name would smell as sweet.

The f4.5 lens may be the better of the two, as the f3.5 seems to be a little softer at the edges than the f4.5. I have both, as well a Super Ikonta C with a coated f3.5 lens. The Ikonta lens is allegedly the superior lens but I cannot tell the difference.

The camera looks almost identical to the Super Ikonta C (531/2) and if you will examine the history of the two cameras the Moscow 2, 4 and 5 are closely related. I feel the Moscow cameras are great performers. The Moscow 5 and (later) 4 have more useable finders than the 2 and early 4.

Furthur:
-The Moscows do not have the dreaded Albada finders of the Ikontas.
-As of today a nice Moscow 4 or 5 can be had for a paultry $75.00 or so, a Super Ikonta C perhaps $400 to $500.
-I think that the "Moment" shutter is as good as the "Compur". Moment shutters are very strong and well built.
-The lenses on both cameras are suprisingly good. Equally good I'd say when stopped down to f8 or f11.

 

[murrayatuptown]

Check out the johndesq Dutch M5 site - full of info & interesting things.

 

[raid]

What is the link to that site?

 

[murrayatuptown]

http://www.johndesq.com/moskva5/

for the obvious content.

I haven't looked at the rest
http://www.johndesq.com/

It's a very dynamic script-driven site, I had a few problems with it with my uptight security software trying to block every link (my problem, not John's), but good content.

Murray