bwcolor
Veteran
OK, when I don't want to do Sunny 16 and I'm shooting my M3/M4, I'll bring an incident meter.
I can understand bringing a spot meter when shooting a camera with a good internal meter, but I don't get bringing an incident meter when you have a perfectly good reflectance/incident meter in camera.
So, why do you also bring an incident meter?
I can understand bringing a spot meter when shooting a camera with a good internal meter, but I don't get bringing an incident meter when you have a perfectly good reflectance/incident meter in camera.
So, why do you also bring an incident meter?
Roger Hicks
Veteran
Incident = exposure keyed to highlights.
True spot = exposure keyed to shadows.
In-camera meter = exposure keyed to nothing in particular.
Cheers.
R.
True spot = exposure keyed to shadows.
In-camera meter = exposure keyed to nothing in particular.
Cheers.
R.
Robert Lai
Well-known
As Roger says!
I shoot slides, so I find an incident meter invaluable. Shadows have to be lightened up with fill flash. I carry the incident meter even with cameras such as my Nikon F3, which has a decent meter.
I shoot slides, so I find an incident meter invaluable. Shadows have to be lightened up with fill flash. I carry the incident meter even with cameras such as my Nikon F3, which has a decent meter.
sevo
Fokutorendaburando
I use it whenever I shoot slide, and for negative as well whenever hitting the highlights or mid tones is more critical than the shadows. Otherwise, the spot meter must come along.
bwcolor
Veteran
So, when I compare my two incident meters to the palm of my hand metered via my internal meter, I find that I need to open up one stop on my internally metered reading. So, incident meter reads f/5.6 @ 1/125 sec. My hand will always read f/8.0 @ 1/125 through my M6TTL when my hand faces the same direction at the same spot as the incident meter.
So, why carry an incident meter when you have an internal meter?
So, why carry an incident meter when you have an internal meter?
sacundim
Newbie
You're mixing up meter types.
You're mixing up meter types.
Your camera's internal meter is not incident. It's a reflective meter. It measures the light that's reflected off your subject.
An incident meter is one that measures the light that *falls* on your subject, and is necessarily external. You use it by taking it to your subject and pointing it back to the camera, ideally. If you can't do this (e.g., you're taking a photo of Mt. Everest from below, and can't wait for your assistant to climb it and cell you back with the incident meter reading), then you take the reading in "the same light" as the subject; i.e., you put your meter somewhere that's illuminated exactly like your subject, and point it back to the camera.
Incident meters are not fooled by subject tones; they give the same reading for a light subject as for a dark one. That's their advantage. Their disadvantage is the whole meter-at-the-subject thing I explained above.
You'd take an external incident meter along with a metered camera if you wanted to use incident metering. The enormously more popular alternative there is to use the camera's meter and guess the correct exposure compensation for subjects that require or benefit from it. And with digital, of course, you can take test a test shot and then adjust the exposure using the histogram.
You're mixing up meter types.
Your camera's internal meter is not incident. It's a reflective meter. It measures the light that's reflected off your subject.
An incident meter is one that measures the light that *falls* on your subject, and is necessarily external. You use it by taking it to your subject and pointing it back to the camera, ideally. If you can't do this (e.g., you're taking a photo of Mt. Everest from below, and can't wait for your assistant to climb it and cell you back with the incident meter reading), then you take the reading in "the same light" as the subject; i.e., you put your meter somewhere that's illuminated exactly like your subject, and point it back to the camera.
Incident meters are not fooled by subject tones; they give the same reading for a light subject as for a dark one. That's their advantage. Their disadvantage is the whole meter-at-the-subject thing I explained above.
You'd take an external incident meter along with a metered camera if you wanted to use incident metering. The enormously more popular alternative there is to use the camera's meter and guess the correct exposure compensation for subjects that require or benefit from it. And with digital, of course, you can take test a test shot and then adjust the exposure using the histogram.
Roger Hicks
Veteran
If you do a consistent reading off a consistent reflector, no reason, except that many people find it easier.
Cheers,
R.
Cheers,
R.
Roberto V.
Le surrèalisme, c'est moi
I only use it with my M4 and my Zeiss Contaflex I, both of which have no meter. Sometimes I don't even use a meter, but when I'm shooting anything 'serious' I'll bring it along.
Sparrow
Veteran
Like a grey card? ... I'll get my coat now
P. S. you answered your own question in statement No 3 "In-camera meter = exposure keyed to nothing in particular." all reflective metres involve a k value that's different for each manufacturer
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FrankS
Registered User
If the camera I'm carrying has a built in meter, I won't also be taking along an incident meter. B+W negative film is forgiving of exposure variances and besides, there is no such thing as the "right" exposure anyway. I'm not overly fussy about exposure. I understand though that some photographers are, and that's fine if it works for them.
Roger Hicks
Veteran
Dear Stewart,
Grey coat?
The great thing about a proper incident light reading is that it's nothing like as critical where you point it, except for side-lighting. A few degrees different with a grey card, and there's a stop different...
Cheers,
R.
Sparrow
Veteran
So last year!
You know perfectly well any meter we plebs have access to is at best a comparator, not an absolute reading, and that the reading needs thought after taking it anyway
A grey card, or the tan fabric on my bag will do equally well, as will the palm of my hand. However an incident reading is a lot quicker; no?
P.S. I'm not to a stop or two
Mablo
Well-known
Words of wisdom.
ironhorse
Joe DuPont
I am just beginning to use an incident meter since I purchased an M3. It is surprising to find the difference between it and a reflective meter to be up to 3 stops.
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Sparrow
Veteran
That's because the manufacturer has to consider what the average amateur is pointing it at, and they generally seen to go for a caucasian skin tone so they all read off by a stop or two.
Roger doesn't agree but to me but I believe the reflective meters are set to put white skin in zone 6 or 7, which is fine unless one has a black subject in say zone 4, maybe
An incident meter however will ignore the subject's tone and measure the light itself.
Pickett Wilson
Veteran
I use an incident meter with everything, digital, film, slr, RF, doesn't matter. For most everything. Unless I can't get the meter in the same light as the subject, when I'll use a spot meter. Rarely use the meter in the camera.
Instantclassic
Hans
I support the idea of carrying an external meter in addition to the built in guesstimation meter...
Darshan
Well-known
I use the incident meter with my M4. Now I am so used to it that I might use it even with my metered cameras, as it takes me more time to use exp comp if I am trying to meter the scene correctly.
Before I had the incident meter, I didn't believe it would be so fast to use it.
Before I had the incident meter, I didn't believe it would be so fast to use it.
bwcolor
Veteran
Calibrate your hand to an incident meter with a specific camera and you won't need to carry that incident meter. I find it easier than taking an incident reading and then transferring it. Of course, you then might want to modify your results based upon lighting and desired outcome. No need to carry an incident and in camera meter. Meter off your hand and you will have the same results.
OK, that was my favorite shooting tip.
OK, that was my favorite shooting tip.
Ronald M
Veteran
Portraits, still life, landscapes, incident works best.
Spot meter also always works if you have the time to measure shadows, highlights, make sure there is not too big a spread, then figure where the shadows/highlight go depending on neg or positive film. It requires some expertice , but once you learn, you never miss.
Incident is perfect if you can get the meter in same light intensity as subject.
In camera reflected is a wild guess. You never know exactly what it is metering and the percentage reflectance of it that you must take into account. In manufacturing, we called it WAG, wild ass guess.
I have 4 digi Nikons, D40,200, 700, D3 and they brag about their color matrix and all the rest. I think they suck. All four of them. I set them to 1/640, F8, ISO 200 and shoot away in manual in sunlight. Every shot perfect seriously. I got better exposure from M6 Leicas and R6 and R7 Leica R. I have hundreds of contact sheets with 36 perfect exposure all from Leica. Beautiful cameras.
Spot meter also always works if you have the time to measure shadows, highlights, make sure there is not too big a spread, then figure where the shadows/highlight go depending on neg or positive film. It requires some expertice , but once you learn, you never miss.
Incident is perfect if you can get the meter in same light intensity as subject.
In camera reflected is a wild guess. You never know exactly what it is metering and the percentage reflectance of it that you must take into account. In manufacturing, we called it WAG, wild ass guess.
I have 4 digi Nikons, D40,200, 700, D3 and they brag about their color matrix and all the rest. I think they suck. All four of them. I set them to 1/640, F8, ISO 200 and shoot away in manual in sunlight. Every shot perfect seriously. I got better exposure from M6 Leicas and R6 and R7 Leica R. I have hundreds of contact sheets with 36 perfect exposure all from Leica. Beautiful cameras.