why is gear talk more popular than photo talk?

seany65 said:
A few further thoughts:

Unless we take pictures just as a record, then whether we realise it or intend it or not, each photo is 'art' to some degree as it's a form of self expression about what we take a photo of...
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Interesting; I would have said that art is public and photo's are private. Mostly because "art" goes on walls to show and impress and photographs are mainly private for family and friends' consumption.

That doesn't mean that art can't be a photo but I'd never have any spare time if every photo was intended as art. And, obviously, not all photo's are private, some go to other people to show them something.

As for commenting, I've noticed that some comments can create problems especially about gear. So you get newcomers worried that they haven't got a 54 megapixel camera with an f/1 lens and a top shutter speed of 1/16000 and ISO 64000 as well...

Regards, David
 
I dislike when someone says of my craft, that I am making art. I don't call it art, and I am intentionally not making art. I am interested in the craft of making a good guitar. It is about the "thing" not what you do with the thing.
If someone wants to make art with them, a song or performance, that is them, not me.

Same with photography. If I want to own some cameras, hold them, unscrew them, clean them, work them over, maybe even load them with film and shoot some pictures and develop them, none of it is art.
I enjoy it immensely.
 
I got deeper into photography during the years when I was in Graduate School in Virginia. I needed the relaxation to relieve the stress from course work and from research. I had then a Canon AE1 with the 50/1.8 FD lens. There was no "art" in sight! I enjoyed a lot hiking in the Blue Ridge Parkway and around Blacksburg (Virginia), always having my AE1 with me. It was and still is a very personal issue for me. I decide what I like doing and what I don't like doing in photography. It should be this way.
 
This makes perfect sense to me!

This makes perfect sense to me!

raid said:
I got deeper into photography during the years when I was in Graduate School in Virginia. I needed the relaxation to relieve the stress from course work and from research. I had then a Canon AE1 with the 50/1.8 FD lens. There was no "art" in sight! I enjoyed a lot hiking in the Blue Ridge Parkway and around Blacksburg (Virginia), always having my AE1 with me. It was and still is a very personal issue for me. I decide what I like doing and what I don't like doing in photography. It should be this way.
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Dear Raid,

I agree with this 100%. Like yourself, and more than a few other people who commented on this post, I photograph what I enjoy and let the chips fall where they may.

Every so often this blind hog finds an acorn or two in his pictures, but that isn't, and likely never will be, the reason I carry and use a camera. I simply like to record stuff for memories sake.

Regards,

Tim Murphy

Harrisburg, PA :)
 
going a little off topic, but are the things you do to get better at craft different from the things you do to get better at art?

some would say craft requires more technical skill, though that's only the case sometimes. others would say art depends more on historical knowledge, but again, that's not universal.

could that be one reason why gear talk is more popular than art talk? people are less interested in history? i don't know. gearheads know an awful lot about camera history.
 
You use terms like art and craft?

You use terms like art and craft?

aizan said:
going a little off topic, but are the things you do to get better at craft different from the things you do to get better at art?

some would say craft requires more technical skill, though that's only the case sometimes. others would say art depends more on historical knowledge, but again, that's not universal.

could that be one reason why gear talk is more popular than art talk? people are less interested in history? i don't know. gearheads know an awful lot about camera history.
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Dear aizan,

In truth, isn't it entirely dependent on the viewer to qualify something as art, or craft?

I see many technically perfect pictures with wonderful balanced tones and/or colors, perfect exposure, excellent composition elements, great use of depth of field to isolate the subject, the list could go on, but many of those pictures are simply boring and uninteresting to me.

In my mind a photo, or a piece of art, or dare I say a craft needs to elicit a positive response from the viewer. And by positive response I don't necessarily mean the viewer has to love it, but the object at least has to make the viewer pause and think, even if it is a difficult thing about which to think.

I see photos posted daily here and elsewhere that some people like, and that I don't. If I were to offer any critique of those photos I'm fairly certain it wouldn't be well received. What I'm not certain of is whether it would be viewed as invalid?

To me, there is no foolproof infallible guide to successful photography and people who think there is drive more people away from the pursuit than they will ever attract.

Other people think differently of course, so why not just let things play out however they play out instead of trying to foist a POV on people?

To end I think it's fair to say, like what you like but don't expect everyone else to agree otherwise you'll be in for a long arduous and unfulfilling haul.

Regards,

Tim Murphy

Harrisburg, PA :)
 
Bob Michaels said:
pkr: if we were in a bar, I'd buy you a beer. Then I'd buy you another. Thanks.
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Hi Bob;

Thanks.. and, if we were in a bar, with the light outdoors bad for photography, and hours to spend, we would have much to discuss. Your complement is taken to hart. I admire you for your choice of projects and your tenacity; something that many creative people lack.... Your ability to "follow through" with important work, that will out live you by decades.

The camera has the ability to capture a brief slice in the river of time. Today, with our quickly changing global political landscape, these pictorial slices of time become highly valuable (and much more palatable because of their Art). This documentation, will help to determine what made some cultures (politics aside) better than others.


Please find some institution that will archive and show your work.

Don't take my comment as obligatory. Finding a suitable trustworthy place is difficult. I'm going through this currently. I can't afford the extensive legal frees to do it correctly. I only wish I'd asked Jim Marshall about this before he died; it seems he did it correctly.

Best, pkr
 
Hi,

Surely you need the craftsman's knowledge to get the picture how you want it but art might, or might not, make people go "wow" and so on?

Regards, David

PS OTOH; "Pictures of perfection as you know make me sick and wicked." Jane Austen Letter dd 23rd March 1817.
 
No matter what you enjoy doing, the biggest mistake you can probably make is getting hung up on how to define it. Art or craft? The question itself is pointless and does nothing for you, the creator, but distract from satisfying your need to create. Let the people that don't create deal with the definitions. And when they do, ignore them.
 
Peter Jennings said:
No matter what you enjoy doing, the biggest mistake you can probably make is getting hung up on how to define it. Art or craft? The question itself is pointless and does nothing for you, the creator, but distract from satisfying your need to create. Let the people that don't create deal with the definitions. And when they do, ignore them.
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The handy thing is that definitions already exist; there is no reason to create them, and to argue about them is pointless.
 
David Hughes said:
Hi,

Surely you need the craftsman's knowledge to get the picture how you want it but art might, or might not, make people go "wow" and so on?

Regards, David

PS OTOH; "Pictures of perfection as you know make me sick and wicked." Jane Austen Letter dd 23rd March 1817.
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This.

I think that craft is the means to execute or create art.

Vision + Craft = Art.

When we look at a painting or sculpture, we tend to recognize it as art, whether we like it or not. Indeed, there is good art and bad art, successful art and unsuccessful art. We can apply this principle to photography, as well, rather than declare it art only if it is successful.

- Murray
 
Please don't get me wrong, I love art, especially the kind that I prefer, and I think it is nuts trying to define it.
I think art is hard to make, and I choose not to take the time to make it.
Craft is much easier, and I can do it over and over, mostly with success.
 
PKR said:
This thread has been dead for a couple of days now. This post may get a comment or two? But, the fact remains that, the premise was correct.. gear vs making imagery.

I picked this one as an example of the primary vector of this forum:
https://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=163787

QED

best, pkr
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it's correct only for those seeking judgement on how others engage in their hobby or profession.
i think this thread is an abomination of judgement on others.
i love gear and i love using it and creating 'my' art.
gear is easy to chat about while images are harder...harder because it hits the heart way more than when our gear choices are judged.
 
Isn't RFF wonderful?

A swirling parfait of gear, art, craft, inspiration, humor, advice, instruction, feedback, and people.
 
back alley said:
it's correct only for those seeking judgement on how others engage in their hobby or profession.
i think this thread is an abomination of judgement on others.
i love gear and i love using it and creating 'my' art.
gear is easy to chat about while images are harder...harder because it hits the heart way more than when our gear choices are judged.
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Joe, the threads I've been involved in had nothing to do with judging a photo. They were about how to properly light an image to one's taste; the use of tripods for image stability, things like that. Few were interested, as you know.

Art has to do with personal taste. In most instances, there is no good and bad. I've seen what I though to be some pretty bad photos sell for a lot of money and hang in museums. So, it's just my taste. But, talking about how to make a presentable photo is of little interest here from my experience. If the discussion is about which one of a number of 35mm Summicrons is best for impressing others, it finds a huge following here.

Gotta go now. I've got to get back to photographing my watches and fountain pens..

pkr
 
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