bwcolor
Veteran
I just ordered and then cancelled a ViewSonic VP2770-LED 27 monitor which advertises a billion colors and 10 bit, but is in reality a very good 8 bit monitor with 78% Adobe RGB and factory calibrated sRGB out of the box. My old LaCie Electron22BlueIV is limping along and I need to buy a new monitor. I've been color calibrating from monitor to a Canon Pro9500 printer.
So, given the limitations of web display (sRGB) and my printer, is it really worth the extra money spent to get an Eizo, or high end NEC 10bit monitor, or is the practical solution to stay with a solid monitor with 8 bit panel, good firmware and electronics... ie stable, no flicker and fairly uniform screen brightness?
So, given the limitations of web display (sRGB) and my printer, is it really worth the extra money spent to get an Eizo, or high end NEC 10bit monitor, or is the practical solution to stay with a solid monitor with 8 bit panel, good firmware and electronics... ie stable, no flicker and fairly uniform screen brightness?
denizg7
Well-known
if you're rich buy the best
bwcolor
Veteran
The 27" NEC with close to 100% Adobe RGB can be found for under $1000, but it is not LED backlit. The above mentioned ViewSonic is LED based, but 78% and both seem like good monitors in other respects. The difference is $150-$200 and fluorescent vs LED backlit. If I were rich, I wouldn't be using an ancient LaCie. Rich is good. Almost forgot.. the LED uses 1/3 of the energy.
Ranchu
Veteran
No, it is not. What matters most is that the monitor has neutral black grey white.
Chriscrawfordphoto
Real Men Shoot Film.
Yes it is worth it. I have an NEC PA241W with Spectraview. If you do get one of the high-end graphics monitors, make sure you get the manufacturer's calibration tool and software. My NEC does not calibrate well with third-party software.
Here's the deal. LCDs suck for graphics or photo work. Most do not have the color accuracy, or ability to be accurately calibrated that even relatively inexpensive CRT screens had. If you print your work and want the prints to match the screen, this stuff is essential. The NEC Spectraview screens are expensive, but they are accurate and they calibrate perfectly with the Spectraview software and colorimeter. Just because your photos look 'good' on the screen does not mean the screen is good or accurate...as you'll find when you print them.
As far as the Adobe RGB capability, I think it is worth it too. sRGB screens cannot accurately display the color gamut that is in the files from most digital cameras or film scans. Most printers now cannot print the Adobe RGB gamut, but having the screen accurately show the colors the file contains lets you accurately see what happens to them when printed when you soft-proof.
As for someone else's comment about neutral grayscale, I don't know what he's talking about. Who cares of the greys are right if the colors are not. A good screen needs accurate greyscale tracking AND accurate color.
Here's the deal. LCDs suck for graphics or photo work. Most do not have the color accuracy, or ability to be accurately calibrated that even relatively inexpensive CRT screens had. If you print your work and want the prints to match the screen, this stuff is essential. The NEC Spectraview screens are expensive, but they are accurate and they calibrate perfectly with the Spectraview software and colorimeter. Just because your photos look 'good' on the screen does not mean the screen is good or accurate...as you'll find when you print them.
As far as the Adobe RGB capability, I think it is worth it too. sRGB screens cannot accurately display the color gamut that is in the files from most digital cameras or film scans. Most printers now cannot print the Adobe RGB gamut, but having the screen accurately show the colors the file contains lets you accurately see what happens to them when printed when you soft-proof.
As for someone else's comment about neutral grayscale, I don't know what he's talking about. Who cares of the greys are right if the colors are not. A good screen needs accurate greyscale tracking AND accurate color.
bwcolor
Veteran
Top line Eizo monitors are LED backlit. So there must be some subset.. expensive.. LEDs that can be used.
Ranchu
Veteran
If it is neutral and has an accurate profile it will have accurate color in gamut. The only things out of srgb are yellow, vinyl, and flowers. In gamut there is no difference. For skin, pavement, shadows, and life in general, neutral is all you will ever need. Have fun with the fancy monitor though.
Chriscrawfordphoto
Real Men Shoot Film.
Are you serious? OMG, I laughed so hard I damn near fell off my chair.
sepiareverb
genius and moron
Ranchu
Veteran
Yah, OMG I am serious. It's funny how so many people repeat what they've heard on the internet as gospel. Even funnier when all it is is marketing from Adobe, and they act like they know it all. You do a lot of this, but I've yet to learn a thing from you. Hue doesn't change when your monitor can't display that magenta flower, and it doesn't affect your file. It's just less saturated on your screen.
RObert Budding
D'oh!
I have an NEC PA241W, too. You'd have to be color blind not to see a difference between the NEC and an sRGB monitor. I'd rather see the colors instead of guessing and inadvertently clipping because I can't see what's happening.
Chriscrawfordphoto
Real Men Shoot Film.
You haven't learned because you don't want to. I do this for a living, have for many, many years. I do it day in and day out and I understand how the materials and equipment I use works.
You remind me of the people I went to school with. They weren't there to learn, and were too stupid to accept what educated people told them because they were convinced that they were right, despite NO knowledge of the subject of study.
An example: I took a class that concentrated on Tolstoy's War and Peace a couple years ago. I can speak and read Russian. I was the only person in the class that could. We read it in translation for that reason. The problem arose when someone badly mispronounced a Russian name in the book. I told her how it is pronounced, and all hell broke loose because a bunch of ignorant dolts all decided I was wrong, despite the fact that I can SPEAK THE GODDAMNED LANGUAGE. Finally, the professor said; "Chris speaks the language, can anyone else here speak Russian?" No one could, so the professor told them to shut up and listen to me.
mackigator
Well-known
I'm on Chris's side. Just sayin'
Ranchu
Veteran
Not buying that. You're saying a lot of specialized equipment is necessary, I'm saying all you need is neutral greys and an accurate profile. This is not that difficult, anybody can do it. You don't need all the stuff you spent all that time and money on (do you?), and neither do I. You just want to set yourself up as an authority, and charge admission to a group. It's hilarious.
RObert Budding
D'oh!
There's no such thing as an accurate profile for scanned negative film. And even with positives clipping can occur during edits. OK - you've definitively proved that you do not know what you're talking about.
Ranchu
Veteran
Monitor profile, Robert.
Pablito
coco frío
That would seem to be true. I have an NEC P221W - supposed to display 95% Adobe RGB and 99% sRGB, etc. Have calibrated several times it with a Color Munki device to no avail. Even after calibration, color is hyper saturated to the point I can't really use the monitor. Perhaps I should invest in the NEC device. For one thing, Color Munki profiles do not seem to affect the brightness of the monitor. Perhaps the NEC calibration software will create a profile that adjusts brightness as well.
craygc
Well-known
In that case, a monitor profile is a device-dependent profile so the only way to get that is by having the calibration tools to create the profile
denizg7
Well-known
i know this is offtopic but i have to say profiles do matter...
I was looking at this picture i took , the difference was a ton.. In my macbook pro the image seem well exposed but on my external screen it seemed extremly underexposed with a lot of grain..
I was looking at this picture i took , the difference was a ton.. In my macbook pro the image seem well exposed but on my external screen it seemed extremly underexposed with a lot of grain..
Ranchu
Veteran
True. I have the Spyder 3 Elite, and can recommend it. The Elite though, the software has more flexibility than the basic one.