Why Use a 10 Bit Monitor with Close to 100% Adobe RGB?

denizg7 said:
i know this is offtopic but i have to say profiles do matter...

I was looking at this picture i took , the difference was a ton.. In my macbook pro the image seem well exposed but on my external screen it seemed extremly underexposed with a lot of grain..
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You can only use one profile for both monitors if you have them both hooked up. In system preferences you can change the profile to that for the external (if it's in there, or make one). Then the laptop monitor will look bad, and the external good.
 
Pablito said:
That would seem to be true. I have an NEC P221W - supposed to display 95% Adobe RGB and 99% sRGB, etc. Have calibrated several times it with a Color Munki device to no avail. Even after calibration, color is hyper saturated to the point I can't really use the monitor. Perhaps I should invest in the NEC device. For one thing, Color Munki profiles do not seem to affect the brightness of the monitor. Perhaps the NEC calibration software will create a profile that adjusts brightness as well.
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Even when calibrated properly, these wide gamut monitors sill show over saturated colours - especially reds - in non ICC aware environments. For example desktop icons and browser buttons can have a lot pop to them.

To calibrate a monitor there are only 3 things you can specify to set i) luminance target, ii) gamma, and iii) white balance. When you use standard calibration tools that write profiles for the video card you lose any accurate control over monitor brightness and thereby your luminance target - you need to manually set the brightness. The NEC tools write the calibration profile to the monitor itself and can control all aspects of the monitor.

The NEC monitors are very good but need the Spectraview calibration tools to get the most out of them. I use an NEC2690WUxi and find it superb.
 
Pablito said:
That would seem to be true. I have an NEC P221W - supposed to display 95% Adobe RGB and 99% sRGB, etc. Have calibrated several times it with a Color Munki device to no avail. Even after calibration, color is hyper saturated to the point I can't really use the monitor. Perhaps I should invest in the NEC device. For one thing, Color Munki profiles do not seem to affect the brightness of the monitor. Perhaps the NEC calibration software will create a profile that adjusts brightness as well.
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Pablito,

The NEC software works with several manufacturer's colorimeters, or the one NEC sells. The NEC colorimeter is made by X-Rite and is similar to the X-Rite Eye One Display II.

My first NEC monitor was a 2190uxi. I already had an original Eye-One Display, so I figured spending the money on the NEC software and hardware was a waste of money. Boy, was I wrong! I tried calibrating with the Eye-One Match software that came with the Eye-One Display, and the prints were way off from what the screen showed.

Since the NEC Spectraview software works with the Eye-One Display, and I already had one (at the time, NEC's device was an original Eye-One Display), I got the software, which was about $170. Worth every Centavo!

The 2190uxi worked beautifully with the NEC software and the Eye-One device. I don't know if the software supports your color munki, but if it does, I'd get the software first and try it before buying the NEC device if money is tight.

By the time I got my PA241W, X-Rite had introduced the improved Eye-One Display II, so I decided to buy the NEC version of the colorimeter. I already had the Spectraview software from my old screen.

The value of the Spectraview software, regardless of what brand colorimeter you use with it, is that it adjusts the monitor's brightness, color, and contrast internally rather than manipulating the computer's video card...this gives more distinct colors and gray tones, for more accurate display.
 
Chriscrawfordphoto said:
I don't know if the software supports your color munki, but if it does, I'd get the software first and try it before buying the NEC device if money is tight.
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Thanks. This is a good idea, but unfortunately the NEC website does not include the ColorMunki in its list of supported color sensor devices. Nevertheless, the thread has been very useful.
 
Great discussion and I already have Spyder 3, so $89 of software and the NEC it is. I just wish that the LED Eizo was in my price range. I would much prefer the LED backlit screen.
 
yes informative discussion, except the usual "fools and their money" comments.

any comments about Apple monitors in this regard? value for the high price tag?
 
With Apple you have to contend with the gloss screen with a few exeptions. My 17" MacBook Pro with matte screen responded well to being calibrated with the ColorMunki.
 
bwcolor said:
Great discussion and I already have Spyder 3, so $89 of software and the NEC it is. I just wish that the LED Eizo was in my price range. I would much prefer the LED backlit screen.
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From my experience these NEC's are a bit hit and miss.
Make sure, the display performs uniform (calibration software includes this test).
Out of an order of 5 we had to return 2 because they were out of specs in terms of uniformity.
NEC replaced the 2 and one of the new had to be replaced for the same reason.
 
someone needs to mention that 10bit monitors are ripped of 2bits per channel by osx .. just saying.

I'm not printing from files. I print from negs if at all (b/w only). Nobody except 30 nerds on the internet looks at my stuff, so why bother calibrating my screen to anything. 😀
 
bwcolor said:
So, how does the Mac operating system pass on the colors and luminance? Are we limited to three eight bit color and one eight bit luminance channel?
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who knows .. the net says 10bit monitors and OSX is rubbish and I believe everything anyone ever said on the internet.
 
Pablito said:
Thanks. This is a good idea, but unfortunately the NEC website does not include the ColorMunki in its list of supported color sensor devices. Nevertheless, the thread has been very useful.
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In case anyone else is in my same situation I should clarify this is a mistake. I looked more carefully. ColorMunki IS supported. Will download the $89 software and give it a go. Thanks again to all.

You can determine if your calibration device is compatible with the NEC software here:

http://www.necdisplay.com/support-and-services/spectra-view-II/Compatibility#system_requirements
 
k__43 said:
someone needs to mention that 10bit monitors are ripped of 2bits per channel by osx .. just saying.

I'm not printing from files. I print from negs if at all (b/w only). Nobody except 30 nerds on the internet looks at my stuff, so why bother calibrating my screen to anything. 😀
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The 10 bit or 12 bit capability of the high-end screens is used to allow for the internal brightness, contrast, and white point adjustments. Adjusting these on a normal 8 bit monitor results in less than the normal 256 levels of color for each channel that you get with 8 bit devices. By doing the internal calibration at 10 or 12 bit, the full 256 levels per color can be displayed faithfully on the screen....so yes the high bit screens are worth it. By the way, Windows and Max OS-X have the same color management and video capability.
 
My 5-year old wide-gamut 30" HP LP3065's lower backlight died a month ago, and they won't repair it out of warranty, so I got a 30" wide-gamut HP ZR30w (99% of AdobeRGB) and a 27" LED CInema Display, each about $1K. The Apple display is brighter and does not need to warm up unlike the CCFL-backlit HP. Unfortunately no one seems to make LED-backlit 30" computer displays any more, at least not at anything approaching a reasonable price. I had seen Samsung's awesome XL30 at MacWorld several years ago, when it cost $4000, but it has been discontinued.

I calibrated both using a ColorMunki (the Colormunki spectrophotometer is top-notch, the dumbed-down software is so-so but adequate for my calibration needs).

I can confirm the OS X cannot use 10-bit mode on the ZR30w, even when running over DisplayPort, at least not with my aftermarket ATI Radeon HD 5870. It seems only apps with specific 10-bit support using OpenGL can make use of 10 bit mode on OS X, which is quite disappointing.
 
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