lynnb
Veteran
I've just had a look at some A7 samples taken with native lenses (the new E-mount 35mm 2.8 CZ and the A-mount 70-200 SSM G).
As Mike Johnson over on TOP commented, "too sharp. too detailed. Yuk".
You can see every skin pore, every small imperfection, every pimple.
I can well imagine that buyers of this camera who like taking people pictures will find softer portrait lenses very attractive. That's a whole lot more convenient than mucking around in post adding blur effects.
What do you think?
As Mike Johnson over on TOP commented, "too sharp. too detailed. Yuk".
You can see every skin pore, every small imperfection, every pimple.
I can well imagine that buyers of this camera who like taking people pictures will find softer portrait lenses very attractive. That's a whole lot more convenient than mucking around in post adding blur effects.
What do you think?
lynnb
Veteran
Sorry, I meant to say, A7R - the high res sensor. Great resolution for landscapes, not so good for portraits.
lam
Well-known
I'm of the opinion that the costs of lenses will remain the same or steadily decline as the whole used lens market is already saturated..... I do think if a few people cause enough stir of good reviews and samples it may create a bit of wake.
That also being said, the use of 'software' to improve the look of an image including portraits are already being used!
That also being said, the use of 'software' to improve the look of an image including portraits are already being used!
icebear
Veteran
Hello Lynn,
I'm not interested in these new offerings but in general :
A lot of the character of these images (at this stage ONLY jpgs as RAW is not yet supported in LR) is due to the in camera software. Obviously this was optimized for the "few pixel peepers" around and not for people who like atmosphere in their photographs.
The clarity slider for adjusting mid tone contrast can adjust this easily to your personal preference. Dial in -10 or -20 and you have that special low contrast "glow". Just turn off auto sharpening in camera and in LR (or what ever you software of choice).
I'm not interested in these new offerings but in general :
A lot of the character of these images (at this stage ONLY jpgs as RAW is not yet supported in LR) is due to the in camera software. Obviously this was optimized for the "few pixel peepers" around and not for people who like atmosphere in their photographs.
The clarity slider for adjusting mid tone contrast can adjust this easily to your personal preference. Dial in -10 or -20 and you have that special low contrast "glow". Just turn off auto sharpening in camera and in LR (or what ever you software of choice).
mfogiel
Veteran
A hint: if you want an "atmospheric" photograph, avoid digital altogether.
lam
Well-known
eleskin
Well-known
Ehhmmm! Noctilux, etc,,,
Ehhmmm! Noctilux, etc,,,
Yes, there are some cheap used lenses out there. I picked up some Minolta
MD's reasonably. I know John Issac and he , believe it or not, uses the full frame Sony DSLR's with the best used Minolta Maxxum glass with AMAZING results! Now lets talk Noctilux: I have one and paid dearly for it a few years ago for $4,000 and now think that was a great buy! There were only so many of these lenses made and they will always be desirable for their unique rendering ability. I must have a dozen different 50mm lenses and the Noct just has that special look and ability to grab light without any flare. With the reality of $2,100 and less mirrorless full frame bodies coming, many who could not afford a M240 will consider using the rangefinder lenses. Because they will be saving thousands by not purchasing a Leica body, they will use the savings to buy lenses. In fact, the money saved goes a LONG way towards purchasing a used Noctilux and let us remember that buying one is not throwing your money away, but rather converting it into another form that you can use and enjoy, and with time, increase in value. M240's will NEVER increase in value nor will the new Sony cameras. Other lenses like the Konica HExanon 50mm f1.2, the Minolta 58mm Rokkor X f1.2, the Voigtlander 35mm f1.2 (1st version, more creamy and dreamy , sharp, but not harsh or clinically sharp) will maintain their value and increase in value as demand increases and supply becomes more scarce. We will finally see a movement away from thinking the camera has great value (sorry Leica M people) and more towards the value of all the really great lenses made since the beginning of 35mm photography. Some will still be cheap, but others will go up in value due to increased demand, scarcity, and unique ability. Those are the facts!
Ehhmmm! Noctilux, etc,,,
Yes, there are some cheap used lenses out there. I picked up some Minolta
MD's reasonably. I know John Issac and he , believe it or not, uses the full frame Sony DSLR's with the best used Minolta Maxxum glass with AMAZING results! Now lets talk Noctilux: I have one and paid dearly for it a few years ago for $4,000 and now think that was a great buy! There were only so many of these lenses made and they will always be desirable for their unique rendering ability. I must have a dozen different 50mm lenses and the Noct just has that special look and ability to grab light without any flare. With the reality of $2,100 and less mirrorless full frame bodies coming, many who could not afford a M240 will consider using the rangefinder lenses. Because they will be saving thousands by not purchasing a Leica body, they will use the savings to buy lenses. In fact, the money saved goes a LONG way towards purchasing a used Noctilux and let us remember that buying one is not throwing your money away, but rather converting it into another form that you can use and enjoy, and with time, increase in value. M240's will NEVER increase in value nor will the new Sony cameras. Other lenses like the Konica HExanon 50mm f1.2, the Minolta 58mm Rokkor X f1.2, the Voigtlander 35mm f1.2 (1st version, more creamy and dreamy , sharp, but not harsh or clinically sharp) will maintain their value and increase in value as demand increases and supply becomes more scarce. We will finally see a movement away from thinking the camera has great value (sorry Leica M people) and more towards the value of all the really great lenses made since the beginning of 35mm photography. Some will still be cheap, but others will go up in value due to increased demand, scarcity, and unique ability. Those are the facts!
Renzsu
Well-known
I think it's crazy to fault a camera for being 'too sharp'.. I'm sorry, but you lose my immediate respect if you can't appreciate the fact that you can always blur detail but the reverse is so much harder.
35photo
Well-known
Well, you can just shoot at wider apertures and just not sharpen the image as much or at all in LR..and guess what you'll have a soft image..obviously depending on the lens your softness will vary..
icebear
Veteran
Shots with some older M-lenses on a digital camera :
raid
Dad Photographer
Tom A
RFF Sponsor
With the full frame a lens like the Heliar 75f1.8 wide open would give you a good portrait lens - not unsharp as such. just slightly softer rendition.
Of course, among the older lenses - a ltm Nikkor 105f2.5 or a 85f2 would work well too.
Of course, among the older lenses - a ltm Nikkor 105f2.5 or a 85f2 would work well too.
Duane Pandorf
Well-known
I have a love/hate relationship with my 35 Lux pre-ASPH. Sometimes I love the soft look when shot wide open and then....there's the other issues that if you haven't learned how the lens behaves in all those unique occasions.... well you just grin and bear it. So do I care about how sharp a sensor may be?
I do care about sharpness but the case and controls that surround the sensor make more of a difference to me when you're actually photographing.
I do care about sharpness but the case and controls that surround the sensor make more of a difference to me when you're actually photographing.
Jack Conrad
Well-known
Just beat the camera with a wooden mallet to soften it up. It works for veal, I don't see why it wouldn't work for cameras too. 
f16sunshine
Moderator
It's a good question.
I think only collectors will seek softer lenses of fancier pedigree.
For example. There are many m42 mount 50mm lenses from the 60's that give that portrait glow.
Or a Jupiter 8 even would do well.
One does not need a vintage Leitz or Zeiss .
I think only collectors will seek softer lenses of fancier pedigree.
For example. There are many m42 mount 50mm lenses from the 60's that give that portrait glow.
Or a Jupiter 8 even would do well.
One does not need a vintage Leitz or Zeiss .
uhoh7
Veteran
Summitar....hmmmmm good idea.
TY, off to evil site to buy a few
Oh wait, I've got a Canon LTM, 50/1.2
TY, off to evil site to buy a few
Oh wait, I've got a Canon LTM, 50/1.2
msbarnes
Well-known
No, not really. I don't think people are ever happy.
lynnb
Veteran
Renzsu, I think a camera/lens can record too much detail in some applications, like portraiture. Yes, you can blur detail in post, but to get natural-looking results in my experience takes more effort than shooting with a lens that renders in a flattering way in the first place.
Quicker, easier, and better to use the right lens, than play around in software. That's my experience. If you want detail, just shoot with a bitingly sharp, higher contrast lens. Horses for courses.
Thanks Klaus, I agree that they probably optimised those samples for the pixel-peeping crowd. I do use the clarity slider (as well as some plug-ins that have similar effect) but I'm thinking it's just easier to get it right at the capture stage by using a softer-rendering lens.
Cheers,
Dralowid
Michael
Summitar....hmmmmm good idea.
TY, off to evil site to buy a few
Oh wait, I've got a Canon LTM, 50/1.2
By the way, I don't think the old 'collapsible' favourites will collapse all the way into the Sony A7 body. They don't on the Nex 6. Mind you they don't seem to hit anything too serious.
Duane Pandorf
Well-known
If this new FF Sony handles the M mount lens well then there's no reason to believe that used lens prices won't increase in value as we've already seen in the last few years.
Better than owning gold.
Better than owning gold.