Writing the caption and writing in general

All I can add to this thread... 'Woe is I"

Might be too subtle for some so the hint,
as in Patricia T. O'Conner best selling author
 
But where are the formal usages of incorrect grammar? Informal language is always sloppy... filled with slang and the internet has exacerbated that. However, I'm curious to know these formal published texts that show these grammatical errors.
 
I would love to continue this delightful discussion, but now I have to leave and take a haircut.
 
Pál_K said:
Today, the computer and phone try to correct our spelling. Tomorrow the computer and phone will try to correct the thoughts behind what we write.

Note: Pál K, the statement above has been flagged as being false / incorrect. Please delete or change your statement to a truthful one or you will not be allowed to post. Further statements of this nature will put you on the list for re-education.
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You will never think them , let alone get to write them.
 
On the subject of English as a living language that changes: When did people decide that the answer to all questions must begin with "So." I guess I first noticed this about six or eight months ago, during interviews on CNN and NPR.
 
agentlossing said:
Romeo, Romeo, where are you at Romeo?

Doesn't have the same ring to it.
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Actually, "Wherefor art thou Romeo?" doesn't mean "where are you, Romeo?" It means "Why are you Romeo?" (As in, of all families, why must you be Romeo of the family feuding with mine?)

"Wherefor" is the question form of "therefor."

- Murray
 
CMur12 said:
Actually, "Wherefor art thou Romeo?" doesn't mean "where are you, Romeo?" It means "Why are you Romeo?" (As in, of all families, why must you be Romeo of the family feuding with mine?)

"Wherefor" is the question form of "therefor."

- Murray
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Sheesh...


;)
 
CMur12 said:
Actually, "Wherefor art thou Romeo?" doesn't mean "where are you, Romeo?" It means "Why are you Romeo?" (As in, of all families, why must you be Romeo of the family feuding with mine?)

"Wherefor" is the question form of "therefor."

- Murray
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Wow. Awesome. I know when I'm outclassed . . .
 
Pál_K said:
Perhaps I misunderstand - why would the contraction of "he does not" upset anyone? Were early grammarians upset by "does" instead of "doth"?
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It would have been because "does" was an intrusion from a non-standard dialect that supplanted both "doth" and "doeth." It would have also been an objection to a new, unnecessary contraction based upon said illegitimate intrusion. (I'm surmising this, of course, based on current attitudes about language. I have no documentation to this effect.)

Pál_K said:
But when I hear "he don't" from my father or grandmother or other immigrant living in the US, their choice of "don't" is more likely a mere simplification (to match I don't, you don't, we don't, they don't) . This latter case of simplification could explain much of the usage today - even though the modern use of "he don't" matches what may have been a valid contraction in early English.
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Good point.

Pál_K said:
Simplification of inflectional endings has been an ongoing trend for thousands of years. For example, if you were to compare the language spoken in Norway, Sweden, or Denmark in 1000 AD with Icelandic in 1000 AD, the languages would be essentially identical. However, over the last thousand years, isolated Iceland has retained its extensive noun and adjective inflections (four cases in both singular and plural) and its endings for verb conjugation. It has preserved the past. By contrast, Norwegian, Swedish, and Danish - countries not isolated at all - have streamlined (reduced) their inflections greatly. English has done the same.
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I agree.

Pál_K said:
One charming aspect of British / Australian / NZ English is the treatment of an entity as a plural, whereas American English uses the singular form. Compare:

"Kodak have re-introduced Kodachrome..."
"Kodak has re-introduced Kodachrome..."
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Ah yes, the "corporate plural." Americans refer to the company in the singular and the people working there in the plural. We say, "Kodak is doing this," but also, "At Kodak they're doing this." The British are more consistent in this regard.

- Murray
 
I love dialects and different regional pronunciations as well.

A coworker friend of mine, who loves words, idioms, and language, became very upset when I mentioned the pronunciation differences between Don/dawn and cot/caught (these are often used in mapping pronunciation differences). I pronounce these pairs quite differently and distinctly, as do many people - but there are regions where the pairs are pronounced identically and he was one of those people. But not only that, he could not hear the difference when I and others pronounced the pairs.

Another favorite subject of mine is the regional shibboleth - place names that quickly reveal an outsider. When I first moved to the Pacific Northwest, i was betrayed by my pronunciation of "Sequim".
 
Pál_K said:
I love dialects and different regional pronunciations as well. A coworker friend of mine, who loves words, idioms, and language, became very upset when I mentioned the pronunciation differences between Don/dawn and cot/caught. I pronounce these pairs quite differently and distinctly, as do many people - but there are regions where the pairs are pronounced identically and he was one of those people. But not only that, he could not hear the difference when I and others pronounced the pairs.

Another favorite subject of mine is the regional shibboleth - place names that quickly reveal an outsider.
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I, too, love dialects and different regional pronunciations.

In my dialect, we don't make the distinctions that you cite, but I can hear them and reproduce them, and I often point them out to others of my dialect.

- Murray
 
As I recall from years past, a lot of people never really grasped the distinction of similar-sounding words like their, they're and there. Which may partly explain the current popularity of posting videos rather than written words.
 
Pál_K said:
I would love to continue this delightful discussion, but now I have to leave and take a haircut.
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I always have a haircut. Just as I would say I am having my haircut.

I have not heard the "take" usage (in the sense of someone actually having their hair actually cut.) Though I have heard it in the sense of someone "taking a haircut on a financial deal". Though I think this is an Americanism.

Another one which is very old school British which occurs to me is the oh so polite "Will you take tea?" (In Australia we would simply say "Would you like a cup of tea") An even more arcane usage from Britain (probably not much used now apart from among a few members of the upper classes) is "Will you take a saucer of tea?" This dates back to the early days of tea drinking when English tea drinkers adopted the Chinese custom of drinking from a small saucer shaped bowl rather than a tea cup as we now know it. This phrase has long since died out except among a precious few who continue to use that wording (even though when the tea comes it is indeed in a cup, not a "saucer" - well the cup has its own saucer tut that is another story - some people in times past made a practice of tipping tea from the cup into the saucer to drink it probably to honor the old custom and because it made the tea cooler to imbibe).
 
Pál_K said:
I love dialects and different regional pronunciations as well.

...

Another favorite subject of mine is the regional shibboleth - place names that quickly reveal an outsider. When I first moved to the Pacific Northwest, i was betrayed by my pronunciation of "Sequim".
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That's a good one... And I have actually heard SEEtl and TAKoma for seAttle and tacOma. I can make similar mistakes when I've read some word but not heard it spoken. :eek:
 
One of my favorite examples of misunderstanding one's pronunciation is from the old TV show, "F Troop".


A lost band of Indians/Native Americans crossed paths with the soldiers from F Troop, and when asked who they were they responded with "Where the heck are we?", but with their heavy accents was heard as "We're the Hakowee" which they were then known as for the rest of the show.


PF
 
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