Zeiss Ikon Contaflex II Shutter Repairs

[farlymac]

And here is a shot of the camera with one of it's cousins, before I shipped it back to the owner.


Zeiss Ikon Cousins by br1078phot, on Flickr

PF

 

[Sarcophilus Harrisii]

No worries, any time. I've not yet had the issue you had to nail present itself so it's helped me too, if I come across it I'll know what to look for myself. 😉

They're a beautifully made camera in the true Zeiss Ikon tradition, definitely worth the effort of sorting out for regular use I reckon. It looks terrific next to the Contax rangefinder (which is itself absolutely gorgeous). A Contax RF has been in my thoughts quite a bit the last few days, actually. Your photo isn't helping to take my mind of one, they are such a beautiful design.
Cheers
Brett

 

[farlymac]

No worries, any time. I've not yet had the issue you had to nail present itself so it's helped me too, if I come across it I'll know what to look for myself. 😉

They're a beautifully made camera in the true Zeiss Ikon tradition, definitely worth the effort of sorting out for regular use I reckon. It looks terrific next to the Contax rangefinder (which is itself absolutely gorgeous). A Contax RF has been in my thoughts quite a bit the last few days, actually. Your photo isn't helping to take my mind of one, they are such a beautiful design.
Cheers
Brett

Thanks, Brett. I need to shoot the Contax more often, now that I've fixed it.

PF

 

[nhchen]

Got one question for you, Brett. In the photo below, is the little swing arm sticking out at the 02:00 position (MXV Switch Tension?) in it's proper place for reassembly? It seemed to be that way when I separated the shutter from the camera, though it could have moved.

PF


DSCN0986_2c by br1078phot, on Flickr

Link to complete set
http://www.flickr.com/photos/7699588@N07/sets/72157634549257044/

I'm stuck in trying to bring a contaflex II back to life. I've removed the shutter and it works well outside the body. the problem I have is that when the shutter is in the body, I can cock it using the winding knob, but I can't release the shutter. The shutter releasing arm doesn't go all of way down to the position in the picture above. It's like it doesn't have enough energy to spring back all of the way down. I've tried cleaning and regressing the gears but it doesn't seem to make a difference. Is there a spring somewhere that's weakened?
Regards, Nathan

 

[Sarcophilus Harrisii]

I'm stuck in trying to bring a contaflex II back to life. I've removed the shutter and it works well outside the body. the problem I have is that when the shutter is in the body, I can cock it using the winding knob, but I can't release the shutter. The shutter releasing arm doesn't go all of way down to the position in the picture above. It's like it doesn't have enough energy to spring back all of the way down. I've tried cleaning and regressing the gears but it doesn't seem to make a difference. Is there a spring somewhere that's weakened?
Regards, Nathan

It's been a while since I did an early model. Although I have an original Contaflex, and an early one at that, which I need to sort out for a friend in the next few days or so. So my memory is hazy, but I wonder if the timing is correct. I seem to recall that, if it is not, the camera won't release, and this is precisely what you have described, if I understand you correctly. You only have to be a tooth on the rack out to stop it firing, I think. Let us know how you get on, I've got a few early models going, but haven't pulled one down for a couple of years, and I work on too many different types to recall the intricacies of every one intimately (I do find myself "re-learning" them occasionally because of this). But as I said, I have one here I need to do and the shutter will have to be pulled on it, so, if you get really stuck I can always take it out and re-acquaint myself with the correct installation. 😉
Cheers,
Brett

 

[nhchen]

Hi Brett,
So I had another go at trying to figure out what's wrong. It doesn't seem to be related to the position of the tooth if the shutter cocking/firing disk. In the picture above the shutter firing arm is at ~7oclock position, my one only reaches around 8 o'clock when I press the shutter release. I can manually move it down to the proper position but it can't do this by itself. I wonder if the problem is in the film advance mechanism somewhere? Could there be a gear or clutch or spring that is slipping somewhere?
What I can't figure out is where the spring of the shutter release is located in amongst the whole winding mechanism.
Regards,
Nathan

 

[farlymac]

The one thing I made sure not to do, Nathan, was to pull the gears. I figured I'd never get them back right. Like Brett says, it doesn't take much to disturb the sequence. Maybe you can get an idea of whether yours is off by the tooth count in the photo.

PF

 

[nhchen]

Oh Oops, I've done that already, but installing the cocking ring back in the same orientation as what was in the photo didn't make any difference. The camera didn't look like its been worked before, so I have a feeling its not the position of the cocking ring that is the problem, it may be something higher up in the gearing mechanism. I think I'll have to think about it more to figure out where it may be getting jammed or gummed.
regards, nathan

The one thing I made sure not to do, Nathan, was to pull the gears. I figured I'd never get them back right. Like Brett says, it doesn't take much to disturb the sequence. Maybe you can get an idea of whether yours is off by the tooth count in the photo.

PF

 

[Sarcophilus Harrisii]

Are the mirror and capping plate actuating correctly? The wind mechanism gearing of the Contaflex is fairly robust and not generally given to problems.

 

[nhchen]

Yes the mirror and capping plate function correctly. I've removed the top plate and the prism and looked at the exposed gears, they all seemed fine. One thing I noticed which may be weird is that after winding and releasing the mechanism, I can move the shutter cocking/releasing plate Back and forth without much resistance. If I move it back in the direction of cocking the shutter I can feel a slight slipping of a spring, which I assume is there to stop the mechanism from doing this. So maybe something is faulty there?

 

[Sarcophilus Harrisii]

Yes the mirror and capping plate function correctly. I've removed the top plate and the prism and looked at the exposed gears, they all seemed fine. One thing I noticed which may be weird is that after winding and releasing the mechanism, I can move the shutter cocking/releasing plate Back and forth without much resistance. If I move it back in the direction of cocking the shutter I can feel a slight slipping of a spring, which I assume is there to stop the mechanism from doing this. So maybe something is faulty there?

The main spring of the shutter is an integral part of the release system. I wouldn't necessarily draw too many conclusions from that, without the shutter installed in the body.

If you PM your email address to me, I can email you the factory service manual for the Contaflex to Contaflex IV models. It includes the Contaflex II. The file size is approximately 18.5 megabytes.
Cheers,
Brett

 

[nhchen]

So I've manage to find the cause of the problem in my contaflex II!
Using the repair manual Brett sent me, I was able to take the part with the winding gears off the camera. The offending part was the spring under the brass gear:

This is what it looks like from the other side - big brass gear in the middle:

Underneath the brass gear is the spring which moves the cocking/shutter release ring back once you fire the camera.

After I removed the pin holding it in and the two tensioning screws I found what was the problem -

So the spring had been snapped somehow, which explains why the cocking arm didn't have enough energy to move all the way down to trip the shutter.
I was able to rescue it by heating and bending the end of the remaining long spring to form the hook to hold it in place. Then I wound it back into the gear.

I'm now half way into putting everything back together. Testing it without the shutter in place, at least the shutter releasing arm can spring almost all of the way back down to its resting position. Hopefully I'll be able to put all of the pieces back together later! 😉

regards,
nathan

 

[Sarcophilus Harrisii]

So I've manage to find the cause of the problem in my contaflex II!
Using the repair manual Brett sent me, I was able to take the part with the winding gears off the camera. The offending part was the spring under the brass gear:

This is what it looks like from the other side - big brass gear in the middle:

Underneath the brass gear is the spring which moves the cocking/shutter release ring back once you fire the camera.

After I removed the pin holding it in and the two tensioning screws I found what was the problem -

So the spring had been snapped somehow, which explains why the cocking arm didn't have enough energy to move all the way down to trip the shutter.
I was able to rescue it by heating and bending the end of the remaining long spring to form the hook to hold it in place. Then I wound it back into the gear.

I'm now half way into putting everything back together. Testing it without the shutter in place, at least the shutter releasing arm can spring almost all of the way back down to its resting position. Hopefully I'll be able to put all of the pieces back together later! 😉

regards,
nathan

Congratulations. That's an unusual failure for one of these, I have never seen it. You're unlucky to have to deal with that, but you're on top of it now. I wonder if someone had been inside it previously. You got there, which is the main thing, good effort!
Cheers,
Brett

 

[farlymac]

Never would have thought it was that. Hope the extra tension on it doesn't cause the same failure later on.

PF

 

[MartinB]

Hi all,

I've been following this thread and farlymac's flickr photo series which have been a great help in attempting to revive a Contaflex II which had a seized shutter.

It only cost me £9 off ebay, the lens is in pretty terrible condition and the camera is rough overall but its more an exercise in if I could get it going and the chance to dig around in an old compur shutter.

So things have gone ok, I've had the shutter off the camera and taken apart, cleaned the speed escapement and self timer and the shutter is now working again.

The major problem I'm having is in re-tensioning the aperture spring when the shutter goes back onto the body and was wondering how other people have done it?

This is the bit I mean.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/7699588@N07/9230671385/in/album-72157634534273160/

Does the back of the camera come off or do you just work through the 35mm film window?

I've managed to get some tension back into the spring but have made a bit of a mess of the black paint and screw heads working at an awkward angle.

Thanks for all the great information contained in these pages!
Martin

 

[Sarcophilus Harrisii]

Hi all,

I've been following this thread and farlymac's flickr photo series which have been a great help in attempting to revive a Contaflex II which had a seized shutter.

It only cost me £9 off ebay, the lens is in pretty terrible condition and the camera is rough overall but its more an exercise in if I could get it going and the chance to dig around in an old compur shutter.

So things have gone ok, I've had the shutter off the camera and taken apart, cleaned the speed escapement and self timer and the shutter is now working again.

The major problem I'm having is in re-tensioning the aperture spring when the shutter goes back onto the body and was wondering how other people have done it?

This is the bit I mean.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/7699588@N07/9230671385/in/album-72157634534273160/

Does the back of the camera come off or do you just work through the 35mm film window?

I've managed to get some tension back into the spring but have made a bit of a mess of the black paint and screw heads working at an awkward angle.

Thanks for all the great information contained in these pages!
Martin

Hi Martin,
I know the screws you mean, and they're not exactly in an ideal location, are they? In order to make the task of reaching them easier I've previously modified a small screwdriver to better fit them, a bend or two and if necessary an angled blade can make the process, if not easy, at least, not nearly as painful. Note that the screw to the side of the adjuster is a lock screw, you can temporarily leave it out as you test the adjustment, as long as you've nipped up the adjuster screw between checks.

The above little chore is just one of a few reasons why I personally feel that, contrary to what has sometimes been written, the later unit focus models tend to be easier to work on than the first two.

To tension the aperture, set the control ring to f/22, then rotate the adjuster until the blades have fully stopped down. After this they don't require much tension. It's been a while since I've done a I or a II, but from memory, perhaps another two to three turns after the blades finish closing? Phil may have covered this above, I'm travelling and can't easily check my records. If the shutter is consistently closing down to f/22 at 1/500 before exposure (look for a well delineated small pentagon through the film gate with lens opening directed at a light source) then you've likely set it well. Do test fire it a few times though before calling it good. If so you can install the lock screw and job done. A little black touch paint on the parts will work wonders.
Cheers
Brett

 

[MartinB]

Thanks for the fast reply and the tips on tools Brett.

I basically just wanted to check I wasn't missing something really obvious and was making my life harder than it needed to be. It really isn't a friendly place to put a screw!

I think the shutter is going to have to come apart again anyway, I managed to get some more tension into the spring but I think the aperture blades aren't running as smoothly as they could and that isn't helping the close down time/lag.

I only cleaned them with a cotton but and some lighter fluid from the outside but might attempt to completely dismantle the aperture assembly and soak them.

Again this is really just a learning experience so I'm not too worried if something goes wrong, I'm actually surprised I've got this far without completely messing something up yet.

I might look at getting another copy after this as I like the camera but can't imagine the lens on this one won't be affected by the various marks/fungus/patterns on it.

Thanks again, its been a great learning experience.
Martin

 

[farlymac]

Martin, I set mine at four notches.

PF