Zeiss Ikon Rumors

[Huck Finn]

Here are the latest from the rumor mill:

1. Grey market prices have not yet been set by the distributor in Japan, but expect the ZI body to be about $1375-$1400.

2. Delivery is expected to dealers by the second week in November.

3. Bodies were pulled from production at Cosina by Carl Zeiss AG & were completed in Germany.

I'm off to PhotoPlus Expo in NYC tomorrow. I've added the above to my list of questions.

Cheers,
Huck

 

[vincentbenoit]

Thanks for the update.

3. Bodies were pulled from production at Cosina by Carl Zeiss AG & were completed in Germany.

Is this a good sign or a bad sign?

Cheers
Vincent

 

[Mazurka]

3. Bodies were pulled from production at Cosina by Carl Zeiss AG & were completed in Germany.

Sounds like a rumour indeed: how many bodies or batches? Emergency move or permanent? Are they emulating Leica who have most of their bodies' work done in Portugal and only the final assembly/QC in Germany? Is this just marketing hype designed to counter the "poor pedigree/rebadged Bessa" sneers from die-hard Leicaphiles? 😕

 

[vincentbenoit]

IF this is true, then surely they can't be doing much to them after they have "pulled (the cameras) from production", since presumably the production line including the machine tools etc are all in Japan. Is someone seriously suggesting that CZ have a duplicate line in Germany?

My guess is that the "completed in Germany" bit refers to such high-precision work as sticking the Zeiss logo on the front of the camera... that critical part seems to be still missing on that body.
No such problems with red dots...

 

[Huck Finn]

I agree that it sounds strange, but it would explain the long delay. I was told that there was a production run on the assembly line in March. Such a run would have been in keeping with the advertised release date of May 1. However, Zeiss decided that they would not release this batch & went back to the drawing board. It's now 7 months later that they are finally ready to release their first cameras. If it was simply a matter of QC on an initial run, it shouldn't have taken 7 months to turn them back around. It does seem that something more complicated was involved.

This could all be cleared up if Stephen Gandy would publish the article he promised about his visit to the Cosina factory back in March. For whatever reason, that article has never been forthcoming even though his website still says that it will be posted "soon." It's been saying that for 7 months . . . coincidentally.

Huck

 

[rover]

I in no way want to speak badly of Cosina, but there have been a number of comments about problems with the R3a in particular that makes you wonder. My thought was that the production of two new CV cameras, R2a and R3a, new ZI lenses, as well as their own lens line was a huge increase in production for any company to undertake all at once.

Could there have been growing pains? Huck, if you recall at the Expo last year the Hasselblad rep we spoke to seemed to give off some negative vibes about the ZI and quality. That was a prototype they were showing and he mentioned that Hasselblad had gone back to Zeiss with some suggestions.

 

[FrankS]

Verrry interrrestink!

 

[Huck Finn]

Hey, Rover, any chance I can pry you away from behind that desk to come along tomorrow? Maybe you go in early, put in 4 hours, I pick you up at 11:00, & we're at the Javits Center by 1:00. 😎

Huck :angel:

 

[rover]

Hey, Rover, any chance I can pry you away from behind that desk to come along tomorrow? Maybe you go in early, put in 4 hours, I pick you up at 11:00, & we're at the Javits Center by 1:00. 😎

Huck :angel:

I would love to, but I have a class tomorrow night. I have to drag you out for a B&W Darkroom Photography class that is starting in December I think. I will send you some info.

By the end of last week I was definitely going again, but changed my mind this week, I need to put the hours in at the office.

 

[Huck Finn]

I would love to, but I have a class tomorrow night. I have to drag you out for a B&W Darkroom Photography class that is starting in December I think. I will send you some info.

By the end of last week I was definitely going again, but changed my mind this week, I need to put the hours in at the office.

I'm impressed with your self-disciploine, Ralph! 😱

Yes, I'd be very much interested in the class. Thanks. 🙂

Huck

 

[ZeissFan]

Cosina has never been the standard-bearer in camera production. However, I believe that the Voigtlander series of cameras improved in quality, as well as choice of materials with each model. Judging from online postings, Cosina still is struggling with the rangefinder alignment issue. I guess I'm lucky that my R never had that problem.

Perhaps this is a case of West meets East, where Zeiss's expectations of quality are different from Cosina's expectations. I'll be interested in hearing what the Hasselblad rep has to say.

 

[aizan]

i doubt they moved final production to germany. that rumor probably started as a miscommunication of final testing being done by carl zeiss in germany.

 

[Socke]

Remember the first batch of BMW Z3 roadsters? Those destined for germany ended up in Bremerhaven where they where reworked for german quality expectations. The gap width of the doors and bonnets as well as that of the interior bonnets had to be adjusted.

This can be the same in this case, probably rangefinder and shutter adjustment.

 

[Paul T.]

The final part of the 'Making Of' the ZI is up on their website now. Unfortunately it just contains lots of Blah about distribution, rather than giving us the dirt on why it was delayed...

http://www.zeissikon.com/making5.htm

 

[Socke]

Hey, they are talking about us!

The task is not only to provide availability of the product in the markets around the globe, but to create the best forum where the demands of critical and highly competent users can be met.

😀

 

[jano]

I heard rumour that an announcement was to be made to the US market today.... 😕

 

[ZeissFan]

I notice at the end of the "Making of ..." series, Part 5, they repeated that the camera will be available this month. Haven't heard anything from the dealer. Perhaps they've arrived but they're not permitted to begin distribution until a certain date.

 

[jlw]

i doubt they moved final production to germany. that rumor probably started as a miscommunication of final testing being done by carl zeiss in germany.

It wouldn't surprise me at all to learn that they had shipped the first batch over to Oberkochen so their own bench-top guys could check the flange-to-film alignment and give the RF adjustment screws a twiddle.

Considering how much bad-mouthing (justified and unjustified) there has been of Cosina QC in various online forums (including this one) this would be a very prudent move in helping the new camera get off on the right foot, IMO.

 

[Huck Finn]

Cosina still is struggling with the rangefinder alignment issue. I guess I'm lucky that my R never had that problem.

Perhaps this is a case of West meets East, where Zeiss's expectations of quality are different from Cosina's expectations. I'll be interested in hearing what the Hasselblad rep has to say.

I just got back from PhotoPlus Expo & will post my report tomorrow. But I will say that ZeissFan's comment is reflected in what I heard there. They attributed delays to demanding standards that were not met by initial prototypes. They specifically mentioned that a lot of work went into the rangefinder optics & mechanism.

Cheers,
Huck

 

[Huck Finn]

i doubt they moved final production to germany. that rumor probably started as a miscommunication of final testing being done by carl zeiss in germany.

I'm here to trash my own rumor. I asked Kornelius Muller at PhotoPlus Expo about this rumor & he emphatically denied it. He elaborated by pointing out that Zeis is a lens company with no facilities for producing cameras & no expertise in this field. The camera is clearly stamped "Made in Japan." Aizan, you are certainly correct about testing being done in Germany so that may be the explanation. I would still love to know what Stephen Gandy saw at the factory when he went to Cosina.

Cheers,
Huck