ZI rangefinder further delayed

[Huck Finn]

Adorama has it listed for $1617. Not in stock yet though.

The price on the Cosina website is 153,000 Yen, which converts to $1348 with current exchange rates. The history of prices for the lenses is that grey market dealers like Cameraquest & Popflash come in a little under the Japanese retail price - not in all cases, but most. So, normally you can round down from the Cosina Japan price to geet the USA grey market price.

If the camera follows this pricing trend, it should be available for about $1300 - maybe a little less. I think that you can figure conservatively around $1400.

Cheers,
Huck

 

[Huck Finn]

Will, my guestimate from what I've seen written on the Z-I website and elsewhere is that the camera will have full "Zeiss quality", and this view is even encouraged by the delays in release date as they fine-tune the details and Carl Zeiss make darn sure it's up to snuff. I'd think that puts it into a league comparable to Leica... but since even Leica has had some hiccups along the way I imagine Zeiss is trying for perfection. 🙂

One very attractive thing about this new system is its lens-mount compatibility with Leica and Voigtlander, for a greater choice of price-points, and mix'n'match.

Doug, here is a reply that I received a while ago after I posted an inquiry to ZeissIkon.com regarding quality contol:

". . . the camera bodies . . . have to pass a lot of test procedures in our "torture chamber." I use this term for our . . . environmental test lab which simulates the stress of camera operation in terms of temperature cycles, humidity, shock, & vibration."

I think that there are similar comments about this on the Zeiss Ikon websire, including a picture of a camera body covered with ice. 😱

They have also introduced measures to make the shutter quieter & more precise than the Bessas & to improve the sensitivity of the meter. It would seem from all this information that you are right that this camera has been built to a higher standard.

Cheers,
Huck

 

[sgy1962]

Does anyone know if Zeiss gave prototypes out to some photographers to use and put through their paces before release to the public, like Leica did with the M7 and MP?

 

[Will]

Will, my guestimate from what I've seen written on the Z-I website and elsewhere is that the camera will have full "Zeiss quality", and this view is even encouraged by the delays in release date as they fine-tune the details and Carl Zeiss make darn sure it's up to snuff. I'd think that puts it into a league comparable to Leica... but since even Leica has had some hiccups along the way I imagine Zeiss is trying for perfection. 🙂

One very attractive thing about this new system is its lens-mount compatibility with Leica and Voigtlander, for a greater choice of price-points, and mix'n'match.

Hopefully the life of the electronic shutter is long, I have a Nikon F3, and it is showing its age.

I work in the manufacturing sector, so I know manufacturing delays:

Vendors do not deliver on time (ie, parts deliver the night before you are suppose to load a container :bang: )

Lack of production capacity (ie, 50% of the shop floor workers left in the past 12 months :bang: )

Failure of tests (ie drop test, age tests, child safety test, ship (vibration) test :bang: )

Delivery made to the wrong address (ie, UK delivey became Canada delivery :bang: :bang: :bang: workmate in another sales team, not me :bang: )

If it was my money on the line for one of the new ZI bodies, I would not mind the delay as I am a photographer by passion not a free lance volunteer quality control expert. This is in fact a good sign that Zeiss Ikon is taking the quality control hyper seriously. It would be worth the wait. I wonder if anyone is going to carry the camera in Canada?

Bill

You will be surpise how many under-quality products my company (the company I work for, which shall remain nameless) and my industry pump out.

The whole procuement process just force quality into the loo... Customers keep driving down the price, Salespeople keep recommanding cheaper materials. If the manufacturing process and quality system remain strong (which they don't), quality in the long run is still hard to come by.

Leica is doing very well upholding their quality but they also push their prices up. Zeiss Ikon has a lot to learn from their competitor for not being tempted for cost saving that will hurt them in the long run. (ie, Cosina with their sliver plastic top plate for the Bessas, Rollei and their badge-engineering of the RF35)

Okay it is now October and where is it?

Bob

Guess how many times I had to answer to that question when a certain major supply program died due to production quality and material issues.

:bang:

LOL

 

[Will]

It would seem from all this information that you are right that this camera has been built to a higher standard.

This will be nice, last thing you want is a deal like the Rollei RF35...

 

[Nikon Bob]

Will

I too work in industry and I see no quality control that would meet my expectations but maybe I am too fussy. There are, as you say, a great many factors that mitigate against it.

Bob

 

[Solinar]

Reading tea leaves: I expect that the improved RF optic, maybe some reworking of the film advance, some dampening of the shutter noise and tighter QC at the factory makes for a premium level C/V Bessa derivative.

The whole Bessa experiment has been an interesting development on the range finder scene. Right now I feel like I'm part of the experiiment with my humble Bessa R and two C/V lenses. Cosina has pretty much milked a lot of mileage out of what once had been a budget-minded SLR chassis.

The Hassy distributorship of the new ZI may make more expensive than it needs to be. Still I hope it sells well. Like many, I'll wait til the black bodied version comes out.

 

[Huck Finn]

Reading tea leaves: I expect that the improved RF optic, maybe some reworking of the film advance, some dampening of the shutter noise and tighter QC at the factory makes for a premium level C/V Bessa derivative.

The Hassy distributorship of the new ZI may make more expensive than it needs to be. Still I hope it sells well. Like many, I'll wait til the black bodied version comes out.

Solinar, you make an excellent point about the added cost that comes with Hasselblad. Japan is the one place where Hassy is not the distributor & the price there is about $170 less than USA. That extra $170 must be strictly the cost of $170 - perhaps some shipping costs as well & some additional increase as a hedge against the declining US dollar.

From a series of correspondences with Zeiss Ikon, I've learned that in addition to the improvements you mention, the shutter has a completely new shutter design (although using mostly standard Copal parts) and timing control mechanism & includes a permanent exposure lock feature, something the Bessas do not have. In addition, there are modifications to improve metering sensitivity. In addition, ZI also includes the much publicized VF with increased magnification & the addition of 28 mm framelines. I believe that improvements to the film advance were introduced on the Bessa 2/3A & I'm not aware of anything new on the ZI in this regard.

Cheers,
Huck

 

[ZeissFan]

Well, I'm figuring maybe four weeks until I have a camera and two lenses in my hot little hands.

 

[kram]

Anyone one for a sweep stake? My guess- UK first sightings in shops ummmmm....16 November. USA .....28 November. Just in time for a loved one to pop one (chrome edition only ) in your Christmas stocking. 😀

 

[Fred]

Hmmmm, I quite like the chrome one, maybe some Christmas bonus fodder. Most of my cameras are black, all of my RFs are black......

A high quality RF camera that maybe I can see the 28 frame with glasses, that could sway it.

 

[aizan]

gandy said the chrome one is only chrome paint, not actual silver chrome, and that the black paint one looks much better. maybe i'll trade in my m2 for one...

 

[JohnL]

(snip)
If the camera follows this pricing trend, it should be available for about $1300 - maybe a little less. I think that you can figure conservatively around $1400.

Huck,
I hope you're right. Do you know if CameraQuest will carry it? He has the ZM lenses listed on his site. B&H now also has it for $1617 "coming soon".

 

[Huck Finn]

Huck,
Do you know if CameraQuest will carry it? He has the ZM lenses listed on his site. B&H now also has it for $1617 "coming soon".

Yes, he will be carrying the ZI but only in black, which means that it will probably be a few months before he has any in stock. I did not ak him the price, but it would be great if someone else could & post it.

Cheers,
Huck

 

[JohnL]

I did ask, but he doesn't have an answer at this time.

 

[Huck Finn]

Thanks, John. 🙂

Huck

 

[Paul T.]

"a premium level C/V Bessa derivative."

Can we drop that phrase? Good camera or no, it's made by CV, but not derived from one.

 

[Mazurka]

Huh?

Huh?

gandy said the chrome one is only chrome paint, not actual silver chrome, and that the black paint one looks much better. maybe i'll trade in my m2 for one...

Perhaps what he said was "chrome-(electro)plated", not "chrome paint." Or did he confuse the Zeiss Ikon's metal covers (according to www.zeissikon.com) with the Bessa R's plastic ones? 😕

 

[Frank Granovski]

Perhaps Oct 2006 was what was meant. 😎

 

[aizan]

he said it was only silver paint. did they plate the ones for real production?