ZI "SILVER" discontinued

thegman said:
I guess while it's selling
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Is it selling? How much?

In the absence of figures it is hard to know.

I would guess that since the devaluation of the dollar vs the yen has pushed the price of the ZI much closer to M6 and M7 territory, the North American market for new ZIs has shrunk considerably, if not dried up.

For me, it was the body of preference. Wish I really could afford a second, but in practice I'm happier combining it with a Bessa R4A and a Bessa T.
 
Zeiss can do it. Let's hope for a FF digital Zeiss camera that is somehow better than the M9. A future with $1000 M8 bodies, $2000 M9, $3000 Zeiss and $4000 Fuji?
Keith, we can always dream.
 
I'm sure the discontinuation is due to low sales. Zeiss just want to consolidate the ZI into one model/color only to reduce costs. But yeah, I would love to see a Zeiss Ikon D.
 
Keith said:
At last ... that full frame M mount digital body for $2500 that we've all been waiting on for so long! :D
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yes they "promised" this, saying digital wasn't mature enough, back in ~2006-07. am sure factory assembly line somewhere in Japan is currently reconfigured for mass production of ZI-D :D
 
It all smacks of a funeral, this general pull back from film, seen throughout the industry. It is not hard to imagine a marketplace where new film camera production will come to an end. :(
Currently, film is caught in a "Catch 22" situation. As the demand for film and film cameras, continues to decline, the manufacturers continue to drop even more of them from their product lines. The public sees all of this as a signal to shift more towards digital, even as their choices of cameras and film become more limited (not to mention finding convenient developers of film). So for now this will be the "new norm" until such time as the film marketplace stabilizes. Perhaps when that happens, there would be enough of a demand leftover to support maybe one company producing a line of film cameras (Cosina??).
Lately, I have begun to notice more "choice" film cameras & related items, showing up in the used marketplace (which is alright with me). IMHO, this is just another indication of the shift away from film now making its way felt within the "collector market". As these collectors perceive a devaluation of their assets, (weather true or not), this becomes the prime factor in their sell-off.
Add to that, the world's troubled economy and its effect on the demise of film cameras and there's no limit as to where we could go with that...:bang:, :rolleyes:, :D
 
Have you ever seen a well used ZM silver? Ages downright ugly. Looks like a chipped toy. Black ZM's, Yay!! Sad though as I predict all ZM's will go up in price.
 
Zeiss has stated unequivocally that they won't be producing a digital ZI, because they're not a camera company. They do lens design. Cosina produces this stuff, so you'd have to convince Cosina that a digital Ikon can thrive alongside Fujifilm's X series, Sony's NEX series, and the Micro 4/3 lineup.

Considering that the Epson RD-1 was probably not the best experience for them, you may be waiting a long time for another M-mount digital from Cosina.
 
Wow, 3 of the 4 models they offered have been discontinued. I guess it is hard to play second fiddle to all of the used Leicas in the world. CV does well enough because of the price.
 
bensyverson said:
Zeiss has stated unequivocally that they won't be producing a digital ZI, because they're not a camera company. They do lens design. Cosina produces this stuff, so you'd have to convince Cosina that a digital Ikon can thrive alongside Fujifilm's X series, Sony's NEX series, and the Micro 4/3 lineup.
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Wait, are you saying Zeiss just has the ZI because CV wanted them to do it? There is no way that Zeiss doesn't direct CV in its camera producing endeavors. Why would Zeiss let another company make its decisions for it?
 
bensyverson said:
Zeiss has stated unequivocally that they won't be producing a digital ZI, because they're not a camera company. They do lens design. Cosina produces this stuff, so you'd have to convince Cosina that a digital Ikon can thrive alongside Fujifilm's X series, Sony's NEX series, and the Micro 4/3 lineup.

Considering that the Epson RD-1 was probably not the best experience for them, you may be waiting a long time for another M-mount digital from Cosina.
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I've not seen that one. I understand that the reason there is no DZI is that the cost and difficulty of achieving a suitable sensor partnership makes the final product uncompetitive. Consider Zeiss' input into the Nokia 808 - that's at the forefront of camera development.
 
jsrockit said:
Wait, are you saying Zeiss just has the ZI because CV wanted them to do it? There is no way that Zeiss doesn't direct CV in its camera producing endeavors. Why would Zeiss let another company make its decisions for it?
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No, I'm sure Zeiss gave Cosina the overall specifications. I have no doubt that they specified a long baselength, large viewfinder, all-metal construction, etc. However, Zeiss did not design the Ikon from scratch only to have Cosina make it on contract. Cosina clearly filled in many of the blanks, as can be seen by looking at a Bessa and Ikon side-by-side.

Zeiss is a lens company. The probably saw what Cosina was doing with the Bessa, and thought "let's have these guys give us an upgraded Bessa so we can sell some M lenses." Well, that was before they realized they could convince DSLR users to buy manual focus lenses. I'm sure they make way more money selling ZE and ZF lenses than ZM lenses and Ikon bodies.
 
In combination with the things happening at Kodak, it becomes clear what the Mayas meant with the end of world in 2012. ;)
 
bensyverson said:
Zeiss is a lens company. The probably saw what Cosina was doing with the Bessa, and thought "let's have these guys give us an upgraded Bessa so we can sell some M lenses." Well, that was before they realized they could convince DSLR users to buy manual focus lenses. I'm sure they make way more money selling ZE and ZF lenses than ZM lenses and Ikon bodies.
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Well, an optics company, not just a lens company, but I get your point.

http://www.zeiss.com/4125681C00466C26/Contents-Frame/09FEFE9252D1059785256B75005EDDEC

I really would have thought Zeiss designed the ZI at least. Of course they didn't build it. CV builds bodies for other companies as well, but assumed they were designed by the companies which commissioned the body from CV and not designed by CV.
I'm sure they do make more off of its SLR lenses... and that is why its M lenses are always out of stock... because it put its efforts were the money is to be made.
 
In the case of Zeiss and Cosina, it really seems that Zeiss wanted to differentiate its camera from the Bessa line, so there are a number of technical and cosmetic differences. Obviously only the Zeiss and Cosina executives could tell us the design process, but I would imagine it was a back and forth collaboration to create a distinctive camera that could be made for less than a Leica, but more than a Bessa.

If you look at the Bessa line, you understand why they're inexpensive. Not because they're poorly made, but because they reuse the same parts in different cameras. In manufacturing, tooling a new part is expensive, so reusing it drops your cost. Look at the back of the Bessaflex TM, an SLR, and a Bessa R2A. Same film door, grip, advance lever.

The Ikon uses many specially tooled parts, which is probably the main reason for the price premium over the Bessa line. They can't amortize that tooling over multiple cameras. But it's also obvious that the two lines share a lot of DNA.
 
Actually the cost of silver has peaked back in May 2011, $48/oz and then falling down, currently $34/oz. I believe the availability of some half million film Leicas still finding buyers for up to the cost of new ZI bodies could be one of the reasons.

BTW, Cosina seems to be a good candidate for realizing the low cost-all manual, unsophisticated digital rangefinder if we think that they still are able to offer the second best film rangefinder for some $1.600. (And to accomplish it they do not need Zeiss..)
 
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