mikeschmeee
Newbie
Hello all,
First of all I'd like to say hello to everyone at RFF. I've been lurking for a little bit and so far this forum is amazing! I am new to this side of photography as I've been shooting SLR for decades. I haven't shot film since I was very, very young so I'm not sure on all the terminology so please bare with me when I'm trying to describe something.
I received a Zorki-4 from a relative and I think it was broken when I received it or I accidentally broke it some how. I have some Kodak TMAX400 film that I would love to use with my newly acquire Zorki-4 so I've been following the instructions on the "ZORKI-4K HOW TO CLA" as it seems quite similar. I'm at the point where I either put everything back together and hope for the best or hopefully receive some helpful information from some of the great members here at RFF.
The Problem:
I think the shutter speed selector is not aligned properly.
How it happened:
Everything was working the first few days. I wasn't ready to put the film in just yet so I was still getting familiar with the camera and building up my confidence. So I put the camera away back into its original leather case and intended to load the film the next morning. I wake up, get ready to load the film but before I do, I performed one final test. So I turn the winder knob to make sure everything is in working order and suddenly the shutter speed selector does not turn.
Here are some photos to show you what I mean:
As you can see in these images, this is how it would be, correct?? Look at the brass (I think it's made out of brass) part that the shutter speed selector works with. I believe that's how it should sit?
Here are some photographs of how mine currently looks like. The hole that aligns with the brass part and black rod is further off to the left closer towards one of the rangefinder/viewfinder part. It should be a little bit closer pointing towards the back of the camera, where the B is for bulb.
If you look closely, the black rod (again, please excuse my lack of knowledge for the correct terminology) is not aligned correctly with the brass part that has all the slots made for the shutter speed selector. The black rod is misaligned by 45 degrees. There is a screw that goes through the brass part and black rod. If looking at the top of the camera, I believe that the hole should be aligned with where the B for bulb would be. And currently, the cameras shutter speed is set on bulb.
Anyways, I hope some of this makes sense to somebody. I'm a visual person so I'm not great at using my words to get a point across to someone.
Is there a way to align this? Or do I even need to align it? Or is there something else that I'm not seeing here. Any help will be greatly appreciated. I just want to shoot some photos with my new to me camera.
Thanks,
Cheers!
If anyone needs more photos or even a video of what I'm referring to, please let me know.
First of all I'd like to say hello to everyone at RFF. I've been lurking for a little bit and so far this forum is amazing! I am new to this side of photography as I've been shooting SLR for decades. I haven't shot film since I was very, very young so I'm not sure on all the terminology so please bare with me when I'm trying to describe something.
I received a Zorki-4 from a relative and I think it was broken when I received it or I accidentally broke it some how. I have some Kodak TMAX400 film that I would love to use with my newly acquire Zorki-4 so I've been following the instructions on the "ZORKI-4K HOW TO CLA" as it seems quite similar. I'm at the point where I either put everything back together and hope for the best or hopefully receive some helpful information from some of the great members here at RFF.
The Problem:
I think the shutter speed selector is not aligned properly.
How it happened:
Everything was working the first few days. I wasn't ready to put the film in just yet so I was still getting familiar with the camera and building up my confidence. So I put the camera away back into its original leather case and intended to load the film the next morning. I wake up, get ready to load the film but before I do, I performed one final test. So I turn the winder knob to make sure everything is in working order and suddenly the shutter speed selector does not turn.
Here are some photos to show you what I mean:
As you can see in these images, this is how it would be, correct?? Look at the brass (I think it's made out of brass) part that the shutter speed selector works with. I believe that's how it should sit?
Here are some photographs of how mine currently looks like. The hole that aligns with the brass part and black rod is further off to the left closer towards one of the rangefinder/viewfinder part. It should be a little bit closer pointing towards the back of the camera, where the B is for bulb.
If you look closely, the black rod (again, please excuse my lack of knowledge for the correct terminology) is not aligned correctly with the brass part that has all the slots made for the shutter speed selector. The black rod is misaligned by 45 degrees. There is a screw that goes through the brass part and black rod. If looking at the top of the camera, I believe that the hole should be aligned with where the B for bulb would be. And currently, the cameras shutter speed is set on bulb.
Anyways, I hope some of this makes sense to somebody. I'm a visual person so I'm not great at using my words to get a point across to someone.
Is there a way to align this? Or do I even need to align it? Or is there something else that I'm not seeing here. Any help will be greatly appreciated. I just want to shoot some photos with my new to me camera.
Thanks,
Cheers!
If anyone needs more photos or even a video of what I'm referring to, please let me know.
wolves3012
Veteran
Hi there, first off welcome to RFF.
I think you've made the mistake of assuming the selector slots have to align with the marked speeds on the dial above. That is not the case. Remember, the selector piece you see in your photo is only part of things, there is the aluminium piece that sits on top and actually drops into one of the slots. The actual external selector dial is fitted on top of that and can be fitted in any position to show the correct speeds against the index mark.
There are only two possible ways to fit the screw through the "black rod" you mention, the right way and 180 degrees wrong. I'm not entirely convinced you don't have it 180 degrees wrong in your last photo but I don't have a Zorki 4 to hand, in pieces, to check that.
EDIT: as shown in your photo, the shutter speed is not set to any speed at all, since the upper part of the speed selector is not re-fitted.
I think you've made the mistake of assuming the selector slots have to align with the marked speeds on the dial above. That is not the case. Remember, the selector piece you see in your photo is only part of things, there is the aluminium piece that sits on top and actually drops into one of the slots. The actual external selector dial is fitted on top of that and can be fitted in any position to show the correct speeds against the index mark.
There are only two possible ways to fit the screw through the "black rod" you mention, the right way and 180 degrees wrong. I'm not entirely convinced you don't have it 180 degrees wrong in your last photo but I don't have a Zorki 4 to hand, in pieces, to check that.
EDIT: as shown in your photo, the shutter speed is not set to any speed at all, since the upper part of the speed selector is not re-fitted.
mikeschmeee
Newbie
I think I've figured something out. I will post a short video shortly. I'm basically trying to align slow speed mechanism in correspondence with the shutter speed selector.
mikeschmeee
Newbie
First of all, thank you wolves3012 for pointing out that the selector slots do not align with the marked shutter speeds on top of the camera. I now understand why that is after reassembling the camera. Thank you thank you thank you!!!
I had a huge explanation typed out explaining everything but when I clicked post quick reply, I was logged out and lost everything that I typed so here is a very brief summary:
I'm not sure how I got to this point but I think I figured out the issue. It was the black lever not closing the shutter curtain when selecting the slower speeds.
I think this was my original problem I just never realized it when disassembling the camera.
I'm more familiar with the camera now as I've been playing around with the internals, reading a few related Zorki-4 posts on RFF and going over the HOW TO CLA instructions a few times.
Here is a photograph of what I think the issue is and originally was from the very beginning. Again, not knowing that this was the problem.
As you can see from the photo, the black lever that is below the slow speed mechanism is raised by around, 0.5 - 0.7mm? I'm thinking of adding a small and thin piece of either paper, cardboard, business card, anything that can act like a pressure plate in order to keep the black lever pressed down against the very bottom of the silver base (the silver part that has the serial number engraved on the camera, I think it might be aluminum? I'm not an expert)
It is possible that the black plastic rectangle piece that is directly above and connected to the black lever may be slightly wrapped/bent on my camera. Only on the side closest to the shutter speed selector assembly. But when I keep that one side pressed down with an object, everything works perfectly. So perhaps replacing that piece would be the best option but for now I'm thinking of adding a little "something" in order to keep that black lever pressed down flat against the bottom of the top of the camera. (the silver aluminum part with the engraved serial number)
I've tested this little theory by holding a flathead screw driver on the black lever with enough slack to allow the lever to more freely and the camera is fully functional. But when I don't have the lever pressed down with an object such as a screw driver, the lever will block the shutter curtain from closing by blocking the shutter speed assembly. Usually at the 1/4th, 1/8th and 1/15th shutter speeds. Sometimes and the 1 second and 1/2 second as well but not as often as the 1/4th, 1/8th and 1/15th.
Any thoughts?
PS
I'll still post a video of everything for people who may run into this issue in the future.
I had a huge explanation typed out explaining everything but when I clicked post quick reply, I was logged out and lost everything that I typed so here is a very brief summary:
I'm not sure how I got to this point but I think I figured out the issue. It was the black lever not closing the shutter curtain when selecting the slower speeds.
I think this was my original problem I just never realized it when disassembling the camera.
I'm more familiar with the camera now as I've been playing around with the internals, reading a few related Zorki-4 posts on RFF and going over the HOW TO CLA instructions a few times.
Here is a photograph of what I think the issue is and originally was from the very beginning. Again, not knowing that this was the problem.
As you can see from the photo, the black lever that is below the slow speed mechanism is raised by around, 0.5 - 0.7mm? I'm thinking of adding a small and thin piece of either paper, cardboard, business card, anything that can act like a pressure plate in order to keep the black lever pressed down against the very bottom of the silver base (the silver part that has the serial number engraved on the camera, I think it might be aluminum? I'm not an expert)
It is possible that the black plastic rectangle piece that is directly above and connected to the black lever may be slightly wrapped/bent on my camera. Only on the side closest to the shutter speed selector assembly. But when I keep that one side pressed down with an object, everything works perfectly. So perhaps replacing that piece would be the best option but for now I'm thinking of adding a little "something" in order to keep that black lever pressed down flat against the bottom of the top of the camera. (the silver aluminum part with the engraved serial number)
I've tested this little theory by holding a flathead screw driver on the black lever with enough slack to allow the lever to more freely and the camera is fully functional. But when I don't have the lever pressed down with an object such as a screw driver, the lever will block the shutter curtain from closing by blocking the shutter speed assembly. Usually at the 1/4th, 1/8th and 1/15th shutter speeds. Sometimes and the 1 second and 1/2 second as well but not as often as the 1/4th, 1/8th and 1/15th.
Any thoughts?
PS
I'll still post a video of everything for people who may run into this issue in the future.
Last edited:
wolves3012
Veteran
Glad I was able to help. Here's an explanation of what that black lever does: the lever slides sideways, pushed by a light spring. The slow-speed mechanism has a small cam (snail-shaped piece) on the bottom, this cam pushes the lever back against its spring or allows it to slide forwards. When the slow-speed mechanism is wound up, the cam allows the lever to slide towards the speed-selector and once there it blocks the second curtain from closing. When the slow-speed mechanism winds down to its resting position, the black lever is pushed aside by the cam and the curtain is not blocked, so it closes. This is how the various slow speeds work - the slower the speed the more the mechanism is wound and the longer it takes to unwind and release the lever, allowing the curtain to close. Likewise, removing the slow-speed mechanism allows the lever to slide and blocks the second curtain permanently - no speeds work at all with it removed!
If the lever does not move freely (such as if it's bent), the camera will just not work properly. You may have to remove the lever (be very careful not to lose the spring!) and find out what's wrong.
Alternatively, a common and easy mistake is to replace the slow-speed mechanism incorrectly, so the cam is in the wrong position (it's easy to have it sitting on top of the black lever). In that case, the shutter will never close and only the first curtain works.
If the lever does not move freely (such as if it's bent), the camera will just not work properly. You may have to remove the lever (be very careful not to lose the spring!) and find out what's wrong.
Alternatively, a common and easy mistake is to replace the slow-speed mechanism incorrectly, so the cam is in the wrong position (it's easy to have it sitting on top of the black lever). In that case, the shutter will never close and only the first curtain works.
mikeschmeee
Newbie
Here is a little video I put together:
https://youtu.be/WiQ2NZqLnVY
The spring was in the correct spot
The cam was in the right position (NOT sitting on top of the black lever)
The black plate on top of the black lever was bent, pointing upwards towards the top of the camera. I removed it, bent it down so it creates constant pressure on the black lever.
Now the black lever does not pop out of place and all shutter speeds seem to work correctly.... for now. I still have 16 shots left on my first roll of film that I put into this Zorki. The moment of truth will be when these get developed. I'll post them as soon as that happens.
https://youtu.be/WiQ2NZqLnVY
The spring was in the correct spot
The cam was in the right position (NOT sitting on top of the black lever)
The black plate on top of the black lever was bent, pointing upwards towards the top of the camera. I removed it, bent it down so it creates constant pressure on the black lever.
Now the black lever does not pop out of place and all shutter speeds seem to work correctly.... for now. I still have 16 shots left on my first roll of film that I put into this Zorki. The moment of truth will be when these get developed. I'll post them as soon as that happens.