99.9livelya
Newbie
Howdy,
I have recently acquired a Zorki 3M from Fedka and am full of G.A.S. Though I am very happy with the performance of the Jupiter 8 it came with, I am looking for a wider angle lens-probably a jupiter 12. Looking around though, I was wondering about the compatibility of other companies like Canon or Voigtlander. Are all LTM systems compatible? What's the word? Thanks, in advance.
I have recently acquired a Zorki 3M from Fedka and am full of G.A.S. Though I am very happy with the performance of the Jupiter 8 it came with, I am looking for a wider angle lens-probably a jupiter 12. Looking around though, I was wondering about the compatibility of other companies like Canon or Voigtlander. Are all LTM systems compatible? What's the word? Thanks, in advance.
P
pshinkaw
Guest
In theory, all LTM lens should be able to operate on all LTM bodies and on M bodies with the proper adapter.
In practice however, there are some problem issues related to the back focus and helical pitch between some Soviet LTM lenses and LTM bodies (including other Soviet LTM bodies). I think that they are minor problems, but you may want to decide that for yourself.
The Jupiter-12 in particular has trouble fitting on some LTM bodies without causing an internal mechanical collision. The rear lens elements protrude to a great extent, and LTM bodies which have internal components like exposure meters or light baffles may not work satisfactorily with a J-12.
Also, some LTM lenses with focusing tabs will crash into the self-timer levers of some of the Fed-2 models. It is a minor problem which can be addressed by removing the lever, cutting the tab, or just buying a better fitting lens.
-Paul
In practice however, there are some problem issues related to the back focus and helical pitch between some Soviet LTM lenses and LTM bodies (including other Soviet LTM bodies). I think that they are minor problems, but you may want to decide that for yourself.
The Jupiter-12 in particular has trouble fitting on some LTM bodies without causing an internal mechanical collision. The rear lens elements protrude to a great extent, and LTM bodies which have internal components like exposure meters or light baffles may not work satisfactorily with a J-12.
Also, some LTM lenses with focusing tabs will crash into the self-timer levers of some of the Fed-2 models. It is a minor problem which can be addressed by removing the lever, cutting the tab, or just buying a better fitting lens.
-Paul
rbiemer
Unabashed Amateur
Welcome aboard!
I think you've chosen the best looking FSU(Former Soviet Union) camera to start with. I love mine. And you've got the most important thing figured out--buy from a good seller.
Lenses are going to be an adventure. I owned a J-12 and it worked fine on my Zorki 3m. I have traded it because I also use a Bessa R and while the CV 35 lens works on my Zorki, the J-12 wouldn't work on the Bessa. If you're only using the Zorki that's not an issue. What might be is the focusing "tab" or "collar" on the rear of any lens you're thinking about. Some lenses have a collar that is a full circle(like the J-8 and the other FSU lenses) and some lenses have a collar that is cut away except where the lever in the camera will contact the lens when it is mounted. This can cause problems in mounting the lens.
The other thing to watch out for is that there are lenses that use the 39mm thread of the LTM lenses but are made for the 39mm SLR cameras--these lenses will not focus correctly since they are set for a very different lens to film distance.
Fedkas descriptions are clear on this point. And the way his inventory is organized makes it pretty easy to narrow down the choices for your Zorki.
Hope this is more helpful than confusing. Enjoy that Zorki!
Rob
I think you've chosen the best looking FSU(Former Soviet Union) camera to start with. I love mine. And you've got the most important thing figured out--buy from a good seller.
Lenses are going to be an adventure. I owned a J-12 and it worked fine on my Zorki 3m. I have traded it because I also use a Bessa R and while the CV 35 lens works on my Zorki, the J-12 wouldn't work on the Bessa. If you're only using the Zorki that's not an issue. What might be is the focusing "tab" or "collar" on the rear of any lens you're thinking about. Some lenses have a collar that is a full circle(like the J-8 and the other FSU lenses) and some lenses have a collar that is cut away except where the lever in the camera will contact the lens when it is mounted. This can cause problems in mounting the lens.
The other thing to watch out for is that there are lenses that use the 39mm thread of the LTM lenses but are made for the 39mm SLR cameras--these lenses will not focus correctly since they are set for a very different lens to film distance.
Fedkas descriptions are clear on this point. And the way his inventory is organized makes it pretty easy to narrow down the choices for your Zorki.
Hope this is more helpful than confusing. Enjoy that Zorki!
Rob
reagan
hey, they're only Zorkis
All of my little flock of lenses, except one Elmar 90mm, are FSU glass. So all, including the Elmar, work fine on my Zorki 3M. -- Jupiters, Industars, Orion. But, as you know, there's lots of LTM lenses out there. Maybe some of the guys will post a note/list here particular FSU, CV, Canon, Leica or other lenses that they've had trouble mounting and/or using on a Zorki.
Rob, have you had any trouble with a tab rubbing or otherwise not working well on your 3M? I haven't - so I was just curious. (I have read this problem on some FEDs, as pshinkaw mentioned.)
But just wanted to say, "Welcome to RFF, 99.9livelya!" IMO, the 3M is definately a winner. You'll find plenty of glass to get GASsed on. Enjoy it and the Forum! And let us know what you find out in your lens search.
I echo Rob's praise of the Jupiter 12; a good lens on the 3M. And his warning ~ watch for Zenit 39mm [SLR] lenses. Been there/done that .... once ...... didn't like it and got the blurry negs to prove it.
Rob, have you had any trouble with a tab rubbing or otherwise not working well on your 3M? I haven't - so I was just curious. (I have read this problem on some FEDs, as pshinkaw mentioned.)
But just wanted to say, "Welcome to RFF, 99.9livelya!" IMO, the 3M is definately a winner. You'll find plenty of glass to get GASsed on. Enjoy it and the Forum! And let us know what you find out in your lens search.
I echo Rob's praise of the Jupiter 12; a good lens on the 3M. And his warning ~ watch for Zenit 39mm [SLR] lenses. Been there/done that .... once ...... didn't like it and got the blurry negs to prove it.
rbiemer
Unabashed Amateur
No, I haven't had any trouble with the lenses I own(CV, FSU and the lone Leitz) but I remember reading about this--maybe at the Kiev Report? can't recall--with some examples so I have avoided any lenses without a full circle focus cam(? I need to bone up on the correct nomenclature for this stuff). I figure the FSU cameras are already QC challenged so why add another possible hindrance to function? My understanding is that the shape of the focus lever in the camera is sort of pointy rather than rounded so it won't ride over the cam as the lens is being mounted and that the "partial cam" might not line up with the focus lever once the lens is fully seated.
I'll dig a bit and see if I can find the specific resource for this. If I do, I'll post it here.
Rob
I'll dig a bit and see if I can find the specific resource for this. If I do, I'll post it here.
Rob
Kim Coxon
Moderator
The problem can be alleviated if the lens is mounted and unmounted with the focus set to the closet point as this withdraws the tongue.
Kim
Kim
reagan
hey, they're only Zorkis
My bad Rob. My mind was on the infinity lock ("tab"). Got your meaning now. I've read the built-for-Zorki lenses with the slightly thicker infinity lock (on collapsables) rubbed on some FED bodies. Thought maybe you had that experience........ never mind...
I'll sit down and shut up now.
rbiemer
Unabashed Amateur
No, my bad I think. Iv'e been using poor terminology about this.CVBLZ4 said:My bad Rob. My mind was on the infinity lock ("tab"). Got your meaning now. I've read the built-for-Zorki lenses with the slightly thicker infinity lock rubbed on some FED bodies. Thought maybe you had that experience........ never mind...
The otherwise wonderfull Industar 50 collapsible I own does that(the infinity lock rubs and won't release) when I've tried to mount it on a FED 5. Not really much of a problem since I rarely use that camera. On the FED2 I used to own, the I-50 worked just fine.
Rob
peterc
Heretic
Not exactly. My FED2 will not work with my J12. The lens is fine on both of my Zorkis (3M and 4K).99.9livelya said:
My other lenses (J8 chrome and black, Industar 28m and Steinheil 85/2.8) work fine on all three cameras.
I understand the fix is some bending of the lever that connects with the lens. However, since the FED (which has a nice wide RF base) works fine with my 85mm I'm reluctant to attempt something that could screw it up.
Peter
I haven't had any problems with my J8, but this is an interesting article.
http://www.dantestella.com/technical/compat.html
http://www.dantestella.com/technical/compat.html
Nickfed
Well-known
greyhoundman said:
I'm pretty sure that the rangefinder arm and follower are a common problem. The arm could get quite easily abused when changing lenses with frozen fingers in Red Square. Mine worked OK but was bent so that I could feel it grinding when putting the original lens. Other lenses were fine, so there are little differences in body diameter between different types but I imagine those differences are coinsistent within themselves i.e. all I-50s are the same but are different from I-10s. The arm was visibly bent and the problem was fixed by straightening it. The FED lens was confirmed as being nothing extraordinary by checking it in a Zorki-6.
I also suspect that the RF arm is a key player, but ignored, in the discussions about Leica and Contax standards. In view of the fact that
1. Pre-war FEDs were all a bit chancey in this department, and could therefore be ignored and
2. All Soviet lenses were Contax copies and might as well stay that way, particularly now that we have all the real McCoy tools etc.
any 1940s soviet engineer not anticipating a one-way trip to Siberia, could resolve any "conflict of standards" problem by the simple expedient of lengthening the RF arm of all LTM cameras by about 1/3mm over the Leica original, thereby ensuring the Zeiss lenses did what they were supposed to do. As Stella says, who cares if a Leica lens is incompatible? The proletariat shouldn't be using them, and you might be able to blame Wetzlar for the discrepancy anyway. So, if anybody gets to measure them, and finds that the pivot radius of the RF arm in a FED is 1/3mm longer than a Leica, remember where you heard it first.
Be that as it may, as Stella points out, there is a lot of other stuff going on and the conflict of standards is a pretty minor player. Hell, it took me years to find out there might be a problem. Ah, the bliss of ignorance........
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