Canon Serenar 50/1.8 C&L

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marke

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Last year I got a Canon rangefinder, a model IVS, if I am correct in my research. It came with a Serenar 50/1.8 lens. I think I paid about $30 for both. Unfortuantely the shutter curtains have shown to have pinholes, and I'm not sure what I'll do with it at this point. I might attempt to replace them myself, if anyone can tell me if the curtains are availalable and it isn't too difficult.

Anyhow, I've been having fun lately, doing a cleaning of both my Summitar and an IVOOH. So today I pulled apart the Serenar and everything went well. There was a lot of haze on a couple of the internal elements, most likely due to the oil on the aperture blades. I wasn't able to get all the oil off the blades, so I'm assuming that I might have to repeat the process again sometime in the future.

The only problem with the lens now are some very prominent cleaning marks on the front element. I just shot a roll of fill and even if the cleaning marks prove to be bad enough not affect the IQ, I've still had fun and learned something about this particular lens. My question is, is it possible for an average Joe like myself to remove some of these marks, or is this something that just isn't going to happen?
 
There are firms that offer recoating services and if the marks are only to the coating this will do it. (But the coatings are only single coated so far as I know . But I would not worry too much as indicated below buy a hood.

I recently bought a Canon 50mm f1.2 to use as a portrait lens. It has some quite bad damage to the front element and is very low contrast (the latter I think is in its nature when shot wide open.) But the scratches / cleaning marks which are very substantial seemed to have little effect on image quality even when shot with some bright but not "point" light sources in front (which I thought would be fatal.) I have no doubt it will compromise the image by flaring if there are stronger direct light forward of the lens but lenses like this are surprisingly usable. I intend ear - marking my lens as a special use one and will avoid circumstances where I know it will find them problematic so its best not to get over concerned until you see the results and know if you can live with them.

BTW I also have the Canon 50mm f18 in earlier and later versions (but not the Serenar) and both are naturally much better in the contrast department. Incidentally I wish I could find a hood for my 1.2 but that blasted things are rare and often sell for as much as the lens itself.

http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=85282

On the issue of the shutter curtains you may be able to "make and mend" if the damage is not too bad. See this link (and many others like it)

http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=85333
 
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marke said:
Last year I got a Canon rangefinder, a model IVS, if I am correct in my research. It came with a Serenar 50/1.8 lens. I think I paid about $30 for both. Unfortuantely the shutter curtains have shown to have pinholes, and I'm not sure what I'll do with it at this point. I might attempt to replace them myself, if anyone can tell me if the curtains are availalable and it isn't too difficult.

Anyhow, I've been having fun lately, doing a cleaning of both my Summitar and an IVOOH. So today I pulled apart the Serenar and everything went well. There was a lot of haze on a couple of the internal elements, most likely due to the oil on the aperture blades. I wasn't able to get all the oil off the blades, so I'm assuming that I might have to repeat the process again sometime in the future.

The only problem with the lens now are some very prominent cleaning marks on the front element. I just shot a roll of fill and even if the cleaning marks prove to be bad enough not affect the IQ, I've still had fun and learned something about this particular lens. My question is, is it possible for an average Joe like myself to remove some of these marks, or is this something that just isn't going to happen?
Click to expand...

If you want to replace your curtains, Aki-Asahi and Micro Tools both sell the shutter curtain material and ribbons/tapes you'll need. Alternatively, you can patch the holes. I've heard about people using Liquid Electrical Tape, washable fabric paint and a mix of bookbinder's glue and lampblack to do this. You apply it with a sharpened matchstick or a sharp toothpick and you keep the patch as small as you can (try to confine it to pretty much just the hole). It works -- IF we're talking about just one or two or three tiny pin holes.

I assume you're talking about flush cleaning the aperture blades. Yes, you're going to have to repeat the process to get the oil off of the aperture blades. You may have to repeat the process many times, but if you're patient, you can do it. You're also going to have to wipe them several times during the process.

No, you can't remove scratches in your lens elements -- not without changing the optical characteristics of the lens. What you can do, although it looks like hell, is fill them in with black ink and then polish the stuff off of the surface. This keeps the scratches from flaring and it won't have any effect on the photos you take with that lens.
 
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Brian: Thanks for the reassurance on the lens condition. Do you know at all what kind of hood I need to look for?

FallisPhoto: Thanks for the suggestions for tools and shutter curtain supplies. I assume that this curtain has to be made from scratch. Do I use the old one as a template then? Last time I shot a roll through that camera, I remember it having several pinholes, so it might just be best to replace it. If you can't open a back door to check for exact hole locations, how else can you do it? Also, thanks for the extra info on flushing out the aperture blades. What would you suggest I use? I thought lighter fluid might be good. BTW, I had heard of the black ink on the lens trick. It might have the late Al Kaplan who I heard mention it once.

Peter: Thanks for the info and the extra thread on this subject. I'm actually planning to use a similar product to patch up some light leaks on a 1912 Conley 4x5 I have.
 
BTW, guys, this is what I got after cleaning the Serenar.

original.jpg
 
If you take a strong lens (like a Serenar! - a great lens!) have a look at the front of the curtains - try wound up and at rest. If you can see them (they can be very small) try the above remedies or a mix of carpet latex glue and copier toner. Flexible and 'very' black. Put it on with a toothpick.
I bought the same lens (you got a bargain!) and there was some kind of hard lumpy stuff on the front of the rear cluster. Cleaned that off and am amazed at the images it gives. Also - it is the only 50mm lens that keeps the Bessa balanced flat, it's so heavy.
Enjoy.
Murray
 
marke said:
FallisPhoto: Thanks for the suggestions for tools and shutter curtain supplies. I assume that this curtain has to be made from scratch. Do I use the old one as a template then?
Click to expand...

That would work, as long as the old one fits right and isn't baggy then you can take your measurements from it.

marke said:
Last time I shot a roll through that camera, I remember it having several pinholes, so it might just be best to replace it. If you can't open a back door to check for exact hole locations, how else can you do it?
Click to expand...

Uh... I'd have thought this one would be pretty obvious. In order for them to have come into being, sunlight had to be focused on them. Therefore they are visible from the front. You take the lens off.

marke said:
Also, thanks for the extra info on flushing out the aperture blades. What would you suggest I use? I thought lighter fluid might be good.
Click to expand...

Yes, lighter fluid (naptha) would be the solvent of choice. You're also going to need a whole lot of Q-tips. You put it on with a sopping wet end, work the aperture a few times, close it down to your smallest aperture, and then mop it up with the dry end. Repeat about 50 to 100 times on each side of the blades (BTW, that's not a joke or an exaggeration -- if you're not going to take it apart and hand-clean each piece, it usually takes between 50 and 100 times). Wait a full 24 hours for everything to dry out before reinstalling the lens elements and testing it in the camera.
 
Murray Kelly said:
... try the above remedies or a mix of carpet latex glue and copier toner. Flexible and 'very' black. Put it on with a toothpick.
Click to expand...

I've heard about that one too, but you have to be VERY careful with copier toner. Mishandled badly enough, some of the plasticized carbon toners used in laser printers are pretty deadly (cancer and/or chemical pneumonia). carbon powder is known to be a strong and persistent carcinogen; by plasticizing it, they have made it into a pretty strong irritant as well and have so increased the risk. If it gets into the air in any quantity it can be just as bad as inhaling asbestos powder.
 
The shutter curtain on my IIIc developed a pinhole. I got some brush on electrical tape on the advice of this thread:

http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=56491

and the fix proved easy and effective. I would try this before sending the camera out to have the shutter curtains replace.

Mark -- Nice job cleaning that Serenar lens! I've got one of the later chrome and black versions of the Canon 50/1.8, and it's a superb lens.
 
I guess I'm doubting myself now, wondering if I really do have shutter curtain pinholes. I really can't detect anything that look like holes in the curtain. I just assumed that they would be so small that the fabric's structure might make them difficult to detect without something like a flashlight shining behind the curtain.

The reason why I initially thought it had pinholes was because of several small pinpoints if light that came through on the pictures. Last night I searched for the negs, but I think I must have tossed them. I'm finishing off a roll in the camera and hope to get it shot and processed today.
 
marke said:
I guess I'm doubting myself now, wondering if I really do have shutter curtain pinholes. I really can't detect anything that look like holes in the curtain. I just assumed that they would be so small that the fabric's structure might make them difficult to detect without something like a flashlight shining behind the curtain.

The reason why I initially thought it had pinholes was because of several small pinpoints if light that came through on the pictures. Last night I searched for the negs, but I think I must have tossed them. I'm finishing off a roll in the camera and hope to get it shot and processed today.
Click to expand...


Well, if you find small light pinpoints at the same location on each negative, that would suggest a pinhole in the shutter curtain (to me, at least).
 
Steve, that's exactly they way I remember the negs turning out. But for the life of me, I am not able to actually see anything on the curtain itself that would clue me into where they might be. I guess I must be blind. :confused:

I'm going to drop the film off at Walgreen's in a little while, and I should have some indication what's going on by the end of the day.

Thanks for all the replies.
 
marke said:
Steve, that's exactly they way I remember the negs turning out. But for the life of me, I am not able to actually see anything on the curtain itself that would clue me into where they might be. I guess I must be blind. :confused:

I'm going to drop the film off at Walgreen's in a little while, and I should have some indication what's going on by the end of the day.

Thanks for all the replies.
Click to expand...

Remember they'll be upside down and backwards from where they are in the image. You probably know this, but I constantly forget when looking for light leaks.

ie. if in the sky, they'll be close to the bottom of the camera.
 
Looks like it's (new) curtains for this cowboy!

Looks like it's (new) curtains for this cowboy!

Wow, I didn't remember it being this bad. I'm not sure yet if I'll attempt this myself, or just give Eddy a call. I really don't want to keep this camera anyway, since the squinty VF doesn't work well with my eyeglasses. So maybe I'm just better off trying to replace the curtains myself. Oh well, at least I got a halfway decent lens for my $30.

I still don't know how guys guys can see these pinholes by just looking at the fabric, and I'm not able to see anything. :confused:

original.jpg

original.jpg
 
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