New Rollei Retro 100 Tonal film

[Fotohuis]

Robert V is a reseller, so his posts are advertising.

Indeed, I am advertizing on APUG and have therefore the status ADVERTIZER in case you did not notice.

I think it's very important in case of questions to have first hand information by the factory or distributor. This can be a strong point of a forum but has always some disadvantages too.

Indeed Retro 80S is also available on 127 format.

 

[bensyverson]

It's always good to see a brand new film on the market. Ultimately, a roll of film is not expensive, so if someone tries it out and doesn't like it, it's not the end of the world.

 

[M like Leica M6]

When Maco did it, for example with the first 80S samples, critical test reports were published as well. Especially at aphog.de !! And they were not eleminated, look at the aphog pages and you will see it.
All the evidence that you are wrong is visible for everyone at aphog.

Well, you say that critics of Maco are not kicked out? I know about a dozen of them. Aphog is Maco's territory, there is no doubt about it. Just see what the moderators do - oh, btw, even one of them was bullied and left.

And he has published one photo, so you can judge yourself.

I did, but you you don't like the verdict. That's all.

The Rollei Bashers will never admit that they are paid for their activities.

Name one "paid Rollei Basher". Just one.

But make sure you are really sure that he is really a "paid basher". This is a grave accusation because such behaviour would be unfair competition if a competitor of Maco is behind this. By the way, surreptitious advertsing is unfair competition, too. And bashing critics is just bad style and really uncool.

 

[skahde]

Maco has made (or at least distributed) some magnificent films, but unfortunately, they also have a tendency to exaggerate the qualities and applicability of some of them.

Nice summary, Roger. Add to that the tendency to react with
Paranoia to the often temperamental and hot headed criticism and you have the picture. Whatever it is: It's never Macos fault but the result of an evil conspiracy.

Somebody should tell them that the whole plot doesn't sound too convincing and they should rather grab their own nose.

 

[Fotohuis]

It's a bit sad that open discussion forums are going to be poisened by such radical reactions instead of a nice source for new products and hints to make the best about your hobby.

Maybe a reason some aquintances and very knowledgable people stopped already writing in some forums which is certainly a pitty.

 

[skahde]

It's a bit sad that open discussion forums are going to be poisened by such radical reactions instead of a nice source for new products and hints to make the best about your hobby.

I doubt we will see any thread soon about anything concerning Maco with a considerate discussion of pros and cons. Too much blood left on the carpet, too much ephedrine still floating around.

It would need someone like the Dalai Lama in Macos Online-Marketing to end this circle but at the moment Genghis Khan seems to run the business.

 

[M like Leica M6]

It's a bit sad that open discussion forums are going to be poisened by such radical reactions instead of a nice source for new products and hints to make the best about your hobby.

Maybe a reason some aquintances and very knowledgable people stopped already writing in some forums which is certainly a pitty.

As you wrote earlier in this thread, you are an advertiser on APUG. But you and others flood APUG, RFF, Photo.net and many other forums with spam. May I ask if you are an advertiser on RFF? Why do you believe that every forum is free advertising space for you?

Whenever you or a group of Maco orks are criticized for their "marketing" methods the reaction is "there are people that hate us". Whenever the quality of their products is criticized the reaction is "you are all paid Maco bashers".

Really?

Or are you just getting more and more paranoid? Why don't you think about your penetrant forum spam?

Here are some questions to think about:

Do Ilford, Kodak and Fuji spam forums with lengthy discussions about their great products? Do they fill pages with verbose sanctification and self-adulation? No, they don't. They create a press release, buy ads and that's it.

Do Ilford, Kodak and Fuji curse at critics that say "that film has more grain than I would accept"? Do they bad-mouth consumers that said "your developer smells bad"? Do they backbite customers as "paid bashers" because they don't like a company's marketing style in general? No, they don't. They will improve their products or their methods, and that's it.

None of these companies would ever make a fool of themselves by misbehaving in such an unprofessional manner.

Ask yourself: don't you and other Maco dealers (and all those fake users that are constantly kicked out of forums) actually deserve being criticized for such unprofessional behaviour?

 

[Fotohuis]

But you and others flood APUG, RFF, Photo.net and many other forums with spam

YOU consider it as spam, many others see it as valuable information. For me Fotohuis is an extended hobby.

How different forum rules can be and how a policy can be interpreted you can read about a reaction (last week) of one of the moderators of above mentioned Photo.net:

We try to accommodate replies from members with connections to the photography industry within reasonable limits. Those reasonable limits may include replies to specific questions about products or services, but not initiating threads to promote products or services.
As with Helen Oster from Adorama, Henry Posner from B&H and a few other folks including David Carper when he was with Ilford (and Canon's Chuck Westfall on the old CompuServe forums in the 1990s-early 2000s), Robert Vonk has never misrepresented himself or his interest in the business (Fotohuis) here on photo.net. He provides many informative and accurate replies to questions that do not in any way involve any promotion or other self-serving interests.
Because he has consistently cooperated with photo.net's policies we're happy to accommodate his constructive input here.

So you can start up a discussion if direct answers are allowed from manufacturers and/or distributors in any forum. And I agree with you that you have to follow certain forum rules otherwise it's not very pleasant to read a forum anymore.

Valuable information is given in mentioned APUG, Photo.net and RFF but you are not forced to read it at all and of course you can have your own opinion about each photo product.

 

[skahde]

YOU consider it as spam, many others see it as valuable information. For me Fotohuis is an extended hobby.

As I see it, it should be the moderators decision if advertisement/valuable information like this is acceptable in a forum or not and it is up to the users to choose if they want to take part in this forum or not. There is room for everyone, somewhere.

Just my 2 cents.

 

[skahde]

None of these companies would ever make a fool of themselves by misbehaving in such an unprofessional manner.

Clemens, I think you nailed it but it is a waste of time to step on that soapbox again. You wil not change anything and for this forum it is some kind of strange foreign affair.

In the german forums everybody has digged their trenches and it is more or less a non-declared cease fire between Maco and its critics. I think it could stay that way at least for a while.

 

[Phantomas]

I don't know what all these people are talking about... anywhoo, I'm here coz I discovered to my surprise that I have exposed this Rollei Tonal 100 film a couple of weeks ago. "Discovered" because it came as a freebie from Maco a couple of months ago and as the package is indistinguishable from regular Retro 100 I didn't pay it any attention. So I exposed a couple of rolls and as I prepared to develop two rolls together discovered they had different colors - one was very brown another very purple. I even thought what a ghetto operation this film manufacturer was running if the same film looks so different But closer inspection showed one's called "Rollei Retro 100" another "Rollei Retro 100 (Tonal)". I was too lazy to get distracted from developing and just ran them both through Rollei RHS developer together. Results (film itself) were very different. "Regular" Rollei was dense while the tonal Rollei very transparent, although looks OK exposed/processed. This one also says "Rollei Tonal 100" on the filmstrip itself. I googled and not too much info on this film yet. Just APUG and this thread on RFF. Even Maco doesn't seem to list it. Will have to scan it soon to see what it's all about.

 

[Fotohuis]

Here is the Rollei Retro 100 TONAL data:

http://www.fotohuisrovo.nl/documentatie/DatasheetRolleiRetro100TONALn.pdf

By coincedence RHS/AM74 has with a lot of films the same developing time. 1+7 5:00 minutes or 1+9 6:00 minutes.

Here some examples of the film with developing data:
http://gallery.fotohuisrovo.nl/thumbnails.php?album=18

Till November 2010 the film is at Maco available in sheet film. After this period in all formats (135-36, 100ft/30,5m and 120 roll film.)

The film is available in all formats since July 2010 at Maco's worldwide distributors.

 

[c.poulton]

It's always good to see a brand new film on the market. Ultimately, a roll of film is not expensive, so if someone tries it out and doesn't like it, it's not the end of the world.

Exactly my thoughts on this matter. I will most probably try this film out and make my own judgements on it. Why is there so much negativity around - and please, lets try and be civil to one another.....

 

[120-127]

Wow. I came here to learn more about this film and was shocked at the vitriol. I've ordered some of it and that will be my evaluative tool. For the record, I have always found Robert V's technical data (here and on Flickr) useful. In the end it comes down to personal experience with an emulsion.

 

[Peter_Jones]

Wow. I came here to learn more about this film and was shocked at the vitriol. I've ordered some of it and that will be my evaluative tool. For the record, I have always found Robert V's technical data (here and on Flickr) useful. In the end it comes down to personal experience with an emulsion.

Hi 120-127, welcome to the forum.

Take the vitriol with a pinch of salt - this is very much an international forum, sometimes subtle meanings can be lost in translation or have differing cultural connotations.

Give the film a try and see how you get on with it. Stick with the forum, there's a lot of good advice on here, and a lot of collective knowledge. Best to view any vitriol as good-natured banter

 

[Fotohuis]

By the demise of Fotokemika / Efke (August 2012) a lot of films can not be produced anymore.

Efke 25-50-100, simmilar Adox CHS 25-50-100, IR820. Rollei Pan 25, ATO2,1, Adox/Rollei Ortho 25 and this Rollei Retro 100 TONAL.

And the Efke photo papers, Varimax, Varycon and their Adox equivalents.

It is a pity that some interesting materials are finished in such a short time and that there is no replacement.

 

[HHPhoto]

Wow. I came here to learn more about this film and was shocked at the vitriol. I've ordered some of it and that will be my evaluative tool.

It does not make sense to put work in this film now, because it is gone and will never come back (this film was just Fotokemika's Efke 100 with a different sensitization).
Due to my experience with this film it is no loss that it is gone.
I was quite disappointed.

The claim that this film can resolve 260 lp/mm is just bull****, really.
I've done some resolution tests with this film and it was only on the same level as Kodak Plus X, and much worse to APX 100, TMX, Acros and Delta 100.
Some friends of mine did similar tests and got the same results.

For the 'ortho-look' now I am using a blue filter and Delta 100. Gives me excellent detail rendition (much better than Retro 100 Tonal) and the tonality I like.

Cheers, Jan