Reasonable Leica?

To be honest, there is no reasonable Leica.

The best you can get away with is an M2 and 35/2.5 Color Skopar (outstanding lens and combo). If you shop carefully, you won't need to go through CLA. Loading an M2 is easy.

Roland.
 
Buy an M6.

If you are new to Leica you don't want anything esoteric or with foibles, you want a camera that simply does a good job, has a bright viewfinder with plenty of framelines, comes with a meter, and one that is easy to adjust and repair, and one that has no 'collector value', and one that is the easiest to use, buy, and sell.

The point about having as many framelines as possible is important for a Leica novice. You don't have the luxury to sit back and pontificate that 'all I need are the 35mm and 50mm framelines so an M2 is the best camera in the world'. You are finding your way, and will probably want to experiment with wildly different focal lengths (before later settling down to the boring future of self satisfaction in being happy with maybe two or three). So give yourself a head start and limit the number of external finders you may have to buy to only those wider than 28mm.

Steve
 
The Canon LTM 50/1.8 (chrome version) is an amazing lens. It might be just me lacking sensibility, but I don't see much difference from the shots I took with it from the ones taken with my Summicron Dual Range. Filters might be a hassle, and handling/ergonomy will be different, but these are again very personal. And it's a bit fast. And it's cheap. Along with an M2 you will have a fantastic camera+lens kit and for as low as 800 bucks.
 
One of those M5s in the classifieds just now would be a fantastic body- a little more than your $1K, but no CLA needed...
 
newspaperguy said:
There are people, myself included, who after using/owning various M models,
have migrated to the CL and feel no sense of loss whatever. It is a Leica.
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I'll second that and, once you've bought both lenses, there's nothing else to tempt you.

Just don't look on it as an investment. I've had mine since the year dot and everything has been back to Leitz and I doubt if I could get my money back plus inflation.

Regards, David
 
Beemermark said:
I'd make a guess you never owned an M2, M3 or M4.
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Yes.... This does seem to be along the lines of "The Leicas I've tried are best."

Since 1975 or so I've had 3x M3, and while they're probably the best built of all Leicas, the lack of a 35mm frame is a deal breaker for me, so I don't have one now for 20 years or so.

The M2 (again, I've had several, and still have one)) is a delight, especially with a Rapidwinder on the bottom, but actually, I like meters.

My M4-P is the worst Leica I've ever used (rough, with a flary viewfinder) and I never wanted an M5 (too big) or a CL (short RF base, dents easily -- friends had them).

M6/M6ttl is OK if you don't mind the flary finder, M7 OK if you don't mind battery dependency and a backwards film speed dial (which troubles me less than I expected on the M8/M9). I've never even tried an M4 or M4-2: I've handled them, but never to use.

Cheers,

R.
 
sparrow6224 said:
M4, M4-P, or M2 -- all excellent. I love my M2. I love my CL too but it is a different experience mainly due to the smaller viewfinder. While you're saving up for mega buck Leica lenses here are some suggestions:

CV (that stands for Cosina Voigtlander) 35mm f/2.5 pancake. Best 35mm lens for the money I know of. Mine just keeps shocking me with its image quality. Can be found used for under $300. You'll need the 35-135 LTM/M adapater ring which is about $20 from Hong Kong.

Canon 50mm f/1.8 screw mount lens -- amazing lens selling for about $125-160 these days. A stunner. Again you'll need 50-75 LTM/M adapter ring.

Leica 90mm f/4 Elmar-C OR Canon 100 f/3.5 Both fabulous, small and cheap. The Canon would require the 28/90 adapter plus you'd learn to adjust your expectations for a slightly smaller frame than what you're seeing in the VF. Both for under $200.
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The M4-P, CV 35/2.5, Canon 50/1.8, and Elmar 90 are my basic kit, which was assembled on a tight budget. Added a CV 50/1.5 later.

All good bang-for-buck choices. Hey, I'm cheap, I will admit it!
 
Fireboy said:
you sound practical and economically wise. But not cheap.
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Indeed, a nikon fm with a 50/1.8 counts as cheap, but no Leica does!

Re: Roger. It is true we tend to recommend the Leica we own. I would be the first to recommend steering away from the CL, but otherwise 'never met a Leica I didn't like'. Don't even mind mixing shutterspeed dials or viewfinder magnifications. It's not as complicated as it sounds, it's not like mixing brands of DSLR's ;)

But the way you put it it's like there's something wrong with every M, and this is exactly what confused me early on. If you read the wrong threads, people make it sound like all Leicas are terrible cameras for having a bit of flare, a difficult loading mechanism, an unpractical rewinder, inaccurate framelines or not having a self-timer, and whichever you choose you'll hate it. In fact it's the other way around: you'll probably end up loving the one you choose, unless you spend too much time browsing topics about what might be wrong about it.


... Only reason I hated my first M (had a CL first) was that it had light leaks apparently common to a series of m6's. Really just another anecdote to worry about though, nothing wrong with m6's. Or any other M really. Just buy the one you can afford, looks good, feels good in your hands, has the smoothest winder, falls in your lap. Then order a bunch of film and shut down your computer permanently. :p
 
braver said:
Indeed, a nikon fm with a 50/1.8 counts as cheap, but no Leica does!

Re: Roger. It is true we tend to recommend the Leica we own. I would be the first to recommend steering away from the CL, but otherwise 'never met a Leica I didn't like'. Don't even mind mixing shutterspeed dials or viewfinder magnifications. It's not as complicated as it sounds, it's not like mixing brands of DSLR's ;)

But the way you put it it's like there's something wrong with every M, and this is exactly what confused me early on. If you read the wrong threads, people make it sound like all Leicas are terrible cameras for having a bit of flare, a difficult loading mechanism, an unpractical rewinder, inaccurate framelines or not having a self-timer, and whichever you choose you'll hate it. In fact it's the other way around: you'll probably end up loving the one you choose, unless you spend too much time browsing topics about what might be wrong about it.


... Only reason I hated my first M (had a CL first) was that it had light leaks apparently common to a series of m6's. Really just another anecdote to worry about though, nothing wrong with m6's. Or any other M really. Just buy the one you can afford, looks good, feels good in your hands, has the smoothest winder, falls in your lap. Then order a bunch of film and shut down your computer permanently. :p
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Well, there is. Nothing's perfect. Just choose the least imperfect, or the ones where the imperfections don't worry you.

But I fully take your point that even the 'bad' ones are (mostly) pretty good.

Cheers.

R.
 
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ferider said:
To be honest, there is no reasonable Leica.

The best you can get away with is an M2 and 35/2.5 Color Skopar (outstanding lens and combo). If you shop carefully, you won't need to go through CLA. Loading an M2 is easy.

Roland.
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This is exactly what I would recommend. Great combo and less than $1000. You can even get a used Sekonic L-308s light meter if you don't have one and probably stay under $1000.
 
sepiareverb said:
I've never found this to be a problem- and shoot an M7 or M8/9 alongside an MP very often.
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It worries me far less than I expected but I'd still find it easier to have the shutter speed dials on my M8 and M9 reversed. Leica tells me that this is perfectly possible and were open to the idea of offering it either à la carte or as a conversion, but they haven't done so yet.

Cheers,

R.
 
M6.
Completely mechanical but with built in light-meter that you can use or ignore. No need to carry extra loose objects like light meters.
Largest selection of rangefinder framelines for different lenses.
That is; - if you are in it for the pictures.
If you are in this for the Leica mythos, get an older nostalgic model.
 
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